Neighbours son with autism and all-day verbal stimming.

[MonkeyJunk]

I know I am being unreasonable, but I am also slightly losing my mind.

Our neighbour has a son who has autism and who screams as part of this (I believe). He spends each day from around 7am until darkness in the garden doing this, and I think he does it when he is inside as well. Unfortunately any movement (us, children, animals) seems to be a trigger.

He does also do this in the house but because of the way our houses are designed and because they are the end of terrace house we cannot hear it (and nobody else can).

I get it is really, really, really shit for her, but it is now becoming relentless. All day, every day when the weather is good - it means our home is not very peaceful at all and we cannot enjoy our garden at all (he seems to go into a much more shrill scream when there's movement in our garden). We've stopped feeding the birds and are letting the dog out the front yard when it needs to go out.

I know lockdown is tough, and the mother must be finding it very difficult, but it's having a huge impact on us and our family life - particularly not being able to enjoy our garden, being woken up and the kids struggling to sleep at night (we've now moved them into the front bedroom to try and minimise this).

WIBU to ask if her son can please be inside by seven pm and for some hours during the day so we can go into and enjoy our garden?

Ops children sound too young to understand and are frightened therefore their sensitivities also need to be considered. They’ll understand in perhaps time 5 years time

Five years time? My 3yo is old to enough to understand when we explain "his head (brain) works differently to yours" and "sometimes he has big feelings and has to scream to help him feel better".

Op you need to call around some fencing companies to see if they’re still working and have them erect a 2m fence.

Don’t go round bothering this woman, she has more than enough on her plate than to have a complete stranger approach her to tell her how annoying her disabled child is, and how his uncontrollable medical symptoms are preventing said complete stranger from enjoying her garden to its full capacity - believe me.

Your presence is what’s causing ndn’s son’s distressed response, put up a tall fence so you stop being the impetus for his distress thereby also solving your “problem”.

Yours, parent of a severely autistic child, who sick to the fucking back teeth of anyone making my already extremely difficult life any harder.

@Brogley Do you know of any books that explain neurodiversity to kids please? I will order them.

am absolutely disgusted bu some of the attitudes on this thread. Some of you are just arses. He is entitled to make any noise which is in relation to his disability in his own garden, if the mother chooses to work with the OP that is her choice.

So there should never be any consideration for others? OP sounds very reasonable actually, she isn't demanding anything or suggesting that he shouldn't go out into the garden; but is asking for how she can also help with the situation, and is keen to learn more rather than acting like she knows it all. Aside from the Mumsnet saints most people would find it a lot to deal with at the moment, whether they would admit it or not.

you seem very reasonable, and as a parent with SEN children and SN i think you need to use your garden too.

This is what slimming can be caused by, making the sound allows you to phase out the rest.

vimeo.com/52193530

Whoops forgot the link

Books every used with out DC to explain things are:

• Isaac and His Amazing Asperger Superpowers! (two of my DC have dx of autism rather than aspergers but it's a starting point for discussing how people's brains can work differently)

• My Friend Sam (we were given a copy by NAS at a post-diagnosis appointment to help us to talk about it with the DC, I don't know if it's available on Amazon but I think NAS sell it directly. It's about a nursery aged child rather than an older child but if the DC are young it will probably help them relate more with it being about a child their age)

• Autism is... (specifically for younger children and a bit basic but it's useful for an age appropriate starting point)

Books are great to give you the bare bones of a discussion but every autistic person is different and one of the problems we had with a lot of books that we used to explain things to our DC is that they don't give a description of autism that will apply to everyone. What we did do though was to use them as a discussion point and to prompt questions from the DC that we could then answer in a way more specific to our own circumstances.

Books every used with out DC to explain things are:

Should say books we have used with our DC...

Does the mum leave the son outside all day while she is shut inside, as far as you can tell?

The problem at the moment is while schools are open for childcare, special schools are not, because the nature of the care they provide is a lot harder to deliver at a 2 metre distance.

That said, the parents have to know that if they are shutting their son out so they can work, then other people are going to be disturbed and a friendly chat about how you and they can help each other should be welcomed.

I have 2 sen children of 4 and I am hyper aware of the noise they are creating at the moment, inside and outside of the house. If one of my neighbours approached me and said they felt they couldn't use their garden because of my children I would be mortified and I would certainly work with them to find a solution which suited both of us. Especially right now when my shielding neighbours are unable to go out and get away from my bunch. Heck I want to run away from them at times!

Yes cloudiay - quite agree.
This always happens OP-
Perfectly sensible thread with a lot of helpful measured responses designed to make a compromise and then along come the cries of ‘Disabilism’ because people had dared to suggest that a disabled person might try to modify their actions in anyway to stop causing distress or disruption to other people for some part of the day.
brogley so if an incontinent person urinates on the floor you don’t think it would be common courtesy to apologise for the mess? It wouldn’t be their fault any more than it’s the boys fault for stimming but in the real world people apologise when their actions cause inconvenience to others.

OP- You sound lovely and unless the mother is completely selfish (which may be the case if she literally sits inside all day ignoring him) hopefully she will be able to have a calm discussion which could be to your benefit and also her sons.

What exactly is the mother supposed to do, though? how will talking do anything other than make the mother feel even more keenly that her son has no place in the world?

ddemelza
Not let him be in the garden from dawn to dusk?
I get the impression the OP would be happy for an hour or so to use her Garden without causing the boy distress by being there and similar to get her children to sleep.
She’s not being unreasonable at all.

I disagree.

The fence idea from Pinky is a good one.

Smileyaxolotl1 do you apologise for everything you do that might distress someone with autism?

do you apologise for everything you do that might distress someone with autism?

The things that may distress someone with autism can be pretty mundane everyday noises and stuff. Not screaming all day in the garden.

It would drive me up the wall and I’m not sure I could be as kind and reasonable as you. It sounds horrendous all round. Do they/you ever go out for exercise? Could you stagger that so you could get two hours when you’re not having to put up with the noise? (By that I mean, you go out for an hour, then they go out for an hour). Regardless of his dis/abilities, we should all be entitled to enjoy some peace and quiet in our gardens and be mutually accommodating.

because people had dared to suggest that a disabled person might try to modify their actions in anyway to stop causing distress or disruption to other people for some part of the day.

I have a similar child at home. I would suggest this statement is so hugely ignorant of what life with a disabled child is like it’s just jaw dropping.

The very mild restrictions you are experiencing if you are in the uk at the moment are glaringly similar to how life can be with an autistic child. We have no school, access to Drs is difficult, access to dentists more so, we are housebound in many ways and have very limited places we can go, our income as a family is pinched, we cannot socialise easily, it's stressful, we have no easy way out, nobody can “fix it” or make it go away, some people are desperately kind and some take advantage of our situation...Think before you become part of what makes things harder for people who deserve so much more than they got.

I spent my entire career working with children like the boy in the OP. And while I have every sympathy with the parent, I also have every sympathy with the OP. Stimming noises are very different from 'children playing' noises, and extremely hard to ignore. They can cause extreme stress to those within earshot. Even those of us paid to live with it, and just for five or six hours a day. Even under those conditions we'd have strategies to give the staff and other children in the group regular breaks from a vocally stimming child.

The OP sounds incredibly reasonable compared to most neighbours. She's clearly trying to be understanding, while just trying to carve out a niche for her to be able to use her own space and relax.

What about this:

Hello neighbour!

I wanted to send you a little note to see how you and your family are all doing in lockdown, and checking whether we might be able to support each other a little but through this?

I understand your son has additional needs, and I really hope that you are both getting enough support. I am losing my mind a little bit over here with 3 NT kids and take my hat off to you!

I was wondering, and I really hope this message is kind rather than offensive, if we could maybe come up with a little garden schedule? I am keenly aware than having my D.C. out in the garden seems to impact your DS negatively, as his verbal stimming escalates. I apologise if this is a mis-read; I only know a bit about autism and know every child is different. My DC and I also struggle a bit with the constant noise, even though we feel awful for saying so. This lockdown has frazzled my nerves!

We have started letting our dog out front so we don't affect your DS, and I was thinking we could maybe agree a few hours when we could head outside so your son won't be disturbed by us, and vice versa?

We never hear you guys indoors but if we are too noisy inside, let us know what is particularly triggering or disruptive and I can work with DC to minimise!

Yours in lockdown solidarity...

Perhaps he’s trying to talk to the neighbours?*

Wouldn't you take your kid inside if they were annoying the neighbours trying to talk to them? I wouldn't let my kid be outside all day making a racket, if they couldn't keep it down they'd lose access to the garden for more than a short period a day, the rest indoors. If it makes mine and the kids lives more difficult, so what? I'm the parent, it's mine to deal with, not the neighbours.

I don't get not having to apologise for behaviour caused by disability. Do people with mental health problems not have to apologise for how they affect others with some of their behaviours?

The neighbour isn’t really being asked to “deal” with anything though is she? She doesn’t like the sounds this person makes while he’s raking the grass and playing on his laptop.

brogley so if an incontinent person urinates on the floor you don’t think it would be common courtesy to apologise for the mess?

No. I'd state what has happened and ask for cleaning products to take care of it. It is not the person's fault, they owe jo one an apology and no one else should have to give one on their behalf.

because people had dared to suggest that a disabled person might try to modify their actions in anyway to stop causing distress or disruption to other people for some part of the day.

Epileptic fits can be distressing for others to witness as can diabetic hypos and can sometimes cause disruption to others if they happen in a public place. Would you ask a person with epilepsy or diabetes to modify their behaviour so as not to distress or inconvenience you?

My mum should apologise for stuff she did in manic bipolar stage. She doesn't get out of it just cos she has a disorder. You still affect the other person, intention or lack of awareness doesn't change that.