You're white you cannot experience racism 3

[PatricksRum]

And it continues. Thank you for those black people who took the time to share their stories once again.

@Whataloadofshite @BeforeIPutOnMyMakeup @CandyLeBonBon @WokeUpSmeltTheCoffee
Thank you all.

You’ve quoted the figure for BAME students there, not black. For black students I think it’s around 2.5%. still above the population odds, work it out and so B and AME are separate causes. Everyone reserve your strength for YOUR OWN TIME. The B is separate from the AME.

wokeup - the reason i addressed the question to the OP is she has repeatedly emphasised focussed on Black as being the key marker and dismissed any other minority groups so it seems reasonable to ask her exactly who she is referring to.

IME in recent years there has also been a movement to refer to anyone as non-white as black i.e asian, hispanic etc. This isclearly not the OPs standpoint so I am simply asking for more clarity.

I agree racists are able to identify a black person but IME they are not paricularly fussy if that person is black, asian, arab or any other group that is not like them!

I was going to report the person attacks towards me and other posters but I want them there. It proves my point better than I ever could.

*I have;
I have no idea what you mean.
Black people = black people.
I don't understand.
Maybe someone can help me understand this question?

get the children off their soapboxes; it's not you Greta is it? Answer the bloody question; grown up enough to post an inflammatory thread, big girl enough to answer the question.*

Again this speaks volumes. I shan't even report.

I don't want this to be derailed even further, I just ask that you don't make ill informed, uneducated comments about nomadic peoples.
Sure as is your right.

Zebras

Your interpretation of the death in custody figures is provocative and wrong

The correct comparison is with deaths in the general population because that exposes the issue that black people are more likely to be in prison in the 1st place

Another huge issue you are missing is that most deaths in custody are suicides not homicides. We are talking about violence to black people by police so suicide is largely not relevant.

These are thankfully such rare events that we don't really need stats. There's a Wikipedia page listing all the dead peoples names if you want to look. This will show that there are hardly any instances where a white person has been killed by police and many where black people have. Mainly men. Many of them mentally ill.

What do people think to the following statement "white people are trash" ?

I'd like to gauge opinion please before I explain more, for context it's a direct quote from someone I know.

I agree racists are able to identify a black person but IME they are not paricularly fussy if that person is black, asian, arab or any other group that is not like them!*

They are. Black people are the most oppressed in so many circumstances.

*What do people think to the following statement "white people are trash" ?

I'd like to gauge opinion please before I explain more, for context it's a direct quote from someone I know.*
Racial prejudice. I don't condone it.

patricks - my understanding was that many slaves from the transatlantic slave trade originated in sub saharan africa hence my suggestion of a possible definition. I accept that my knowledge on this is not comprehensive so apologise if I am barking up the wrong tree.

Please can you give your definition of black for the purposes of this conversation.

The Oxford quote also said British people. They do have over see,s Bame students and they have not been included and I expect that will include black people. But what is this SA in the 1980,s (Black, White and colourds??)

patricks - it really doesn't look good to play racism top trumps.

[quote qweryuiop]@Hearhoovesthinkzebras

I've never considered it before, but it's actually a false dichotomy we're setting up there. We don't collect data for "black working class boys," which would be what we would have to compare with data for "white working class boys."

With the data we do collect, we would need compare "white boys" with "black boys."[/quote]
It's been a while since I was a school governor and involved in data scrutiny. From memory, the specific data for white working class boys was looked at because it became apparent that they had been underperforming for a very long time -its possible to identify this from other data such as GCSE attainment, Progress 8 scores, destination post 16, destination.post 18 etc. All.of which is tracked. Just as the trend for white working class boys to underperform was picked up I presume that if any other group were underperforming then it would be picked up accordingly.

Certainly in the school that I was at we looked at many many cohort's. BAME children, underprivileged children, liked after children, English as a foreign language children, girls, boys, children with an SEN but we also cross referenced the data so we could look at BAME boys with an SEN, as an example.

We should be monitoring across all services though. We should be considering barriers to education, to access to healthcare, all things that contribute to poorer outcomes for some sections of society.

Where I struggle is to see quite how these inequalities can be identified and solved for only one group of people.

I know the op wants to only focus on black people but take healthcare for example. I should imagine one of the fundamental barriers to being able to access healthcare would be not being able to speak English.

Different communities will face different barriers that effectively contribute to inequality. How do we choose between them and decide to abandon some because at this point in time they don't affect black people?

I am really struggling with this whole concept. I am wholeheartedly 100% with the black community. No question about that. If what they are asking for is for us to ignore the rest of the AME community then no, I'm not prepared bro do that but that doesn't mean that I won't fight for the black community and what changes they need.

@PatricksRum

You and right, the two experiences are not the same. The trauma you have suffered is incomparable.

I don’t see many people arguing that point. Only a person with no empathy whatsoever could fail understand that it’s is not the same.

Name changed for this because taken with other of my posts it would be outing

@Flaxmeadow

Fuck off!

I work and live close to central Bradford.
I regularly eat in restaurants on Leeds Road Manningham, and the town centre.
I go to an Asian owned beauty parlour which caters for Asian women primarily- I’ve had the same standard of care and treatment I would anywhere else.
I live in a predominantly South Asian neighbourhood.
I shop at Asian fabric shops.

Nobody is stopping me doing these things.

I’m white.

I don’t deny that there aren’t areas of Bradford that are predominantly South Asian, and predominantly white, but the idea that you are PREVENTED as a white woman from doing things? Give me a break.

Tell you what I have seen though. I’ve seen South Asian and Roma families getting shit in the street in the city centre and on the bus from white racists.

*patricks - my understanding was that many slaves from the transatlantic slave trade originated in sub saharan africa hence my suggestion of a possible definition. I accept that my knowledge on this is not comprehensive so apologise if I am barking up the wrong tree.

Please can you give your definition of black for the purposes of this conversation.*

I'm not sure I can. It's difficult because so much of our history is erased.
My grandma is a black woman from the Caribbean.
It could be that my dna is made up of many places.
To look at her she is very clearly black. She has a Caribbean accent. She has black features. She is black.
For example, Indians can be very dark but they know they aren't black.

patricks - it really doesn't look good to play racism top trumps.
A lot of your posts don't look good.
Unfortunately when the thread is being derailed with whataboutery top trumps comes into play.

@LumaLou
Thank you. I agree with you entirely.

@Pugdoglife it's a hideous phrase. It's bigoted.

@BradfordLass
Thanks so much for your post. It's interesting to hear from the people mentioned in the whataboutery posts.

Zebra why is it so hard for you to acknowledge that BAME people are not some homogeneous mass and there are some issues that affect some and not others so need to be campaigned about separately

Black people face some specific problems that Asian and other ME communities don't

I went to Cambridge to study medicine
There were loads and loads of Asian and Chinese people there
There were no black people

Asian Drs are very very common
Black Drs are much more unusual
Those you do find usually did not qualify in the UK

@AMemeByAnyOtherName Fair response. Many openly racist views, and many ignorant views, have been rightly called out on this thread.

I think @Wizadorawobble, as well as yourself, and @PatricksRum, and others, have all shared experiences of racism which have reminded me that it's not a minor issue, as much as I wish it were.

I do feel that the thread title and some posts are asking for conflict, but I respect the right to Patricks to do so. It's not as if AIBU isn't filled with goadyness all of the time!

I have felt frustration seeing new posters turn up and say the same racist and ignorant things over the last 24 hours. It's bound to be only a very small part of the frustration that Patricks feels about this thread, and barely a drop in the ocean of what all people experiencing racism feel about the microaggressions and other experiences of racism in this every day lives.

The correct comparison is with deaths in the general population because that exposes the issue that black people are more likely to be in prison in the 1st place

First off, it's not my comparison. It's official data and official conclusions.

Secondly, I acknowledged that black people are over represented within the prison population and the reasons why absolutely need to be examined.

Thirdly, how is it not relevant to study custodial deaths within the context of the number of people in prison? What does it tell you by studying percentage of deaths against total population? That doesn't tell you that black people are over represented within the prison population. It tells you nothing about the number of people in prison, just the number who have died.

Yes, black people are over represented in prison but in prison they are dying at a lower percentage than white people.

You can't just say that's incorrect. It isn't incorrect. You may wish to disregard that statistic but it doesn't make the statistic wrong.

Examining why black people are over represented in prison is very important but that isn't the same as looking at the number of people who die in prison.

Have a look at the data. It compares many different statistics.

I have already told you that I did look at the data. I did it on gov.uk no a BBC report

Answer my point about suicides being the majority of deaths in custody

@qweryuiop
Thank you for your post.
I think the longer someone spends on this thread the mods you can see why I'm frustrated with the last point you made