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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to think Dominic Cummings should go/thread 4

999 replies

SophieB100 · 27/05/2020 14:10

New thread to discuss the cummings and goings of the PM's chief adviser.

Previous thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3919707-to-think-Dominic-Cummings-should-go-thread-3

OP posts:
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15
Peregrina · 31/05/2020 17:13

the chances of someone being a Remainer / Labour activist who either reports someone like Cummings or has a go at Johnson is very high - because it's someone with those views who are most likely to do this.

Not necessarily. Some Tory voters will have adhered strictly to the rules and will feel that they have been betrayed, and that Johnson and Cummings have let the side down badly.

Clavinova · 31/05/2020 17:16

collecting children from uni was permitted.

I don't know whether the former chemistry teacher has broken the rules or not - there was obviously a time frame when this was not allowed as he says he waited, "until we were told we could drive anywhere in the country" - but he declined to say when he collected his daughter - fair enough he doesn't have to tell a journalist.

JamieLeeCurtains · 31/05/2020 17:33

Collecting children from university has always been permitted anyway, under two exemptions: moving house; and fulfilling a legal obligation. Also a third under some circumstances: caring for a vulnerable person.

Mumratheevergiving · 31/05/2020 17:41

Clavinova - How can you tell they are 'top scientists' from a list? I recognise a few names but one I have just checked on LinkedIn is a lecturer in her first position.

Time to discredit them too is it?

Here are some names you might recognise then www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/breaking-jenny-harries-joins-fellow-22116332.amp

So what do you think the Government should do when the scientists advising them say the rules are for all and some jointly say Cummings actions are detrimental to public health policy? Surely the Government should respond to them?

Belindabelle · 31/05/2020 17:52

That is an old photograph of Rachel.

I do have a problem with her getting the LBC gig (Reece Moggs’s spot). But as a broadcaster she is classed as a key worker and entitled to travel for work so I don’t have a problem with that.

My husband has been working from home but that will end soon and he will work away Mon_Fri and return home at the weekends as he has done for over 10 years.

Mind you I do know that other radio presenters have been broadcasting from home but maybe Somerset doesn’t have good enough broadband.

Clavinova · 31/05/2020 17:56

JamieLeeCurtains
Collecting children from university has always been permitted anyway

I honestly don't know, perhaps she wasn't at university as such - why did he say that he waited until it was allowed? I've found several posters on other threads 'confess' they have broken lockdown rules;

"Driven across the country twice to collect DC from university, after lockdown began."

moving house
possibly.

caring for a vulnerable person
I assume she is over 18 - she had been studying in Canada and then spent 7/8 weeks in London.

Clavinova · 31/05/2020 17:57

I do have a problem with her getting the LBC gig

She's not very good at it - very unimpressed.

Belindabelle · 31/05/2020 18:05

Women are woefully underrepresented on LBC so initially I was happy that she got the gig even if it was only a one hour slot.

Finally Clavinova I agree with you on something. She is not very good.

FliesandPies · 31/05/2020 18:15

I honestly don't know, perhaps she wasn't at university as such - why did he say that he waited until it was allowed?

So now you suspect his motives because he waiting until it was allowed? Is that right? Really, there's desperate and there's downright ludicrous..

DuncinToffee · 31/05/2020 18:23

It doesn't matter wether or not Mr Lees broke the rules, he is not in the government or involved in making the rules. The important thing is he didn't lie, Cummings was there.

Clavinova · 31/05/2020 18:25

Mumratheevergiving

Unfortunately the Mirror have edited out the question that Dr Harries was asked - difficult to make an informed comment.The headline is not too severe for the Mirror if they are using the word 'subtle.'

So what do you think the Government should do when the scientists advising them say the rules are for all

They should agree of course - but they are maintaining that Dominic Cummings did not break the rules because he had a 'reasonable excuse' at the time. You may not agree with them.

From the police statement -

"Durham Constabulary does not consider that by locating himself at his father’s premises, Mr Cummings committed an offence contrary to regulation 6 of the Health Protection (Coronavirus, Restrictions) (England) Regulations 2020."

"Durham Constabulary have examined the circumstances surrounding the journey to Barnard Castle (including ANPR, witness evidence and a review of Mr Cummings’ press conference on 25 May 2020) and have concluded that there might have been a minor breach of the Regulations that would have warranted police intervention. Durham Constabulary view this as minor because there was no apparent breach of social distancing."

"Had a Durham Constabulary police officer stopped Mr Cummings driving to or from Barnard Castle, the officer would have spoken to him, and, having established the facts, likely advised Mr Cummings to return to the address in Durham, providing advice on the dangers of travelling during the pandemic crisis. Had this advice been accepted by Mr Cummings, no enforcement action would have been taken."

Mumratheevergiving · 31/05/2020 18:30

Clavinova - just a reminder of those you caution may not be top scientists for decrying Cummings

Professor Maggie Rae, president of the Faculty of Public Health,Professor Elio Riboli, Imperial College London,Professor David McCoy, Queen Mary University London,Professor David Hunter, University of Oxford,Professor Trish Greenhalgh, University of Oxford,Mike Gill, former regional director of Public Health, south-east England,Professor Raj Bhopal, University of Edinburgh,Professor Martin McKee, London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine,Professor George Davey Smith, University of Bristol,Professor Ruth Gilbert, University College London,Professor Neil Pearce, London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine,Professor Helen Ward, Imperial College London,Professor Mark S Gilthorpe, University of Leeds and Alan Turing Institute,Professor Adrian Martineau, Queen Mary University London,Professor Allyson Pollock, University of Newcastle,Dr Rochelle Burgess, UCL Institute for GlobalHealth,Professor Paolo Vineis, Imperial College London,Anne Wilson, Liverpool School of Tropical Medicine,Dr Tim Colbourn, University College London,Professor Majid Ezzati, Imperial College London,Professor Deborah Ashby, Imperial College London,Professor Sonia Saxena, Imperial College London,Professor Richard Healey, University of Portsmouth,Professor Deborah A Lawlor, Bristol Medical School,Professor Guiqing Lily Yao, University of Leicester,Dr Nisreen Alwan, Southampton University

You’re right, what the heck could they know between them?

Peregrina · 31/05/2020 18:36

I don't see any 'reasonable excuse' about the Barnard Castle trip.

Nor does any of this alter the fact that others who have broken the rules weren't supposedly ill but they resigned. I don't recall any of them dragging out their resignations for over a week.

Still, if Johnson wants to destroy his credibility, that's up to him.

Roussette · 31/05/2020 18:45

She may have resigned without the coronavirus lockdown - meeting a married lover doesn't go down well in politics if you are found out
Really?
There's a whole list of politicians over the years who were guilty of similar.

Still, if Johnson wants to destroy his credibility, that's up to him
I bet some of his MPs are spitting feathers. Hard won seats and now they've got their constituents hopping mad at them.

I did find it unbelievable that Raab says he had no idea that DC was in Durham, whilst Raab was acting PM. Can this really be true? DC so say was, and is, instrumental in engineering the message to the public, he is Boris's top adviser, Boris is in hospital and Raab had no idea that he was 250 miles away and supposed to be isolating?

If true, I do wonder what this Government is up to. It's like being the Chief Financial Officer of a company and your CEO disappears for two weeks and you don't notice....

DuncinToffee · 31/05/2020 18:50

Raab is probably used to his boss going MIA

Alsohuman · 31/05/2020 18:54

they are maintaining that Dominic Cummings did not break the rules because he had a 'reasonable excuse' at the time. You may not agree with them.

My Tory MP doesn’t either.

Roussette · 31/05/2020 19:03

As over 100 other Tory MPs don't.

monkeyonthetable · 31/05/2020 19:16

To be fair to Raab, if DC was off sick and Raab was abruptly in charge of the country with no Boris and no DC around to advise, he probably had more pressing things to deal with that where DC was recovering.

Peregrina · 31/05/2020 19:19

Perhaps Raab had read the Spectator article and took it at face value?

Mumratheevergiving · 31/05/2020 19:19

Nor does Theresa May.
How about you Clavinova do you personally believe he didn’t break the rules?

Peregrina · 31/05/2020 20:01

That well know Remainer (cough, cough) Peter Bone thinks he should go.

Clavinova · 31/05/2020 20:13

The scientists might be right - but unfortunately every time I see
Professor McKee's name I am reminded that he is an anti-Brexit activist and ardent Tory government/Boris Johnson critic;

"NHS for a People's Vote is run by Professor Martin McKee (Programme Director)"

www.nhsforpv.co.uk/core_team

Several 'usual suspects' - Professor Trisha Greenhalgh and Professor Allyson Pollock, here in the Guardian 2015;

"The signatories to the letter include;Trisha Greenhalgh, professor of primary care at Oxford; Martin McKee, professor of European public health"...

www.theguardian.com/society/2015/apr/07/more-than-100-top-doctors-attack-government-record-on-nhs

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/generalelection/general-election-2015-100-leading-doctors-sign-letter-accusing-government-of-withering-away-nhs-in-10160947.html

How about you Clavinova do you personally believe he didn’t break the rules?

I don't think he broke the rules going to Durham in the first place (as per the police statement) - I can believe that DC's wife persuaded him to drive to Barnard Castle to test his eyesight because she fancied a drive out on her birthday - therefore his motive might be genuine but not hers. Either way, I don't think he should lose his job over it.

FliesandPies · 31/05/2020 20:17

I can believe that DC's wife persuaded him to drive to Barnard Castle to test his eyesight because she fancied a drive out on her birthday - therefore his motive might be genuine but not hers.

So it's all his wife's fault. Of course! Why didn't he just say so and we could all have moved on by now

Roussette · 31/05/2020 20:19

I can believe that DC's wife persuaded him to drive to Barnard Castle to test his eyesight because she fancied a drive out on her birthday - therefore his motive might be genuine but not hers

This is laughable. Has he got a tongue in his head? Could he have said NO, or are you now saying because it was his wife's birthday, he had no choice. Lol.

Bottom line. According to him, he isolated in a 'cottage' on his fathers esate 250 miles away, whilst his sister delivered food. He could have done that in London with his BIL or niece delivering food. There was no need to drive all that way. He broke the rules.

Clavinova · 31/05/2020 20:25

He could have done that in London with his BIL or niece delivering food.There was no need to drive all that way. He broke the rules.

Durham police have decided that he didn't break the rules here.

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