To feel my employer are suddenly discriminating because I have a young child?

[Tayo23]

I work for a government dpt where it is not usually commonplace to be able to work from home. On 19th/20th March when the schools closed, I was asked in work if this would impact me in regards to childcare - it does, and I was offered a laptop to work from home which I gratefully took.

At this point all my colleagues (except for a minority shielding or in similar positions) remained in the office every day as there were a lack of laptops for them - it was BAU. I worked remotely from home, with colleagues in the office uploading my (and other remote workers) work. A week later my office closed (a non-critical govt dpt) however I have continued to work from home since then although my colleagues without laptops were not working at all. My partner was furloughed a week or so after my office closed so has been a great help keeping 4yo entertained.

At the end of April my office advised those without laptops must return to the office one day a week on a rota basis to upload, (to maintain social distancing). I was not asked because it was understood I was working from home. Last week they provided everyone in my office (around 80 people) with laptops. I have now been told that because everyone else now has a laptop, I am now too required to work one day a week in the office, and spend the rest of the week working from home.

My partner returns to work next week. I now am in same position as end of March before lockdown re childcare. They are allowing me to take special leave for the one day a week I can’t come into the office, for 4 weeks. After then I have to use annual leave. I have repeatedly stressed I am willing to continue working each day from home. I just simply cannot leave my child at home alone. My partner is unable to get paid leave off and we would struggle without his pay.

AIBU to feel this way, they understood initially and accommodated me which I was extremely grateful for. I have worked each day whilst my colleagues barely have done until now, but now they too have the facilities to work from home, the goalposts have been moved.

I am not happy being told when to take AL when I have not asked for any time off. Do I have a leg to stand on here if I take this higher than my own line manager (who robotically regurgitates things without much compassion or consideration for people’s individual circumstances)

Childcare is sorted by being f able to take leave.

The point is, accommodating parents over everyone else, expecting others only to do the shit bit. Cant continue.

If anyone (even those without kids) can't or don't want to go in.....they need to take leave. That same rule applies to you.

Except the ‘shit but’ is actually (in this case) FAR preferable to wfh. My colleagues have literally said they would rather be in the office. I would rather be in the office!

Yes I’ve admitted I will have to take AL and that DP will do too.

Sounds like they are discriminating against the childless because they have given you special treatment so you can stay at home but not given anyone else that favour.

@Tayo23 - it doesn't make sense to say they've spread the work over the week because of social distancing, why not have one person do all the uploading on one day? They're still just as distanced. Also you could have IT write an upload script and just do it that way.

Does it not make sense to have the people who can’t doing something productive (far more productive that whats done in the office) from home instead of doing nothing with leave?

Unless you can persuade your boss of this, it doesn’t matter. You are lucky even to be able to take annual leave on those days. You don’t seem to understand that. Lots of companies wouldn’t allow that for all sorts of reasons. They are bending over backwards to help you, and you are putting up objections. There are workable solutions for your situation, and it’s probably only until nursery reopens.

Of course not trevsadick but by taking leave, whether that be special, annual or unpaid. The parents are still unable to get into the office
So what would be fair to you is other staff having to come more often to the office to cover the shift that you're not covering.

You want to work from home or have special leave, so that when nursery is open and you could start coming in the office, you decide that it's time for you to take your leave so that your colleagues still have to cover your shift.

Can't you see how unfair that would be on them? I'd be curious if my manager allowed this special treatment for one member of the team.

dontdisturbmenow

I’ve literally said several times now that I will take my AL and I realise I have overreacted in regards to taking this.

You all seem to completely ignore the fact that I keep telling you all “my colleagues have literally told me that they would rather be in the office than wfh”. Wfh on our work stream is a really horrible way of working and it’s stressful with very little support in place.

And candyfloss no they haven’t given me special treatment allowing me to work from home and not them coz they are childless. They are wfh too. Mgmt didn’t buy enough laptops so majority of staff stayed at home for 4-5 weeks with no work at all to do on full pay - whilst the parents worked every day. I didn’t complain about this or think it wasn’t fair - they accommodated me by giving it to me yes! But the outrage at it being ‘unfair’ on my colleagues that they weren’t working at whilst on full pay is strange to me. Now they are all wfh too.

No it isn't discrimination. You had allowances made to accommodate your circumstances, which suited the business and the rest of the workforce.

Now the overall situation has changed, and you've no more of a right to not go into the office than any of the other 80 people, which presumably includes other parents.

You've been given the option to use leave, if you want to avoid going in, which is really more than reasonable.

Yes but if you didn't have to leave the office before then you'd be in the same position as them. But because you had childcare issues you had to leave and they accomodated you and now you're complaining about it.

‘You all seem to completely ignore the fact that I keep telling you all “my colleagues have literally told me that they would rather be in the office than wfh”.

That’s all 79 colleagues in your Dept is it? You’ve spoken to each one and they’ve all told you that?

Quite frankly, given the stresses of even trying to get into work right now, given that some of them may have to use public transport, or walk a long distance, plus inevitably touching door handles, Office equipment Etc
You all seem to completely ignore the fact that I keep telling you all “my colleagues have literally told me that they would rather be in the office than wfh”.

What- all 79 other people from your office have told you that?

Quite frankly, getting into work involves any number of stresses right now- public transport/ walking a long distance/ touching door handles, office equipment etc... I find it hard to believe that everyone else happily carried on in the office while you were given the preferential treatment of a laptop to wfh before anyone else

I understand perfectly what discrimination is, and tbh I can’t see how you think your employer is discriminating at all. They’ve bent over backwards to accommodate you, first by allowing you to wfh while others didn’t have that option, and now allowing you special leave for a month so that you don’t have to do what everyone else is doing, one day a week in the office.

Meanwhile, you seem to gloss over the fact your dh’s employer sounds as though they are discriminating, and you seem to assume that your employer should almost ‘step up’ to allow for the fact that your dh’s employer sounds a bit rubbish. That sounds to me like a classic case of a woman making the assumption that the father can’t be expected to take equal responsibility for children.

Of course it’s not about treating everyone exactly the same- the number of patronising posts pointing that out and assuming the rest of us don’t know what discrimination is, is a tad wearisome.
The fact is: you haven’t been treated the same. You were given special treatment at the start, being able to wfh when others weren’t. You’re being given adjustments for the next month to enable you to not have to do the same as your colleagues.

No employer can be expected to let a specific set of adjustments run indefinitely. It’s entirely reasonable that you use annual leave if you aren’t going to be going in one day a week by july or whenever the special leave they’re giving you is up. That’s what your colleagues will have to do if they’re unable to go in, or feel unable due to the issues around getting into work.

Realistically, this is probably hypothetical anyway because some childcare may well have opened up by then to accommodate your needs, or lockdown will have eased enough that you can make other arrangements.

But honestly, Im all for supporting women in the workplace and have personally bent over backwards a number of times when recruiting people to my team to encourage mothers back into the workforce. But I can’t see what your employer is doing wrong here. Are you sure it’s not just sour grapes because your colleagues had time at home not working? That’s a bit ridiculous because they could have been going stir crazy for all you know, and would have opted for a laptop provided by work and a job to get on with if they’d been given that choice from the start

First part of that seems to have repeated

I’ve admitted that I was wrong to think them asking me to take AL was U. Repeatedly.

I haven’t glossed over DP’s employers. I’ve address it. Several times now.

I wasn’t the only person they allowed the wfh and have a laptop too. There was about 30 of us. And no - I haven’t spoken to everyone of the remaining 50. But I’ve probably spoken to 25 of them all in a group chat and that is the general consensus. I’ve also spent quite a lot of time on the phone to several stressed out colleagues helping them with this way of working as our dpt offers very very little support for home working. So I think I have a pretty goood idea that I’m right in thinking they’d rather be in the office. I see the point about public transport though I do - it still doesn’t mean I can get there though. The government took away childcare. And that is why, again, I’ve now said I’m happy to take AL.

People may not be reading the full thread (it’s long tbf) and seem to just be arguing with me for the sake of it now, and I’m repeatedly saying the same things.

Thanks for offering me the perspective I was after. As I’ve said I’ve changed my view on the AL, some other things I haven’t.

In five weeks time, you'll have to take annual leave. In five weeks we will almost be in July. By July, nurseries should have reopened. Your childcare position would be no different than before Covid-19. Your employer has been incredibly reasonable and done far more than they needed to do and far more than a lot of other employers. I think you've been very lucky here to be honest.

You should think about all the poor people (women) who actually are discriminated against
Get a grip

Tbf I did take the time to read the full thread. As I say, I’m very supportive of parents in the workplace so this sort of thread interests me. You said the thread has helped you get perspective so hopefully you can now see that your employer is not discriminating against you.

As for ‘the govt took away my childcare’ - well yes, technically that’s the situation, but it’s a hugely emotive description. The govt has come in for enough criticism for not shutting down nurseries (as well as schools etc) sooner. They can’t win on that one really - damned if they do, damned If they don’t (and no I’m not a Tory voter, I just know that realistically this is a shit situation where there are no winners.) But in all honesty it sounds like your employer handled this quickly, making adjustments for you in the early stages while everyone else was still BAU, and now that the situation has gone on for weeks and weeks they’re quite understandably making a new plan for working

Why is it that parts of what Johnson said in his 'lifting lockdown' speech are quoted as gospel.. whilst other parts are ignored.

Yes he said return to work if you are not able to work from home.

You are. You are also a CS so should be sticking to the letter of the guidance he issued.

Mgmt didn’t buy enough laptops so majority of staff stayed at home for 4-5 weeks with no work at all to do on full pay - whilst the parents worked every day

I'd been wondering about the "other workers doing nothing while on full pay" thing, but this doesn't seem to make sense - surely you're not saying they singled out parents to receive the laptops?

Unless, I suppose, they wanted to make it easier for parents to WFH, knowing childcare would make it harder for them to get to the office?

You say your boss has no compassion..than who was it that suggested you work from home in the first place due to childcare? Is your 4 year old in reception at school?

@puzzledand pissedoff the OP said she and a ‘minority’ of others were prioritised for laptops and allowed to work from home very early on, while everyone else was still having to go into work. Then when the office was actually closed, the workers without laptops were not able to do any work at all. Then again quite a bit later, enough laptops were sourced for everyone to have one and to be able to wfh.

One of my points earlier was that it seems to be a case of sour grapes from the OP that because she was prioritised for having a laptop, she then ended up working whole others weren’t able to.
Which seems a strange logic to me: ‘I was happy to take my employer up on the adjustments they made for me as a parent, but now I’m peed off about it!’
It also overlooks the fact that colleagues may have been going stir crazy at home... being under employed, having the day stretching ahead of you with no work and only allowed out of the house once a day, as was the case, can actually be hugely stressful. Slightly different scenario but i have a number of friends who are furloughed right now and some of them are really struggling.

If so many others much prefer to work in the office, whu haven't you approached them and suggested a joint approach to your manager where both explain that it suits you both that they do your day in the office so you can work from home? You can do that to immediate effect and don't even need the special leave?

No Caleano no sour grapes at all. As I’ve said I was extremely grateful they accommodated me. And even though some other home workers were actually complaining to our manager that it wasn’t fair they were working when others weren’t - I thought it was completely fair enough - I asked for a laptop - and they gave me one. The only reason I’ve brought up that I was working and they weren’t is because they have all had time ‘off’ from working, which ultimately is what I need in terms of the office now. This post is not about me being pissed off they accommodated me - I am extremely grateful and more than willing and happy to continue wfh. So you’ve missed the point saying that. It was about AL - which I’ve now admitted I will take and that it’s reasonable for them to offer that.

It wasn’t my manager who sorted me the laptop - she was actually off work self isolating at the time and didn’t even know I had one. It was another teams manager.

@dontdisturbmenow - if others were actually preferring to go into the office you’d imagine they might have made that suggestion to the OP.
It leaves me wondering whether the OP is milking that point a tad... of course in group chats, colleagues may well say things like ‘ooh I’m missing the office’, ‘isn’t it hard WFH?’ Etc But I think the OP needs to be careful not to extrapolate from that, that all her colleagues are desperate to be traveling into work! It would be very wrong to make colleagues feel under pressure to take on her day in the office as well as their own.

I’m not saying it’s not a potential way forward but I think the OP should tread carefully. Sometimes discrimination can go the other way and it’s people without young children who can end up feeling obliged to pick up the slack

Op have you pondered that the people who want to work in the office have caused this?

The employer sounds like they are trying to fairly accommodate everyone. Whilst making it fair

If lots if people have expressed they would like to go in. They are also trying to make fair on those that do and those that don't. Employers can rarely win. Some people want to go in say uts good for their mental health and for getting stuff done. So if they don't have everyone do it those that don't will probably moan no one cares about their mental health and use it as an excuse for lack of productivity. If they make everyone do it, apart from those with kids, people who dont want to go will moan.

I think the whole issue is, you first posts just sound like you are saying 'i want it all my own way'

I think its about time people really started thinking about things outside their own house.

@Tayo23 your language about it is really emotive. You say your colleagues ‘had time off from working.’ They didn’t have a choice. Maybe they would have preferred to have had a laptop and to be allowed to wfh early on like you. It’s not ‘time off’ if you’re willing to work but the office is shut and you haven’t been given the means to work from home.

You keep saying it’s not sour grapes but your language suggests otherwise.

Everyone is now able to work- albeit in altered circumstances - and you’re saying you should be allowed ‘time off’ as some sort of recompense for the fact your colleagues were unable to work.

Caelano

if others were actually preferring to go into the office you’d imagine they might have made that suggestion to the OP.

You are assuming that they spoke to 80 employees before telling everyone they have to come in 1 day per week.