Please help me understand the transgender issue

[Flippetydip]

I fully admit that I don't understand this issue fully at all. I consider myself fairly liberal but I do not feel that this is fair. It seems to be the Emperor's new clothes. The fact that the comments towards JKR on Twitter are so full of vitriol does not persuade me towards the thinking of those shouting them.

So my questions:

Emma Watson saying on Twitter
"Transwomen are who they say they are"
If I say I am a size 8, intellectually brilliant woman, does that make me so? (Currently size 12, edging towards a 14 and intellectually fairly mediocre).

What is the difference between appropriation of sex and appropriation of race?
If I say I am black and I'm not, why is that so horrific, and yet if I am a man and say I'm a woman, that is OK?

Why is JKR wrong to say that women menstruate? Surely that is just biological fact.

Well for one, not all woman menstruate.

But I imagine this is a goady post...

Yes, yes it was. Because anyone with eyes can read for themselves that JKR saying that "people who menstruate" are called women.

Not that to be a woman you must menstruate.

Why lie and distort when it's right there to see?

Sally872 women who menstruate is theoretically offensive to transmen - although typically it's tw who are being shouted about. Wonder why...

You say you don't see any harm to living as women and the issue is men pretending to be trans - can you define what you mean by trans (i.e. what is the real trans that don't worry you IYSWIM)? Because in many cases as far as I can see there is no clear line between the two as the definition of trans has become incredibly broad.

The "people who mensturate" issue is weird because I cant understand how "women who mensturate" would be insensitive to a trans woman.

I really recommend reading up on Kenny Ethan Jones for insight into what it’s like to menstruate as a man. He really explains his feelings about in a clear and accessible way. His Instagram account has links to things he has said before, or you can google his name and periods and you’ll find it.

It’s astonishing how far down a rabbit hole we are that there is apparently another side to the argument men are not women

It would be much easier if we could separate gender and sex for good and say that woman/women refers to gender, man/men refers to gender, female refers to sex, male refers to sex

It might be “easy” but it wouldn’t solve anything

It wouldn’t give a word that describes the group “adult human females” and leaving that group without a language to describes itself means it’s harder to fight for or discuss rights for that group

It wouldn’t help the “transwomen are biological females” peddlers

Sex segregated spaces would be referred to as male/female rather than women’s/men’s eg the male 100m final rather than the men’s final, the female prison rather than the women’s prison. Or sex segregation would be abolished. Easy, but...fuck easy. It wouldn’t address the arguments on either side for sex segregation vs gender segregation. Should the changing room be women’s or female?

It wouldn’t help people who regard gender as a political and social tool used to construct a hierarchy of oppression with men (dispassionate, reasonable, logical, leaders) at the top and women (hysterical, emotional, illogical, good at making sandwiches and buying birthday presents) at the bottom. It might give succour to “gender is a fun identity” believers, but that may not help wider society. It wouldn’t help gender non conforming people, which includes almost all women as the number of women who “identity” with the stereotypes of the female sex are ridiculously small. They would no longer be able to call themselves “women” but be forced to admit to being comfortable with the oppression forced in them by gender or do without a word to describe themselves AT ALL. The more I think about it the less”easy” it seems

Accepted trans women as natal woman isn’t just about being kind and accepting. If it were only about that then I would very happily step aside. It’s about skewing statistics and losing single sec spaces that keep our children safe.

We now have women making up a portion of recorded violent sex crimes. In the future when this data is analysed statisticians are going to scratch their heads as to why women suddenly became so violent. We have women refuges in a position where they could be forced to accept women with penises alongside women who have been raped and tortured by men with penises. Then you will have sex segregated toilets being legally accessed by women with penises, women’s changing rooms accessed by women with penises..... hopefully you get my point.

twitter.com/godblesstoto/status/1270875089161072640

@zscaler - thanks for the links, but unless I'm missing it, they don't answer the questions I've asked.

They talk about discrimination towards transpeople, which is obviously wrong on every level. I get that but they don't answer the "I am what I am because I say I am" or "I can't be black if I'm white but I can be a woman if I'm a man" questions. And that is really what I want to understand.

She was talking about biology not gender.

People who menstruate are biologically women. That is what she said. That is biological fact.

To understand OP you will have to cancel what you actually believe and replace that belief with the idea that TWA(in all ways)W. Unless you can force yourself to believe this untruth then you will never understand. Of course this is difficult to do when you have gone nearly your entire life believing that sex is a biological thing that cannot be changed.

@PrimalLass - OK that's persuaded me even less to the argument. "A woman is a person who identifies as a woman. that's it" (sic)

It is what it is because I say it is? That's like the reasoning of a 5 year old.

there is no material difference between transgenderism and transracialism, except what some have decided is unacceptable. In fact there is more biological certainty around sex than race, race is more socially constructed, yet claiming to be a different sex is more acceptable

What sex you are is black and white, so to speak. You're either a man or a woman, male or female. But races can mix to reproduce, so there become "shades" of race.

A mixed race person with 1 white and 3 black grandparents (or with 1 black and 3 white) grandparents could appear as white or black, or "mixed". And that same person could identify as something other than how they appear.

Take MM for example - she's been criticised as looking too white, and has said herself she can "pass for white" when looking for acting roles. I think she's 50% white, 50% black, but has chosen to identify as black. Her choice.

You can surgically alter your genitals, but you can't chose the sex you were born as. That is currently medically not possible.
However, in some instances, you can chose what race you present yourself as.

OP - if you look at the current UK legislation (not the self identification controversy), you may gain a better idea as to why the law regards trans men as men and trans women as women

Not just ‘believing’ that biological sex is an actual thing. Knowing. It is material reality.

It is legally possible to change sex

Just saying !

Men - those people who produce sperm and do not possess a uterus - do not menstruate.

Transmen - who are females, and have a uterus - may menstruate.

That's in response to whomever is inaccurately discussing men having periods. They don't.

@Aridane - not meaning to be obtuse, can you point me in the right direction to look at this please? I seem to get lost with googling.

Thanks

You nailed it OP.

It's so ridiculously simple I think most people must assume they are missing some vital piece of information and therefore err on the side of caution and support the TWAW propaganda mantra.

It is legally possible to change sex

But that doesn’t make it a biological reality.

[quote Flippetydip]@PrimalLass - OK that's persuaded me even less to the argument. "A woman is a person who identifies as a woman. that's it" (sic)

It is what it is because I say it is? That's like the reasoning of a 5 year old.[/quote]
Exactly. We are meant to LIE about what is in front of us.

It's possible for a legal fiction to exist that a person has changed sex.

It is not possible for humans to change sex.
Sex is immutable.

I want to know what will happen in the future with healthcare such as mammograms, cervical smears and prostrate checks. I assume a generic letter will be sent out asking if the patient is a ‘cervix haver ‘ or some other linguistic tomfoolery.

We’ve already been categorised according to our secretions #menstruator #lactator #ejaculator and so on. I guess it will be organs next.

they don't answer the "I am what I am because I say I am" or "I can't be black if I'm white but I can be a woman if I'm a man" questions. And that is really what I want to understand

Well, what do you think? Why so keen to substitute someone else’s opinion for your own? You aren’t asking what 2+2 makes or what time the bus is due. you are asking what faith you should be. You need your own answer. Use the evidence of your eyes and your lifetime of accumulated knowledge and think about what YOU believe to be true

Nearly every thread on here now is about trans so it's not difficult to understand.