PIP Decision Maker AMA

[Owmyback]

What do you want to know

Why do you think around 60% of decisions get overturned on Appeal (stats from the CAB I work at)

Does anything happen when a decision is clearly wrong. Or does the claimant need to complain?

My mums report said her medication was over the counter (it's not) and that she walked down the street to the room unaided. Which also isn't true.

Mum got her award and got it back dated, but i wanted to know how this can happen and what happens when a report is so wrong?

In my experience lack of evidence to begin with. A lot of people only send in the evidence needed when they ask for an MR or it goes to appeal.

When a report is clearly wrong you have to complain to the assessors we don't have any control over what they put in the report initially unless we know it to be untrue in which case we do send it back for a rework and quite often we disagree with them and we do try our very best to get the best outcome for everyone.

How do you feel when you get a report that practically claims an applicant abseils in from a helicopter, does a seven minute Busby Berkely dance routine, turns three back flips and lands on the chair whilst crying out 'I FEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEL GOOD', but the applicant is actually missing limbs or puking their guts up from Chemotherapy at the time?

Mine was due to assessor clearly lying and clicking the incorrect boxes, can say they see this all the time, why do they do this?

As we're not at the assessment we have to take what's written down as true unless we have evidence that says otherwise or it's quite clear the report is 'all over the place' or the illness is quite clear that they would not present in that way in which case we would send it back with questions or we would phone the customer and ask questions.

Do you ever feed back to the person writing the reports about what is or is not appropriate?

I was initially turned down for PIP because even though my right leg has severe problems causing mobility issues and everyday pain which causes various everyday limitations; my left leg is fine 🤦🏻‍♀️

If the assessor lied you have to take that up with the assessment providers as they're a separate company and have their own complaint procedure. We do quite often send the reports back though for rework as we know things aren't quite right.

What medical qualifications do you have to have to be an assessor?

Are the mandatory reconsideration letters deliberately patronising and rude to try and shame people from going to appeal? Because unless it's deliberate, that template needs re-writing.

(Writing from the perspective of having claim rejected, rejected again at MR - then upheld, backdated and fixed for ten years at appeal...with no additional evidence submitted.)

We can't feed back to the specific person it gets sent back to the assessment providers and someone else looks at it. They may speak to the original person I'm not entirely sure if they do or not. I would hope they do especially if they got multiple ones sent back for the same person.

I don't know what medical qualifications they need to have. We don't have to have medical qualifications just training. However it's much better to have us as a buffer in between their decision and the final decision believe me.

We have no control over the letters and how most of it is worded unfortunately.

'Why do you think around 60% of decisions get overturned on Appeal (stats from the CAB I work at)'

Yes this is astounding, if a service is so bad that 60% of the time they are proven wrong it surely indicates it isn't for for purpose.

I always wonder how as most come from professional caring backgrounds they cope with trying to catch vulnerable, ill people out and say they aren't being honest. Does it get to you op?

If an assessor is dealing with an issue which is clearly complex and beyond their expertise, do you call for evidence from their doctors?

Why do you take the assessors report over any other evidence, even if it strong and contradicts the assessors report?

I have autism and have trouble speaking when I’m anxious. I couldn’t answer some of the questions due to mutism and indicated that my partner could speak. He started speaking and the assessor yelled “she must answer herself” even though there was nothing saying that my support person couldn’t speak for me. We had previously spoken about what I wanted to respond so he would have spoken accurately. Also we live together so he is well aware of my difficulties.

I tried really to answer the questions because of what she had said, frequently stuttering and having to pause, asking her to repeat questions and slow down because I couldn’t process the words so quickly.

The written report states that I had no obvious difficulties with communication, was able to clearly understand the question and give fluid verbal responses. On my form I had written plenty about my issues with speech, communication and processing delay and needing assistance with verbal communication, all of which were consistent with the interview.

Therefore, how did I end up with a report that stated that opposite? I felt like I was made out to be a liar so was too scared to appeal as I did not want to face anyone else.

Yes it does get to me sometimes especially when there is clear evidence or certain conditions don't need much evidence and you know how it impacts on people so you can clearly see the report is just sloppy. That's the reason why we're the buffer and it's so much better than just letting the assessor make the absolute final decision.

Yes we can phone and speak to your doctor, CPN, social worker etc and get more evidence and we quite often do.

Sometimes certain evidence isn't as strong as people think it is. A diagnosis isn't reflective of how it impacts on your daily life. Everyone is different.

In response to the autism question and the assessor yelling...all I can say is I'm sorry that happened and unfortunately there are horrible people and we don't have any control over an assessor and what they're like with people at assessments.

Doesn't it upset you knowing that you're part of a system that is not fit for purpose and relies on a person's ability, or inability, to complete forms rather than their actual needs? And that this system is pushing disabled people into poverty and has been responsible for an estimated 17,000 deaths?

I accompanied someone to an assessment who, amongst other conditions, has a severe learning disability. They were told they could not have a home visit and that they must attend an assessment centre or their PIP would be cancelled. When they did attend the assessment their PIP was cancelled as it was decided that their learning disability did not impede day to day function as they were able to attend an assessment centre. It was also decided that their mobility problems were not severe enough to warrant support as they had been able to use public transport to attend and walked up four steps to get into the assessment room. They also "answered the assessors questions" so did not need support with social interactions as apparently mumbling "don't know" counts as meaningful interaction.

I guess my main question is, how do you sleep at night?

'We don't have to have medical qualifications just training'

2 weeks training?

When an assessor makes errors, not lies per se, but clearly doesn't have any understanding or knowledge of correct medical terminology that impacts a claim and subsequently a complaint is submitted, do they get told to do some further study so they understand basic terminology? Do you have regular appraisals?

Yes I do have a chip on my shoulder I have a disabled relative and every assessor I've met just don't seem up to the job tbh.

Why do you think you're more qualified than a medical professional to determine whether somebody is capable of working?