Labour is right to demand an exit strategy

[Goldenheart18]

This lockdown has removed (I hope temporarily) our basic human rights. I get that it was done to ensure that the NHS could cope with the surge of coronavirus cases. But after 4 weeks the government has confirmed that the NHS is coping, and that it does have capacity for more cases. Yet they won’t even slightly ease the lockdown restrictions, or even give any indication as to how long they will last, or which ones might be eased up first. More importantly they won’t explain what their plan is for getting us back to some kind of normality.

Surely by this point , after 4 weeks, the government should have had a workable plan for exiting the lockdown, given that the longer it goes on the greater the damage to the economy. They keep saying that the science will inform when they lift the restrictions. But that makes no sense. Even if they get new cases down to zero as soon as we exit they will go right back up again. Surely the rate of infection is only part of the issue. The main one is how do we keep the rate of infection low once we leave lockdown (which has to be to be temporary if we do not want an economic depression).

It seems likely that any workable exit plan depends on testing and contact tracing. But where is the government on achieving any of that in the next 3 - 4 weeks? If they don’t publish their exit plan they cannot be held to account for whether or not they are putting in place the right measures to achieve it. And that’s why they absolutely should be open with the public now about what their plans are.

We have just gone through years and years of austerity as a country where poverty and homelessness has surged. We cannot afford another Great Depression.

Aibu?

The OP has not asked to lift the lockdown but an exit plan. Not the same thing at all

But how can the govt say "first stage will be schools reopening", only then, in a few weeks time, to look at Spain, Italy, Germany, etc to see that opening schools has caused it to spread again too fast in those countries, so they have to cancel that plan.

You need good information to make any plan. A plan based on incomplete or dodgy data is no plan at all.

The Govt WILL have their own idea of how we're getting out of this situation, but they'd be crazy to make it public when there are so many unknowns.

I didn’t say detained. I said lockdown. I’m in the U.K. and our lockdown is different to other countries. No one is being detained.

What you said was Let the under 45s go back to work and keep the over 70s in lockdown. You didn't say they should be advised to stay in lockdown, you didn't say it was a good idea, you didn't say it should be suggested you said quite specifically that they should be kept in lockdown. Words matter.

It should be their decision but I think Loo is saying that this advice could continue You are right that the advice should continue but that wasn't what Loo said. If you decide to stay at home you aren't being kept at home, if you are detained in prison you are being kept there. There is enough propaganda going round so it is important to be clear on what we mean.

Just to be clear my vulnrable husband has chosen to be in lockdown for 5 weeks. I have supported him in that, I haven't been to a shop and have been for a walk 4 times. It is our choice.

By the way don't know if anyone is listening to todays briefing. First step in freedom, they are asking councils to reopen cemeteries but not for gatherings.

We have no idea of what this virus can do.

What happens if it mutates and we end up back at square one?

Much more evidence is needed and this will take time to collect.

Best thing we can do? Comply with instructions from the government and keep calm.

It's not just Labour calling for this, some senior Tories are also calling for an exit strategy to be made public.

www.buzzfeed.com/alexwickham/coronavirus-uk-lockdown-three-stage-exit-plan

Just seen this. No idea on accuracy

I think the minute people get a whiff that lockdown is easing there will be an almost automatic bending of every rule.

The current system is like boiling a frog; by not really telling us at the start how long it will last and continuing in that vein the Govt achieves the maximum compliance. Let's face it we can all cite examples where it's happened already.

I think planning is being worked up, but it won't be released until the PM is back and we are closer to the end of this current 3 week period.

Meanwhile, we get the benefit of looking at how other countries are faring. All we need is for Sturgeon and Labour to desist with partisan politics, dressed as faux outrage (whilst thanking fuck they're not in charge of this awful situation) for a while.

What happens if it mutates and we end up back at square one?
reading about it, apparently it has, and there is more than 1 strain. I wonder if you can catch them simultaneously...

They shouldn't be discussing any exit strategy with the public when we've just had another 3 weeks of lockdown announced. It's just an invitation for people to break the lockdown guidlines. Dominic Raab said they've had discussions and plans are under way but right now stay home so just listen to it

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/18/dont-bet-on-vaccine-to-protect-us-from-covid-19-says-world-health-expert?CMP=ShareiOSAppp_Other

So looks like no vaccine any time soon - so what is the plan?

At a time like this, I think they should be working together. Labour are so quick to judge. I’m not so sure they could of done any better. I would not vote for them currently. I think we should not rush lifting lockdown and we need to listen to the science and watch other countries closely. Talking about lifting lockdown when we have at least 3 more weeks is not going to help anyone adhere to the current rules.

twitter.com/thesundaytimes/status/1251614513973080071?s=21

I wonder how accurate the headline is?

@Ivalueloyaltyaboveallelse

I think there is quite a good chance that anybody else with the position of Prime Minister would, at least, have turned up to the meetings.

It's interesting that no one has mentioned geography in this. I am in Somerset where we have had 310 cases. That's 310. And in the WHOLE of the south west there have been 650 deaths (now of course I don't deny for one minute that each one of those is a tragedy for the family concerned). I think it's quite ridiculous that such economic catastrophe is being caused , not to mention mental and social wellbeing devastation, for such a tiny amount of impact. A real sledgehammer to crack a nut in this area for sure.

I believe in the long run we will look back and be aghast at the scale of the reaction around this. Those people crying out for longer lockdowns - can you not see that the economic knock-on effects in the long-term will cause untold deaths and hardship in itself? We need to find a way to get everything back up and running around social distancing. Where are the 5000ish new infections and 800odd new deaths coming from if lockdown is the answer, now we're 4 weeks in?

@PrettyLittleBrownEyedMe

And, added to that, how many have died in their own houses, or in old peoples' homes?

What percentage of the population is that, so far?

I'm also amazed and appalled in equal measure at the discovery that, far from 'British people hate being told what to do', it turns out that actually they are gagging for it, and are begging for more rules, more 'crackdown', not to mention relishing the opportunity for 'snitching' on neighbours....anyone who cannot see that this is sinister and deeply depressing for a free society has a very narrow view of the wider picture.

Now I'm not suggesting that people should rebel per se, but this view that we should slavishly obey rules and be happy to be discussing a six-month lockdown without question or challenge makes us all seem like sheeple

The right to life is the most basic human right. Freedom to live.

Allowing Covid to run unchecked through the population would cause far more deaths and longer-term economic damage than any shorter term disruption. We already have essential workers dying - healthcare staff, transport workers, care home workers. I don't think it's the British public being sheeple at all. It's the British public not wanting a premature and unpleasant death for themselves or their loved ones. When you include all the risk factors - common conditions like diabetes, hypertension, asthma, being overweight - that covers a large proportion of the public. We also don't yet know why but it's disproportionately affecting the BAME community, and also men. I'd say there's very good reasons to not end lockdown early.

Isn't the point that as a consequence of lockdown the fatality rate in the SW is 350 cases?

Once lockdown is lifted and second homers and holidaymakers beeline for the coast your relatively low number of critical care beds could be overrun.

Correction 310

The right to life is the most basic human right. Freedom to live.

Correct. This is not to say that anyone has the right to a life free of risk, obviously.

It would be stupid to commit to something now - we have to see what happens and keep footloose in our response...

A hell of a lot of armchair generals on here.

If the government released a strategy, Labour would just rip into it and trot out the usual rhetoric. This is a time for all parties to bring their brains together not resort to partisan political point scoring.

From a public perspective, you give people an inch, they'd take miles and the sacrifice of so many would be for nothing as there appears to be a fair chance of the world going back to square one.