You're white you haven't experienced racism 2 *title amended by MNHQ at OP's request*

[PatricksRum]

I started a thread in the early hours.

I fell asleep
I've checked the thread and it's full.

Whilst the thread sadly proves my OP, there were a lot of great posts and understanding by some MNers.

I think this discussion is so important and I'd like to continue.

These photos sum up the ridiculous responses.

Do not tell me I am doing my oppressed race a disservice
Your racial prejudice faced as a white person do not trump the daily racism and fear for our lives

Finally, if your response to this is to explain your tiny grievances of racial prejudices you've faced then you are wholly part of the problem.

The racist behaviours and thoughts by your people is the problem. It is your duty to understand and tackle it. I repeat, it is not the duty of black people to educate you.

@bettybeans

I absolutely agree, BLM deserves the focus right now. They should be the ones sharing their experiences.

I just happen to think that this can be done without denying or erasing anyone else's experiences at the same time.

@Millicent10

I’ve heard quite a few radio phone-ins this week about the Black lives matter protests. There seemed to be a common theme that black people felt that they were perceived as threatening and suffered lots of racist incidents such as other people crossing the road to avoid them, reporting them to the police for not a lot, clutching their bags tight (basically making assumptions that they might be criminals). I just wondered where other races fit into this? Is this movement purely about how black people are treated by white people, how anyone black is treated by anyone else or is it about how anyone non-white is treated by white people? Unfortunately there is racism out there against BAME people (recently there has been an increase in racism against Chinese people with racists using coronavirus as an excuse).

Your post really sums up the point I've been trying to make.

I will stand up against racism, as much as I'm able to do. I'll challenge it when I see it and I will do my utmost to fight for change systemically as well, but I will be standing up for everyone who experiences racism. Sorry, op, but I'm not just standing up for black people and ignoring racism against every other ethnicity. How, in any way, is that right?

There are many groups of people who experience racism - people from Asia, the Middle East, Latin America, Roma, Travellers, as well as Black people. Their lives matter too and I'll stand up for all of them, not just the one group that you think are important.

I assume you're talking to me in your last post? I'm not white, I'm Indian for one, I'm not at the top of them hierarchy'.*
No. I'm talking to you but not necessarily referring to you. I don't know any poster's ethnicity therefore I refer to (you) being at the top of the hierachy as white people.*

That's especially so, not exclusively so.

Also you are saying all white people are morally inferior just for being white.*
Morally inferior? Where did I say all white people are morally inferior?*

Read the whole definition, don't pick the parts out out of context to fit your agenda.*
I have done. Racism is a complex thing. It cannot be defined by a few words.*

Black people experience far far worse racism than white people.*
Agreed.

That doesn't mean white people don't experience it at all.
It means they cannot experience racism as they are the power holders.
When, and only when, racial prejudices are are added with power can it be racism.
Black people have no power to act upon their racism. We are ruled by white people. You are in the positions of power. We see not.

One persons horrific experience doesn't erase or negate another 'just bad' experience.
Agreed.

Does the horrific experience deserve more attention? Absolutely. But it can get this without trying to claim the other 'just bad' experience never happened.
I never said they didn't happen just that it isn't racism but racial prejudice.*

The racism white people don't experience in the west is systematic, entrenched in society racism, that is exclusive to BAME people. If you said that you'd be absolutely correct and everyone would agree with you.*
They don't experience racism.
I don't need nor want everyone to agree with me but to fight racism using their white privileges.

I don't think OP is concerned with the AME , just the B.
Our movement is Black Lives Matter not BAME lives matter. Black lives are at the forefront.

@SevenOceans

I don't think OP is concerned with the AME , just the B.

Most definitely.

I absolutely agree, BLM deserves the focus right now. They should be the ones sharing their experiences.
Right.

I just happen to think that this can be done without denying or erasing anyone else's experiences at the same time.
I'm not denying or erasing the racial prejudices white people or any other person has faced nor am I condoning it. It's just not what this is about.

I understand 'Black lives matter' doesn't mean other lives don't. I understand that racism against black people isn't saying other people dont suffer racism, abuse, prejudice and bullying. But with this, there's the expressed wish not to mix this message with other known issues. 'Black lives matter' does not negate any other life or render any other issue less important. It's a clear, focused message for a priority issue. I support it.

midwestsummer

Has written some really interesting, constructive posts, op. Why aren't you engaging with them?

Straw, if we had everybody talking about every terrible experience and every time one bad thing happened, we'd never hear enough about anyone or anything. There's a lot of shite to talk about, especially with women.

Point being, this is a real big moment for our women of colour MN pals. They have a lot to say and they're saying it loud. Everyone's paying attention. You don't take that away, silence it or dilute it.

but I will be standing up for everyone who experiences racism. Sorry, op, but I'm not just standing up for black people and ignoring racism against every other ethnicity. How, in any way, is that right?

Their lives matter too and I'll stand up for all of them, not just the one group that you think are important.

You're missing the whole entire point.
I'll post this for the millionth time.

I understand 'Black lives matter' doesn't mean other lives don't. I understand that racism against black people isn't saying other people dont suffer racism, abuse, prejudice and bullying. But with this, there's the expressed wish not to mix this message with other known issues. 'Black lives matter' does not negate any other life or render any other issue less important. It's a clear, focused message for a priority issue. I support it.

@Hearhoovesthinkzebras read this.

*midwestsummer

Has written some really interesting, constructive posts, op. Why aren't you engaging with them?*

I've written some very interesting posts and questions directed towards you.
Why haven't you responded?

I'm confused. OP, when challenged on a word, you turned to a dictionary definition to back up your point a couple of pages back. And yet, the dictionary definition of racism does not encompass your belief that white people can't experience racism.

So do we use the dictionary definitions for things or make up our own? Because either you can rely on a dictionary definition or you can't surely?

@PatricksRum

but I will be standing up for everyone who experiences racism. Sorry, op, but I'm not just standing up for black people and ignoring racism against every other ethnicity. How, in any way, is that right?

Their lives matter too and I'll stand up for all of them, not just the one group that you think are important.

You're missing the whole entire point.
I'll post this for the millionth time.

You don't get to tell me who to stand up for or who to fight for.

You are focusing on black lives because that is what is important to you.

Me? I'll fight against racism.

@Babyboomtastic read my response to this up thread. I'm not repeating it.

Just for full clarifaction OP, is a person of mixed race where part of their heritage is black allowed to be part of the movement ?

You don't get to tell me who to stand up for or who to fight for.
I didn't. You have.*

You are focusing on black lives because that is what is important to you.*
It should be important to you and everyone. Sadly you're overlooking this which means you're complicit.*

Me? I'll fight against racism.*
Good for you

These threads are making me so angry!! Just stop!! You make out what feels to me that white people are racist and white people can not possibly ever suffer racism.

It's just bollocks

@PatricksRum

*midwestsummer

Has written some really interesting, constructive posts, op. Why aren't you engaging with them?*

I've written some very interesting posts and questions directed towards you.
Why haven't you responded?

Do me a favour. It's nearly 5am. I've done nothing but respond to your posts.

You on the other hand have said nothing of interest.

What are your views on George Floyd? On the protests in America and the UK?

Respond to the constructive posts asking about areas that can actually improve the situation in America rather than your silly playground insults.

Just for full clarifaction OP, is a person of mixed race where part of their heritage is black allowed to be part of the movement ?
It's not for me nor anyone else to disallow anyone to be part of the movement.
I've said numerous times I want white people to join the movement. If I want white people to join I'm sure you can figure out my opinion on people of mixed heritage.

You make out what feels to me that white people are racist and white people can not possibly ever suffer racism.
White people are racist but not all white people are racist.
White people can't suffer from racism but racial prejudice which is also very wrong.

It should be important to you and everyone. Sadly you're overlooking this which means you're complicit.

Yes racism against all BAME people is important to me. It's abhorrent and I will stand against it. Why do you think that makes me complicit? Complicit in what?