You're white you cannot experience racism 3

[PatricksRum]

And it continues. Thank you for those black people who took the time to share their stories once again.

@Whataloadofshite @BeforeIPutOnMyMakeup @CandyLeBonBon @WokeUpSmeltTheCoffee
Thank you all.

@Siameasy

zebras What’s wrong with BLM being just about Black people? I thought that was the point?? Hence the name.

There's nothing wrong with it. Equally there's nothing wrong with other people wanting to support an end to all racism is there?

Yet if you say that you stand for and to racism for all BAME people you are called racist, or as op called me last night, s white supremacist.

It was as part of an article in the telegraph. Ok it’s a bit childish but he was arguing against banning them! And he was not the prime minister then.

Who is allowed to mock religious garb? Anyone? No-one? Grey area?

Patricks has just dismissed someone's view on the basis that she is not in America. However she is also stating that this is 'her time' based on events in America. She can't have it both ways.

I remain interested in hearing why she feels that the biggest threat to her as a black woman in the threat of being murdered by a white person in a racially motivated killing. Statistically this doesn't bear any examination. If she were to be focussing on being paid less, more likely to live in poverty, more likely to be discriminated against at work, more likley to die in childbirth, more likely to be racially abused or a million other terrible examples of discrimination that the UK black community are subject to then she may make more sense but as it is she is raging about and comes back to time and again her fear on a daily basis of being murdered by a white person because of her race. I remain interested to know why she has this fear as my understanding is that like all women in the UK she is far greater risk of being murdered by her partner or husband than by anybody else, let alone a racially motivated stranger murder.

Sorry phones playing up,

The only hierarchy I am aware of isn't anything to do with race it's to do with control and money and we are ALL at the bottom.

*I asked you what hierarchy op.

I can't have an opinion because I don't know what hierarchy you are talking about.

I asked you, you ignored me*

The hierachy of power.

@WakeAndBake
No-one.

Didn’t he write (in an article supporting the right to wear a niqab/burqa) that they looked like daleks and letterboxes? Hardly a ‘disgusting’ view.

Yes he did. You don't find that a disgusting view and think it's like disagreeing with hipsters?

I have no words.

No. You said on your other threads that this whole fight is only about black people and excludes other AME. That the BLM movement is only about black people and excludes AME people. You have not once said "only on this thread". Why lie? Why pretend you haven't said what you said?
That's right. This fight is only about black people.
I have said on this thread many a time.

OP set up the title of the thread to invite debate.

She made a controversial statement so that people might disagree and then they might hear her counter argument on why her statement is true and thus she might hope to change their minds.

She is saying there is a difference between racial prejudice and systemic racism. That might be a new argument to some people. I had heard it before but not really understood it until now
Maybe have a think about it?

She is saying that whilst other groups experience predjudice and in some cases racism there are specific aspects of racism to black people that don't apply to all others.
I explained in a number of posts why those specific racist stereotypes about blacks people being stupid but also strong, criminal and violent might lead to their having a higher chance of being killed.
UK as well as US statistics bear that out.

However people seem unable to hear her argument and they start to be very excessively defensive and to put her down for making mistakes with bold or for her tone.

That in itself is interesting

The concept of White Fragility helps to understand why that might happen
I found it a very useful concept and I felt it does apply to me.

Actually aren,t working class white boys at the bottom of the education HIERACHY AT THE MOMENT IN UK? (afrocarribeans com close but nigerians do quite well isn,t that right.
No.
You are twice as likely to go to Oxford University if you are white than if you are black.

The hierachy of power.

What hierarchy of power do we have in the UK?

How is it stratified?

Also given that it seems to have become the very nub of the discussion, maybe the OP could define EXACTLY what she means by black.

Well there you go, where your ethnicity is in the local hierarchy depends on where you are. You are not always at the bottom and, similarly, white people are not always at the top.
I am.
You are.

I am thoroughly confused as to how you managed to come to that conclusion through what I said

Because you've made several comments now that show you have complete ignorance about the issues nomadic people face.

Of course saying that because you have an accent or because you were once called while trash is silly when talking about true racism. I could see other posters handled those comments perfectly well. My only comments on these threads have been in response to posts about Travellers and Roma.

@Hearhoovesthinkzebras
I'll ask again, how can you spot a gypsy by their face alone?

Not necessarily if your from a working class family though patricks rum. Class does matter.

@ qweryuiop

So no-one is allowed to say that they think religious attire looks stupid?! Not even comedians in a club?

Should religious people be allowed to publicly disapprove of clothing they find offends their sensibilities? Not even imams in a mosque?

I am beginning to understand that this is not a case of passionate misunderstandings but instead this is just an onslaught of pathological ignorance. I do sincerely hope, without a shred of sarcasm, that if there is a horrific incident that affects a white minority in the future and somebody from this thread crumbles and attempts to shout about it, that they are faced with a lot more understanding and compassion, even if they don't phrase everything as perfectly as they should. This is exhausting. If it was really about how OP poorly worded what she said, then the coherent explanations from myself and others like me would have meant something to those who are complaining. But you're just not going to stop. You have a point to make and you will just not let people talk about their own anger and fears unless they include every other minority in every sentence they type. Nothing I've said that is actually relevant to racism towards black people has even been acknowledged by those on a mission to complain about the thread title. I can't understand how that is appropriate at all.

@Railingsohno
Great post. Thank you.

Thank you for posting. I've been trying to argue this point, unsuccessfully, with op across two threads now

I've been reading and nodding along a lot of what you and other posters have been saying.

That's right. This fight is only about black people.

Exactly. So why say you meant only this thread?

I am not joining a fight that is for only one group. Do you have no comment on the post about Roma people being slaughtered right now? Not even an acknowledgement of what that poster said?

I am white and have experienced prejudice towards me from black people.

BUT

I recognise that this is not the same as the racism experienced by my black husband. It is not equivalent

It is not the same as watching your black heavily pregnant mother beaten by police for refusing to get up off a bus seat for a white passenger.

It is not the same as having faeces and petrol bombs through your door as a child.

It is not the same as being told you are stupid and will never amount to nothing by teachers.

It is not the same as being chased home from school everyday and beaten up because of the colour of your skin.

It is not the same as being stopped and strip searched in the back of a police van as a young child for walking to the shop.

It is not the same as being called aggressive for just speaking back against injustice.

It is not the same as having bananas thrown at you or monkey noises made at you walking down the street.

It is not the same as not being refused entry to a venue based on the colour of your skin (when all your white friends who are less well dressed are allowed in).

It is not the same as being called a black bastard for challenging a person who has nearly run you and your child over due to their dangerous driving.

It is not the same as being arrested by the Police for being beaten up by a group of white people.

It is not the same as being arrested by the Police for calling them when someone has run into the back of your car.

It is not the same as being arrested by Police for calling them when a group of white people on drugs (found on them by police) have attacked you on your own street.

It is not the same as being stopped and searched by Police on the school run with 3 children under 4 because you fit the profile for a burglary (oh you mean black and male, must be him then with the double buggy and the child in school uniform).

It is not the same.

These experiences were all in the UK.

Black lives matter. We should be listening.

I hear you OP.

Enough of the what about.

wokeup - the reason people aren't listening to the OP's argument is that she isn't putting forward an argument. Many posters yourself included have put forward actual structured arguments and information and in the main people have engaged with these. The OP on the other hand has a tendency to make broad sweeping statements, contradicts herself is unclear in her meaning and has a tendency to misunderstand, deliberately or otherwise, what people are posting. As i have said before the conflict with the OP has mainly come from her posting style and she also has difficulties with social communication which may well contribute to this.

@WokeUpSmeltTheCoffee
Thank you dearly for your informative posts.
For trying to tirelessly get through to those insisting to derail and use whataboutery.

@lemonsandlimes123

While it is true that racially motivated killing is unlikely for anyone individual black person in the UK, it is more likely for black people.

This is like saying it's unlikely that any individual 40 year old will die of Covid, but it is more likely for people with asthma.

It's human to have an emotional reaction which doesn't match the statistics. It's why we're most people are more scared of plane crashes than car crashes - they kill less people but create a bigger impact when we hear of them. So the OP and others are perfectly entitled to their feelings, whatever statistics say. You don't have to think that their feelings are accurate, but you also don't have to criticise them for having opinions.

While I'm on statistics...UK: 12% of police incidents involving force are against black people, even though they only make up 3.3% of the UK population. I learnt that today. It shows that while the UK doesn't have the same problems as the US, it has a problem.