AIBU - partner wants me to stop speaking Italian with my mum

[countrywalks1]

AIBU? Me and my partner have been staying at my mum's flat because of covid issues. She told me after 2 days here that she feels it's rude that I speak Italian with mum in front of her as she doesn't know what's going on and doesn't understand the language. I replied saying I understand it must be frustrating not to know, especially as she's the kind of person who likes to know everything, and the pandemic is really tough on her as she's homesick and hasn't been home properly for months, so I can understand why as she says she feels excluded.

However, my counterpoint was that I usually (about 60%) talk with mum in Italian. Culturally, I would say I'm half British and half Italian - I've mostly grown up in the UK but was born and most of my extended family are and live in Italy. I speak Italian fluently, but if I don't speak it regularly it gets a bit worse as I get out of practice with tenses and conjugations etc.

So I speak Italian with my mum because: 1) for me it's the language we've always communicated; 2) it makes me feel more connected with my Italian culture; 3) it pleases me to practice it; 4) I'm pretty sure my mum prefers talking to me in Italian than in English as she doesn't really get to speak it with anyone after my granddad (her dad) passed away a few years ago as did my very bilingually fluent brother. It's complicated I know!!!!

So told this to my partner, she says she appreciates the reasoning but still unnecessary to speak it when she's there as it feels she's excluded. I told her I understand why but I struggle to understand why she couldn't move past it as I've been in the same situation with friends speaking a language I don't understand where I just talk English when I can, or ask what's going on. The other thing is that usually my mum will save talking to me in Italian for mum things like telling me off or telling me to do something. I emphasised that we're never using it to talk about her or be nasty, and we kind of slip into it naturally.

Still she says she feels excluded, which at this point I understand. She was also in my opinion a bit nasty and in anger said we moved over here to the UK and chose to stay so we shouldn't really be talking Italian anymore anyway, we should be British. This I put down to anger that I wasn't understanding her point of view. In her defence she did also say I could speak it if I taught her Italian, although I struggle that the emphasis is on me to teach her when we have been together for 8 years and even gone over to visit my Italian relatives in Italy and been to weddings etc - without ever having tried to learn. Albeit we've been doing vocational education together throughout this time so many other important things to learn.

So last night I worked really hard to make sure I spoke only in English with everyone, so when mum asked me something in Italian I actively made sure to reply in English.

I just need to know AIBU in feeling disappointed? I understand my partner's frustration, and I can try to cut down on the Italian for a little while because of the circumstances - it's tough being homesick and then not even being able to understand the conversation where you are. It's just the request that I cut down on speaking Italian with my mum when she's also there - as I told her, I expect that I will always see mum with her (we're planning on getting married). I also feel that she's asking me to hide away (in the context of communicating with mum) a little part of my own culture. Therefore, AIBU to not let this lie?

She could learn some Italian. And no its not that rude, youre just trying to stay connected to your heritage.

I see both sides of this.

It's a lovely bond to have with your Mum that you should NO WAY stop and needs to be cherished. I know so many children of foreign parents where the language has been lost because it wasn't honed. Usually, I would say you have a point.

However, it's unfair to have a conversation around your wife she has no way of joining in or understanding, especially during quarantine. She'll be sat there feeling like a sore thumb as you two chatter away, essentially excluding her. Surely both you and your Mum get that? How would you feel?

She has no one but yourselves to talk to, she's away from her own family and you two won't speak in a mutual language because you like speaking Italian? Bit poor form, if you ask me.

Also, she isn't going to learn Italian overnight, is she? Especially when it comes to colloquial language between a parent and child - that would take years to learn!

If this is your hill to die on, OP, I'd say take a wider look at your relationship. I would speak in a language my husband understood if it made him feel uncomfortable or unwanted, regardless of my preference.

My DH doesn't speak English, no.
We've managed for 22 years with both families, neither of which get offended. As I said, we often have both languages going at the same time, which is what most bilingual families do.
The only family I ever knew where the dad got annoyed that the mother was speaking English to their son ended up with non-bilingual children which is a shame.

However, I think her opinion that you should no longer speak Italian at all is deplorable and overwhelmingly ignorant.

Bad enough being stuck at someone else’s Mums flat for lockdown but then being excluded from 30-60% of the conversations.

You say you get us but I don’t think you do. You have your mum and your partner. She has only had her partner and you are ignoring her 30-60% of the time.

Does your need to practice Italian and enjoyment of the language really trump her feelings of being stuck in a strange place feeling ignored and lonely ?

We all spoke English together as a family, and German when German speakers were (potentially) part of the conversation. My PILs didn't speak good enough English to understand, and were vocal about us not speaking English in front of them even before we had children.

@RandomSelection
"It would be a great opportunity for your partner to learn a new language and I agree it's a shame she hasn't done so, but that doesn't alter the fact that if all three of you are in the room and you and your mum are speaking a language she doesn't understand then you are both just downright bloody rude. By all means, keep up your language and chat when it's just the two of you, but to exclude your partner when she is right there is unbelievably disrespectful."

Wrong way round. It's rude of her partner of 8 years to show no interest in the language the OP has spoken since birth. Nothing rude whatsoever about sometimes speaking to his/her mother in that language in the presence of partner.

YANBU.
Same as @SharonasCorona, my partner doesn't speak my mother tongue but is very happy when I speak it with my friends and family in his presence. I try to translate as much as possible, but he does not mind when I don't. He encourages me to speak to our DC in my mother tongue and is trying to learn it too. I am not the one teaching him, it would not work for us but also I feel it is his decision and responsibility, so needs to take ownership of it if he wants to learn.
I would understand how your partner might feel excluded if all you do is speak Italian in her presence, but it does sound like you strike a balance. A bit of compromise on both sides might be helpful, but it is very unreasonable for her to expect you not to speak Italian at all.

Why doesn't she learn Italian?

I usually (about 60%) talk with mum in Italian
I think people are misreading this.
It doesn't mean that OP is spending 60% of her time speaking in Italian in her home. It means that even when she's just speaking to her mum and her partner is not there, she still spends 40% of her time speaking in English.

@Cam77

And I'm sure if it was "sometimes" or if OP's mother didn't speak English it would be absolutely fine but it seems to be pretty much all the time now they are living with the mother and the mother DOES speak English. Also, the OP states herself that her partner wanted to learn Italian and DID show an interest but OP couldn't be bothered or didn't feel it was her job to teach her! Now Op wants to chat to her mum to the exclusion of her partner she is moaning about her partner complaining! She can't have it both ways, if she had helped her partner to learn Italian when she asked her to then they wouldn't be having this problem now. So it's pretty much OP's fault!

Absolutely keep speaking italian. Teach her italian if she wants but i don't think it's rude at all.

Tell your partner this anwer lies in this song;))

YABVU! Don't you realize that talking to your mum in a language your partner doesn't understand is extremely rude? No wonder she's upset and feels excluded! The only possible reason for doing that would be if your mum doesn't understand any English. The tone of your words also suggests a very one-sided view of your relationship too. It sounds like you care far more about your 'heritage' than your partner's feelings.

By all means, carry on speaking to your mum in Italian AFTER you are all locked down together. It isn't going to be so long that you forget how to speak Italian! Is it really so hard?

If your mum can speak English, I think you’re being extremely rude.

Speak Italian when it’s just you and your mum.

I only ever come across this attitude in England, usually from monolinguals.

I’ve never had an Italian comment negatively or pull a face about me speaking English to my DC in front of them, they think it’s great DC is bilingual and also use the conversation to see if they can pick up words and expand their knowledge. My DP is Italian, his English is crap, yet he has no issue with me chatting to family and friends in English in front of him. If he wants to know what’s said I give him a recap afterwards, but on the whole he’s not really interested in our private conversations.

Is your partner a bit insecure? What do you talk about to your mum that she needs to earwig? Is she worried you might be discussing the size of her bum or something?

The rude comment about you being in Britain now - I have no words. I used to hear crap like this a lot growing up, usually from people who weren’t very educated. I thought that attitude died out with the 80s, but obviously not!

Shes unreasonable.
As many PP have said what about if you have children?
My DH is British Pakistani, I've told him to not speak in English to our DCs whilst they're learning as I want them to be fluent in his language and English can easily be learnt at school/with my and my family.
FWIW I can speak his language but understand more than I can say if that makes sense? I thought it was a common thing to do in a multi cultural relationship.

I'm multilingual and I see this from both perspectives. On one hand, yes it sucks when you unintentionally exclude someone from a conversation.

On the other hand, I think people underestimate how stilted and unnatural it feels to switch languages to one that you don't normally use with a particular person, even if both parties are fluent in both.

It's really not as simple as just switching languages, it's actually really difficult to retrain your brain to change the entire way you interact with someone. This is especially true for emotional / social use of language, where the exact translation doesn't carry the same 'feel' as it does in the original language.

Language and how we use it to connect with our loved ones is far more complex than just substituting one set of words for another.

Right now this is your shared home. It’s rude to exclude a member of the household from the conversation.

Once you no longer live with your mother, it will be different.

YABU it’s really rude

My DH doesn't speak English, no.
We've managed for 22 years with both families, neither of which get offended. As I said, we often have both languages going at the same time, which is what most bilingual families do.
The only family I ever knew where the dad got annoyed that the mother was speaking English to their son ended up with non-bilingual children which is a shame

So if your DH has not bothered to learn English in 22 years, what is the problem with OP's fiancée?

And no, I would not say you are a typical bilingual family if one parent is not bilingual. So you can't really tell the rest of us bilingual families that how you behave is the norm for bilingual families.

If you live in Italy and you speak English to your DC's and the rest of their daily life is in Italian, including your monolingual Italian DH, I fail to see how they would not be bilingual.

Is it just when your partner is there also or to stop speaking Italian completely. If its the first one I can kind of understand where she is coming from as she can't be part of the conversation. If it's the second one then then tough titties to your partner.

On the other hand, I think people underestimate how stilted and unnatural it feels to switch languages to one that you don't normally use with a particular person, even if both parties are fluent in both.

It's really not as simple as just switching languages, it's actually really difficult to retrain your brain to change the entire way you interact with someone. This is especially true for emotional / social use of language, where the exact translation doesn't carry the same 'feel' as it does in the original language.

This. I have a friend who I met in the UK and got to know in English. I ended up moving to the country she is from and marrying her cousin. I now use her language in most of my daily life and when I see her now it's usually at family events (her biological family, my in-laws) where everyone obviously speaks her language, but she and I always default to English.

Dove l'OP?!!

I married an Italian. I didn’t speak a word of it. Guess what? After 5 years I spoke really well! It’s now almost 20 years we’ve been together and I am quite good at speaking (less at writing). I worked hard to learn it so I could understand my partner even better in his own language (particularly because Italians use a lot of proverbial sayings and style of speech that definitely influence them).

She needs to get a grip!!

Sicuramente è stancante quando una non parla e deve ascoltare una lingua che non capisce ma italiano è una parte di te. Per conoscerti meglio, forse è una bella opportunità (siamo a casa 24/7)
di imparare un po’ di parole, no?? La lingua è una cosa culturale anche ... non ha un interessa nella tua background?? Onestamente, è la sua risponsibilita’ provare imparare la lingua della sua partner. Ho fatto tanto fatica anch’io ma volevo conoscere il mio fidanzato (adesso marito) meglio perché perdiamo tanto nel traduzione di una personalità di qualcuno.

I hope it all works out well, but it is her responsibility to learn some of your language. Her insecurities are a bit OTT. After all, you’re speaking with your Mother - it’s natural.

What a strange & rather selfish reaction on her part.

I hope it all works out. Don’t sacrifice something like your language and relationship to a part of yourself culturally because of a partner - that is going too far and giving away something worth way more.