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AIBU?

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Original poster

Would you carry on letting grandparents see child after this?

511 replies

Slidetotheleft · 20/05/2020 07:19

DD's (5) father disappeared off the face of the earth 12 months ago. Has paid no maintenance since then. Currently owes over 3k and counting.

DDs grandparents (his parents) know where he is but refuse to tell me. Their argument is that he is trying to rebuild his business/life and cannot do that with the maintenance people on his back. He hasn't even sent DD a birthday card or anything at xmas. The maintenance people cannot find him, his parents know where he is but refuse to tell me and if DD asks them they say they don't know (not sure how long they can carry that on for).

They are currently still seeing DD twice a month (not during lockdown). And speak to her once a week on the phone.

My question is WIBU to say actually whilst you cannot be honest with me or DD I don't want her in your care. I DO NOT want to do this, DD enjoys their company and they love seeing her.

But it really really gets to me that they are happy to see her go without the support she deserves and to actually lie to her face when she asks where her daddy is.

What would you do?

OP posts:
IdblowJonSnow · 20/05/2020 09:08

Are they providing any financial support to help you or DD? This is really tricky. If they are otherwise nice your DD will miss them if she stops seeing them.
Sounds like they know something you dont - could he have another family and really not afford it or have serious debts?
None of this is relevant for you of course, he should still pay.
Do the maintenance people know that they know?

Waveysnail · 20/05/2020 09:11

If they are kind and loving to dgd then of course you should continue contact. Their son will always be their son and thus some loyalty to him or being afraid he will cut contact with them. Please do not make them choose if they are good to your daughter. Grandparents can be such an amazing part of growing up

TheSmelliestHouse · 20/05/2020 09:12

I wouldn't cut her off from her GP if she loves them. But I wouldn't tell her lies. If she asks, let her know GP know where dad is. Also say to them that it's unacceptable that he's prioritising his business over his daughter. Perhaps they might like to lend him the money while he's struggling. Also electoral role great idea.

Babdoc · 20/05/2020 09:13

PPs are being a lot more tolerant than I would have been!
I’m afraid I would have reported them to the authorities for withholding information, and collaborating in evasion of maintenance/tax etc by their son.
And I would have stopped all contact with DD until they either paid their son’s missing maintenance or revealed his whereabouts.
They do not have DD’s best interests at heart - they are actively depriving her of money needed to support her.

Dumbie · 20/05/2020 09:13

@SollaSollew I have a pretty identical experience. My grandparents are very special to me. They were put in a pretty awful situation and it has permanently damaged their relationship with their son. But they have maintained a relationship with their son.

My DGM recalls that it is one of the few times she's seen my DGF cry. It's been very very hard for them.

1981m · 20/05/2020 09:13

Couldn't they tell child maintenance where he is and not you so that they find him and he pays what he should? Could you talk to them about the importance of that?

Viviennemary · 20/05/2020 09:14

Not sure. But they are absolutely in the wrong.

AllsortsofAwkward · 20/05/2020 09:14

DFs will continue to have access even if they arent paying maintenance, the two dont go in hand in and are completely separate. It's the df responsibility not the parents. You would be punishing you're child who has formed a loving relationship with her grandparents on the basis on you're exs self actions. If the contact has been long standing and the grandparents can prove a loving bond has been formed and developed they could challenge that in court whilst they dont have rights thats not to say they couldn't instruct an solicitor to act on their behalf and be awarded something. I think its unnecessary to punish them and you're dd for you're exs actions.

Destroyedpeople · 20/05/2020 09:15

As a grandparent I would be disgusted with my son acting like this and would not enable it.

It's a really tricky one for you. ..

Iwalkinmyclothing · 20/05/2020 09:15

Oh god, op, what a bloody dilemma.

I think JessicaDay has probably given the best advice, but part of me is screaming no, no, these people are liars, these people think so little of their granddaughter that they will facilitate her father running away from his responsibilities to her, these people have already demonstrated that they will prioritise his wants over her needs. I would really struggle with this.

greenlynx · 20/05/2020 09:15

I’m highly suspicious about them being good grandparents and the whole situation. they can’t force their son to see his child but paying the maintenance is very different, it’s his responsibility by law. So I would at least use the lockdown as opportunity for limited supervised contact and challenged them about every lie they would tell. I also would tell the maintenance agency that they know where he is.
But tbh I think the answer at the very beginning is the best, about telling them that “you are rebuilding your lives and don’t want them on your backs”.

Nocaloriesinchocolate · 20/05/2020 09:16

You could argue this way – paternal grandparents have acquired a status because their son is a father. In this case their son is not acknowledging he is a father so they do not have the qualifications to be grandparents.

Chicchicchicchiclana · 20/05/2020 09:16

Whatever you do, do not follow some of the horrendous suggestions on here that you put your 5 year old (5!!) in the middle of this dispute between you and your ex and his parents. Do not passively aggressively "call the GPs out" in front of her, or tell her that the GPs do know where Daddy is but won't tell her. Can you imagine the damage that would do to her little heart? Actually you sound far too measured and sensible from your posts to do anything like that - but I really can't believe some of the suggestions on this thread.

I suppose in your head you could give them all a deadline. Allow the status quo for 6 months or a year and if nothing has changed in that time then gradually reduce contact. Tell the gp that if he wants to prove himself a decent father then he has x months in which to do it.

Do you feel that they genuinely love your dd or are they maybe being coerced by their son into maintaining this relationship for his benefit, and they are too scared/guilty to refuse?

TheNoodlesIncident · 20/05/2020 09:17

Don't tell your DD that her GPs know where her dad is and support his not paying maintenance for her, it's not fair on a little child. It's too complex and she doesn't need to know.

It's really tricky because I would want to say to them that they can't see her any more because they're covering up for them, just because they are colluding with their son's snub to his family. I really would want to, just out of anger and resentment. But at the same time, having a good relationship with her grandparents is definitely in your DD's best interests. And it would hurt her to lose them too, after losing her dad. So I wouldn't.

But god, I'd be raging. Would they make a contribution in lieu of their son's refusal to help pay for his child's upbringing? I think they should, surely a sense of decency would prompt that, as a minimum?

DarkDarkNight · 20/05/2020 09:17

This is so difficult. Either way your daughter misses out.

You could take the high road and continue to let her see her grandparents as it is unfair on her to lose them from her life. I’m not sure in your shoes I could be the bigger person. It would be different if they didn’t know where he was, or were disgusted by his behaviour towards your daughter, but they are supporting and allowing him to not pay for or see his own child. It’s awful behaviour. Why do they not think their son should support his child? Fine, build his business, but this should be alongside paying towards his child. Plenty of people do both.

zingally · 20/05/2020 09:18

Urgh. No.

Phone conversations occasionally, maybe. Face to face in person, Not. A. Chance.

How can they look into the face of an innocent child, and know, and be complicit in the fact that her father has completely washed his hands of her and all responsibility?

OP, I'd be livid. Have you told the maintenance people that they know where he is, but refuse to say?

If it were me, I'd be saying, "you can either pay your son's debts for him, tell me where he is, or have no contact with the child. Your choice."

HoppingPavlova · 20/05/2020 09:18

DDs grandparents (his parents) know where he is but refuse to tell me. Their argument is that he is trying to rebuild his business/life and cannot do that with the maintenance people on his back.

My argument would be, she needs food. Children don’t magically hit the pause button on needing a roof over their head, food, heating, hot water, school stuff etc. What arseholes.

Dumbie · 20/05/2020 09:18

Are they actually 'happy' that he's shirked his responsibilities?

I imagine they are pretty ashamed of him.

Jimdandy · 20/05/2020 09:20

Yes I would let them continue.

Rightly or wrongly it is natural for them to want to defend their own son. If they tell you they risk upsetting him. As much as I’d love grandchildren my own children come first.

Also you would be being petty and putting them in the middle and punishing them for their son’s mistakes. They are not responsible for his grown up actions.

The blame lays with him no one else.

enjoyingSun · 20/05/2020 09:20

I think they are ashamed of him but for whatever reason have decided to honour not telling me where he is

Perhape they are worried that they will l lose contact with him if they don't do as he asks?

I wouldn't let lies go - and I really wouldn't be happy about the lack of maintenance or them saying he deserves not to pay while he gets back on his feet or about information or pictures being passed to him.

would limit the interaction to only times when you are around and I would challenge any assertion that the GPs don't know where he is - politely.

I'd do this for now - especailly if she likes them and if it continues I'd re-think as time moves on.

Inkpaperstars · 20/05/2020 09:21

I am being ultra paranoid here and almost certainly way off base, but are you sure it is ok for her to visit them in terms of her father turning up, maybe even attempting to take her to his new life here or abroad.

RusticaRubra · 20/05/2020 09:22

If that was me I would tell my son I was ashamed of him and I would then say all my resources (money he would otherwise have got) were going to my GC.

If my in-laws enabled my DC's father to be a terrible father and deprive DC of basic things they need via his legal contribution I would say they can't see her till they sort their son out.

TeamLannister · 20/05/2020 09:25

There's no easy answer to this but I don't think I'd facilitate the grandparents seeing the child in this scenario. If they really cared about her they wouldn't support her father's financial and emotional neglect. And if they are sending him updates, pictures...maybe facetiming or Skyping, then he continues to have a kind of contact with no responsibilities or incentive to sort himself out.

Truzza · 20/05/2020 09:25

Are you sure he isn't in Prison?

Fluffycloudland77 · 20/05/2020 09:25

No, their Part of the problem so their shit grandparents.