To think people have forgotten what lockdown was for and now think they’re all going to die

[wakeupitsabeautifulmorning]

I think people have gradually lost all sense of reality during this lockdown. It’s the NHS we are protecting by making sure not too many people are admitted with Coronavirus at the same time. But normal young healthy people seem to be thinking it’s to stop them catching it and dying. Where do we go from here?

Who has been working extra hours to pick your order in a shop, because YOU think it's too dangerous to be there, but it's ok for them to be there for a 12 hour shift.....

but those people are safer if the contact with others is limited, that's the point.

When all the people who can work from home actually stay home, it means the trains are near empty for the ones who have to commute to do their shift.

It's in everybody's interest not to carry on as normal.

@GingerRodgers18 seeing as you haven’t bothered to back up your insult with any factual basis for these terrifying stats that I clearly don’t understand, let me give you the facts instead:

In 8 weeks 143 people under the age of 40 have died with COVID-19.

That’s 0.002% of the UK population.

Terrifying

Many didn't even understand the reason for lockdown in the first place.

It means keeping infection rates low so that people of all ages will not get sick.

No it doesn't. It means keeping the infection rate at one that does not overwhelm the NHS. It isn't to stop us getting ill as such, just not to all get ill at the same time.

What do you think protecting the NHS means - reserving it only for the old? It means keeping infection rates low so that people of all ages will not get sick.

Protecting the NHS actually means keeping the infection rate low enough that the NHS can cope with the numbers on a daily basis and not be overwhelmed. It does not mean stopping people getting infected, but rather to allow them to do so in a controlled manner.

Apologies if that is what you meant BTW.

This thread isnt about coming out of lockdown it is about how people have lost perspective in all of this to think that getting it means a death sentence whereas the statistics show its anything but.

Lockdown is all about the R0 because that is what got out of control. It is incredibly infectious with a high enough death rate (even if it is 1%) to cause damage if left to spread unchecked through the population.

But I can think of at least 4 threads on here where people arent seeking medical advice or told off for wanting to seek medical advice for things that NEED to be seen and that is where people have forgotten.

We are (rightly) in lockdown because this is one contagious virus with enough of a sting in its tail to do some damage to a small percentage of people it infects

Correct. It have never been about protecting us. It’s been about protecting the NHS.

The government is very clear about that. It’s clearly repeated at us and shown clearly in large, simple text at every briefing, information film, advert etc.

It’s the NHS we are protecting by making sure not too many people are admitted with Coronavirus at the same time. But normal young healthy people seem to be thinking it’s to stop them catching it and dying.

No, it’s protect the NHS AND SAVE LIVES

@OneandTwenty can you even imagine how many hundreds of people my DD comes in contact with day in day out working in retail? Customers who purposefully cough on them?? My DDs partner had someone spit in his face and scream at him when the item they wanted wasn't there and he couldn't say when it would be back in stock. She has no time to do her own shopping and everything is picked over in the supermarket when she does get out of work usually around 9pm. Retail workers didn't ask for this, they have no PPE and are facing hundreds of shoppers every day.

But that's ok, right?? THEY are the ones on the frontline here. NHS workers are dealing with sick people, retail workers are dealing with an ever angrier, disgruntled and often foul general population who may quite easily be asymptotic and pass it on to them.

And by the way, no I don't think a rapist who called himself Karen is a woman. Weird thing to joke about, you two.

Not as weird as the reality.

We've no idea what the chance of death is statistically as we don't know how many people have had it confused

Aggressive monitoring Gand contact tracing in some countries give us an idea. Data is widely and publicly reported globally. To say we have “no idea” is laughable

@LittleFoxKit I cant be arsed reading all the Karen drivel to see if anyone has replied. But the answer is maybe. If you've had a letter - yes. If not probably not but check the shielding guidance as there is a fairly short list of conditions. Most asthmatics arent shielding for example and not all those with copd. If you're still unsure def check with your GP.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/guidance-on-shielding-and-protecting-extremely-vulnerable-persons-from-covid-19/guidance-on-shielding-and-protecting-extremely-vulnerable-persons-from-covid-19

They said flu jab as the general high risk group to begin with and then tightened the guidance for extremely vulnerable. This has caused a lot of confusion understandably.

@Sadie789
Thank you for that statistic,
I wonder what other things have a death rate of 0.002% that we do every day 🤔

Truth is for the majority of us this isn't a death sentence and people screeching that it is are just pissing me off tbh

More than 20,000 deaths in the UK from one virus in 5 weeks.

For the first 10 days of april there were about 4000 extra deaths in care homes compared to the previous months (it would normally be going down at this time of year). Most of those were not reported as Covid deaths as there is no testing.

The FT are estimating another 20,000 community deaths (mostly care homes) uncounted in the official stats. Having looked at their maths I think they are probably in the right ball park.

I don't think the media are scare mongering. I think anyone who isn't terrified (not necessarily for themselves) isn't paying attention.

Thank you for your perspective, @Sadie789. I'm pretty sure I've had Covid-19 and I am just about better after nearly 6 weeks. I've felt like shit at times and it's been worrying, but you're right: worse things do happen to people. My mother-in-law died of MND and that was horrific. I think retail workers should be better protected, but the press can fuck off with their hysteria, really.

midwife is not a sexist term as people giving birth still tend to be women.

I want to go back to the time when the only way to read this comment was dripping with irony. These days it could be earnestly inclusive of a variety of pregnant persons.

I wonder what other things have a death rate of 0.002% that we do every day

Well, that's only the under 40's. PP said 0.002% of the entire UK population, so proabably about a 0.004% death rate for under 40s.

Not many things have that kind of death rate per 2 months and really most of the deaths occured in a month. That's higher than road traffic deaths, for example.

You have to factor in that we've all been locked down and only a small proportion of the UK have had the virus yet. If we hadn't locked down the death rate would be much higher, so alone that death rate is not an argument that lockdown is unnecessary.

The risk is non-trivial for under 40s but regardless, there is no way to lower the (much, much greater) risk to the over 40s without affecting the young.

On the subject of 'Karens' looks I consider myself an ardent feminist and I think females are the superior gender by far

But

I worked in retail while I was in college and there definitely was something in this idea that middle aged women would come in and complain about the most innocuous of things. What made it worse was a lot of them would have this strange passive aggressive tone that you don't often get with men, comes across as really disingenuous and catty. But that's just my observation from a little bit of part time work.

I have a life threatening lung condition which means if I caught it, I would at the very least be seriously unwell.

In my experience people who are genuinely vulnerable tend to be pretty realistic about gauging risk. The ones screeching that of you so much as open a window you’re killing old people. or saying they won’t let their perfectly healthy 5 year old play in the garden because I DON’T WANT HIM TO DIEEEEEE are, with the best will in the world, not gauging risk well.

It’s important to balance good risk management, with not losing sight of common sense and giving in to hysteria. Acting like going for a quick jog around Bridport is the same as going for a quick jog around Chernobyl isn’t helping anyone.

Sadie - it’s not 99.8% will be ok. It’s a 2% death rate not a 0.02%. It’s 100 times worse than you suggest. So 1 in 50. I cannot think of anything I would willingly do that gave me a 1 in 50 chance of dying.

Yes- totally agree but - we all have different set ups, different family living with us and different conditions. Too many people on here loving to call others stupid because they are handling this differently to the way they are coping - we all just want to live and keep our loved ones safe and we all do it in a way that suits our own set-up.
I'm really shocked at how high the UK death rate is and we need to look at the strick aussie lockdown sucess and take note.

And how many people are going to die as a result OF lockdown?

Possibly thousands.

And how many people's lives and mental health are going to suffer, possibly long-term, possibly forever?

Possibly millions.

On the subject of 'Karens' looks I consider myself an ardent feminist

Mmm hmmm.

I've just received £700 furlough pay and £279 UC. I'm shielding but I'm going to have to leave my home to search for work.
I have 3 children

And how many people are going to die because of lack of investigations because they worried about going to the doctor? Or having cancer treatments and operations put on hold? And dialysis patients who are having 3 hours less dialysis treatment a week? Or living with abusive partners? Or have serious mental health issues?

I think a lot of people are doing their own risk assessments and acting accordingly.

Was my friend wrong to visit her visually impaired, 70+ mother with Parkinsons disease yesterday?

The covid police would scream yes but if they knew the mother was becoming increasingly confused and distressed to the point of being suicidal from lack of human contact would they say the same?

I'm diabetic and swinging between being terrified of the virus and thinking fuck it and going out to do some non essential things like walk on a beach approximately 15 minutes drive away or go to B and M. If I have an 80% risk of getting it anyway then why not take my chances now?