AIBU to think lockdown must continue

[whacks493]

I have previously posted threads about how I feel about schools and children staying at home now I have started to see more stories like this snippet taken from BBC

A mysterious illness believed to be linked to Covid-19 has killed three children in New York state, Governor Andrew Cuomo said.

The governor described the illness as a “new” syndrome that caused inflammation of blood vessels, leading to possible heart problems.

Cuomo said health authorities were reviewing 73 similar cases of children across the state.

Many of the children did not display symptoms commonly associated with Covid-19 but later tested positive for the disease or the antibodies it produces.

The three deaths may indicate the virus poses a more severe risk to young people than previously thought, Cuomo said.

Surely all those saying this virus is not dangerous to children need to start having a rethink. The Spanish Flu was dangerous to kids in its first peak and the second peak affected adults more. Lets hope this is not the same kind of thing.

*every one

The chances of dying are small: even if you're vulnerable you have hugely better odds of surviving than not.

Bluntness rights are removed from the vulnerable if others start to go out and about more because R goes up, so the vulnerable become forced to stay locked up

This is also Illogical. No one is forcing rhe vulnerable to go out and about. They can choose to stay locked down.

Unless they also wish to go out just don’t wish anyone else to?

If you had a 1 in 100 chance of dying every time you took a flight, would you take it?

What about 1 in 20?

If you have an 80% chance of getting the virus ( before it naturally dies out) and a 1 in 20 chance of dying if you catch it , then it's not trivial.

Yes it's more likely that you would get better, but how many people face that type of risk calmly and without wanting to take evasive action ?

Why the fuck should the vulnerable be totally confined just because others can run free? That's the definition of selfishness

There is a way of doing this that lets everyone have the same degree of freedom and relative safely but you want your freedoms prioritised ?

If we get the probability of catching the virus right down everyone can have some freedom with risks that are lower than normal day to day life already presents. If some people are greedy, then many have the choice of no freedom or a very high risk of dying.

I'm happy to face risks every day. I drive my car, I drink wine, I fly, I ride my bike, I used to go riding and do horsey stuff which is a hell of a lot more risky.

At the moment I'm at risk as my biopsy to check for cancer has been cancelled owing to all this.

But the point is, we should be free to choose. The NHS is not overwhelmed. People need to earn money to support themselves and save their homes. It's not rocket science. I'm happy for others to choose to remain locked up forever. If they don't go out they can't catch it

Why the fuck should the vulnerable be totally confined just because others can run free

Can you really not see how Illogical this is? The vulnerable are confined during lock down anyway,

What you’re saying is if they can’t go out, no one else can either.

If you have an 80% chance of getting the virus ( before it naturally dies out) and a 1 in 20 chance of dying if you catch it , then it's not trivial.

What? Where on earth have you got those statistics from? 67 million people in the UK and approx 30,000 have died from CV.

greedy?

Desperate to go to work and make money to feed your children is selfish and greedy?

@attackedbythat on the flip side of that, why should children be denied education and locked up inside, people lose their businesses, homes and livelihoods and be plunged into poverty to protect a small number of people they don't even know?

Ugh autocorrect getting usernames wrong, apologies.

If we lockdown for another month and let up, what would be different to doing it now?

There is going to be spike in numbers when lockdown is over, because...the lockdown will be over and there will be more contact.
This cannot be avoided, unless we lockdown until there is a vaccine.

We always knew this, that's why the lcokdown was about allowing the nhs to cope and not eradication.

I don't think people understand that.

The nhs has coped, we now need to learn to live with the risk of the virus and take precautions against this within our every day lives. (if you are vulnerable you won't be able to take the risk and will choose to stay in isolation).

There is no other way.

I have no idea what people calling for an extended lockdown think this will achieve? Juts the number of deaths will be over a longer period and the economy will dead.

We need to get back to living and earning, and living with the risk until a vaccine is found.
No other way forward.

Sadly there’s no perfect answer. People are going to die either way. More if we lift lock down. The economy is going to fucked either way, more,so if we don’t lift lockdown.

I have really bad splinters from being on the fence over this.

I swing from thinking on a personal level I’ll take my chances with the virus. Chances of recovery are good. Then I think about everyone else we need to protect and think we should stay locked down. Then I think about the economy and think everyone should get back to work, shopping, etc. That vulnerable people,could be given the option of staying locked down or not.

If you want to remain locked down then feel free to do so.

I have been a good corporate citizen - I have followed lockdown rules. I have done a big shop weekly instead of popping in for fresh stuff. I haven’t seen any friends or family. We have only been out once a day and walked for our exercise from our house. My kids have done their schoolwork at home and missed their friends and we’ve had one lockdown birthday.

I did not sign up for my rights and freedoms being removed indefinitely. We are now at a point where it should be my right to decide who comes in my house and where I travel in the UK and if I am prepared to take the risk of getting my hair cut. Shops need to reopen and restaurants and bars with take away and social distancing. People need to go back to work.

Why the fuck should the vulnerable be totally confined just because others can run free?

Who’s going to bank roll “the vulnerable” if we’re all locked down? We need to get the economy moving - and fast.

Why the fuck should the vulnerable be totally confined just because others can run free? That's the definition of selfishness
That makes no sense , so your vulnerable so you think everyone else should stay home too .
Sod the economy, sod all these people who may not have a job to get back to , who have families to pay for.
Your classed as vulnerable so can't go out so everyone else must stay home .
That's selfish!!
The point someone else made even if lockdown ended tomorrow people can choose to stay home if they want that's your choice .
Lockdown can't and won't go on forever so if it's 1 week more or 10 you will still get people complaining that it's too soon.

I think what people are missing is how effective test trace and isolate can be.
That's why some countries like South Korea can function fairly normally because they began with a test and trace mentality
The trouble with test and trace is that the number of cases needs to be quite low. We missed the first boat but we do have the chance to use lockdown to reach that state. Then you get less of a second peak and more of a series of ripples. South Korea takes hard action on 30 cases and so avoids the 30000 deaths, but mostly they get on with normal life. We could show a little patience , get infection rates down and then go to a fairly functional normality with test and trace

Or we could give up and resign ourselves to having one of the highest death rate in the world , and an economy that fails to recover because of the devastating effect of the virus and the number of people wealthier people who can afford to self isolate

There is no clear evidence (of anything actually at the moment) that more people will die if we raise the lockdown earlier- might well just be we delay the rate people die. But same numbers in the end.(unless we wait for a vaccine)
Which was the stated intention in the first place.

We won't have answers on lots of this until we have hindsight and a lot more data.
We can't crash the economy and peoples lives waiting for that.

We have to go forward cautiously with risk and adjust as we learn.

Bluntness100

Because those demanding it be lifted are not stopping those who wish it to continue to keep locking down. They are not stopping anyone do anything. The right to remain locked down remains yours, no one is stopping you.

By demanding that the lock down be lifted you are forcing those that want to stay locked down in to going back to jobs that put them at risk.

Once the lock down is gone there will be no 'you can choose' option.

And anyone that has to work with you or be around you will have a greater risk than they want to have because they have been around you and your list of friends and relatives etc.

It is that simple.

Just FYI.
I never stopped working, and schools opening will put me at greater risk yet I will go in.

and which ever side of the fence you sit on this a phased return is the only way to do return properly.

Why the fuck should the vulnerable be totally confined just because others can run free? That's the definition of selfishness

So you'd be happy with benefits being cut because there would be less money going to the treasury through taxation on wages?

By demanding that the lock down be lifted you are forcing those that want to stay locked down in to going back to jobs that put them at risk.

Don’t be ridiculous, no one is forced to do any job they don’t wish.

Quit. Claim benefits.

Forcing people to go to work. Eh I don’t think so. We have freedom if choice here.

How do people think we fund the NHS??

Through taxes y'know? And at the moment tax revenue is floored and government spending is astronomical, so how we are we going to fund services and look after the vulnerable in the future?

We don't live in noddy land where we can shut the doors, emerge 6 months later and everything will be just the same.
It will be economic devastation for years to come.
Which will mean cuts to services- schools/nhs/ social care.

You can't reduce taxes, spend more and increase funding to the nhs.
All of you wanting a longer lockdown would be responsible for devastated public services in years to come.

Bluntness100

Don’t be ridiculous, no one is forced to do any job they don’t wish.

Quit. Claim benefits.

Forcing people to go to work. Eh I don’t think so. We have freedom if choice here.

What a hypocritical stance. They will be having to go to work for the same reasons that you are. Not everybody can just up an quit.

Just FYI.
I never stopped working, and schools opening will put me at greater risk yet I will go in.*
It's I though isn't you say !!
You are worried you are at risk but I'm sorry you are 1 person. I'm worried about the millions of people who may not have a job .
You need to look at the bigger picture not yourself.
Also FYI you can choose to stay home if you feel as at risk you say you are .

people who have the I have the right to risk it attitude don't understand virus transfer.

Thank goodness I live in Scotland