disgusted that nurses/carers/doctors are dying for lack of PPE in 6th richest country

[wemustnotforget]

When this is all over (or maybe now) we must hold Boris and team responsible for risking so many lives.

Our health secretary said this -
“We need everyone to treat PPE like the precious resource it is,” he said on Friday. “Everyone should use the equipment they clinically need, in line with the guidelines: no more and no less.”

Nurses, porters, doctors are sacrificing their own safety and Matt Hockock has nerves to say they must not OVERUSE PPE, they dont have PPEs. Why was he chosen for this job when his background is in economics?

From wikipedia -
He studied at Exeter College, Oxford, and graduated with a first in Philosophy, Politics and Economics, and went on to Christ's College, Cambridge, to earn an MPhil degree in Economics.[5][6] Hancock became a member of the Conservative Party in 1999.[7]
After university, Hancock briefly worked for his family's computer software company, before moving to London to work as an economist at the Bank of England, specialising in the housing market.

A doctor who warned Boris a month ago about risks of medical staff working without PPEs has died of corona virus at the age of 53.

In his message to the prime minister, Dr Chowdhury wrote: "Please ensure urgently PPE for each and every NHS health worker in the UK.

"Remember we may be doctors/nurses/HCAs/allied health workers who are in direct contact with patients, but we are also human beings to practice human rights like others, to live in this world disease free with our family and children.

"Otherwise in future our children will lose interest to go to medical school.
news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-doctor-who-warned-prime-minister-about-ppe-dies-with-covid-19-11971068

And for those who are going to say I am making it political at the time of crisis, no I am not. I want this government to be accountable for their actions.

Why UK declined EU's offer of collective PPE purchase.

www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/26/no-10-boris-johnson-accused-of-putting-brexit-over-breathing-in-covid-19-ventilator-row

I don't know why we don't have lots of PPE but we don't and I'm pretty sure if we had tons of it it would be with the NHS staff as we speak. Rant on about this but if we haven't got it we haven't got it.
The Gov will know exactly how much we have and how much was sent out so I presume that why some workers don't have it who should will come out in the wash once this is over. I'd rather wait til then to see what went wrong.

We know full well why there isn't enough PPE. It's because people voted for the fucking Tories.

I agree OP it's an absolute disgrace. We are told we get one visor and to wipe it between patients....meant to be disposable. And then Hancock says we are overusing it. They don't care..

It's the type of ppe too. Public health England deem a plastic thin apron that doesn't cover your arms or half your body/uniform effectively! short gloves and surgical mask efficient for dealing with a suspected or positive patient. Visors/goggles optional!! Not including cohort areas.. can be different.

Gowns and ffp3 masks are for ICU/HDU or areas were patients are on high flow o2 or intubated ( aerosol generate so higher risk)

This is wrong in itself in comparison to WHO guidance and what staff are wearing in other hospitals around the world. I feel NHS staff are going to be so badly affected because of this! But now we are receiving blame because of over use?? Seriously?

The PPE advice the trust gives us isn't the same standard as WHO advice....it's inferior PPE to begin with. If they wanted to they could get some planes from china to bring supplies over.

Would other parties have done any better? I suppose Jezza would have saved the day 🙄

We have visor, paper mask, gloves and thin plastic apron. I have to change my gloves and apron for each patient I see, wash my hands then don new gloves and apron before seeing new patient.
I usually have 8 antenatal patients or 8 postnatal ladies plus babies during a shift. I am constantly changing my PPE and washing my hands. Everything is taking so much longer to do.
The masks are to be used for 4 hours at a time you cannot touch it or take it off in that time at all. It is very hot and uncomfortable and I have to let my ladies know that I am smiling as they only see half of my face.
In theatre we wear full PPE with FFP3 masks as aerosol generating procedures in theatre.
I feel for my colleagues in ITU working in such circumstances. It is very very difficult. We have a covid suite on our labour ward we wear exactly the same PPE as on the wards except on labour ward you can wear scrubs. On the wards we have to wear our uniform. We have been told to wash our uniform on highest temp possible seperate from families clothes.
I'm not sure if it's enough as our arms are exposed and our hair. We just do it what else can we do.

Yanbu

Yes our trust seem to be applying PHE and not WHO guidelines re PPE.

How much PPE should have been stockpiled? Enough for six months? A year? Two years?

China keeps sending PPE not fit for purpose. Also, there’s videos of them coughing and spitting on them. It’s a worldwide shortage, not just in the U.K. if there was a labour government then the exact same thing would be happening

There is a global shortage, Bill Gates wrote about it in the Telegraph today warning richer countries to stop outbidding poorer ones. Even Germany has problems now and Angela Merkel has said that never again will PPE be made outside of Germany. It is completely unacceptable and I don't understand why the factories which usually produce garments in Turkey, Pakistan etc can't be used to make PPE fabric protection items. I would expect someone like Philip Green to be all over this but he's probably sunning himself on a yacht in Monaco.

www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/science-and-disease/coronavirus-bill-gates-calls-global-agreements-masks-treatments/

So if we said no PPE no patient care what would happen. Why should we put our life on the line? I don't want to wit until this is over to get answers. Many more to of us will be dead by then. Matt Hancock is a twat do overuse PPE chance would be a fine thing.

I would love to see the MPs talking to covid patients in those useless masks and aprons. I urge all nurses to read RCN guide on declining to treat without PPE you never know when you might need it. I want to treat patients but if MPs don't care about us why should we, they won't care if we are just a name of another dead nurse my children and husband will though. I have always loved my job but then I have never been scared for my life whilst doing it.
Not sure what I will do when this is over, 23 years on the NHS might be enough for me.

Don't over use PPE!!

Chinese doctors died
Italian doctors died
Spanish, American, French doctors died

They aren’t dying because of lack of PPE. They are dying because despite PPE it is extremely contagious and they are still catching it and some of them are dying.

What’s wrong with saying don’t overuse something which is in short supply? If you aren’t directly dealing with covid patients why are you walking around with FFP on? It isn’t necessary.

Hancock was just asked if he'd like to apologise to nurses for putting them in this situation of having to work with out adequate PPE, he again dodged the question. Why can he not just say 'sorry, we are doing our best but I am sorry that nurses are in in this position at this time".

I'm not saying that any party would have done better but despite everything Tory leadership has still been full of contempt for poor and key workers. Trying to shift the blame always.

Who is walking around with PPE on without covid patients? Our trust only supply it to the wards with Covid. It's insulting to say don't waste it when it has been in short supply, must have missed Matt telling us not to nurse covid patients without PPE oh no he didn't because, they don't care.

If that is the best the government can say at the moment they can stuff off.

@Rupertpenrysmistress, are you guys wearing FFP when you’re not doing AGPs? We were having a problem with people wearing it the whole time unnecessarily

heyallyoucoolcatsandkittens we have been told to treat all our patients as suspected covid you do not know who has the virus. It is only in aerosol generating procedures we wear Ffp3 masks or if tested covid positive.

Unless you can categorically prove that not one doctor, nurse or health care assistant have died due to lack of PPE then I suggest you keep your ignorant opinions to yourself.

Op I agree. Matt Hancock is giving me the absolute rage because he is just not answering the questions about PPE. A journalist just told him that the RCN are advising nurses to refuse to treat patients if correct PPE isn't available and he gave a waffling non answer and then cut her off. Utterly disgusting.

Why UK declined EU's offer of collective PPE purchase.

Did Italy, Spain and Austria decline as well?

"European countries have also been accused of confiscating masks that would be destined for other countries in the European Union. According to the French magazine L’Express, on March 5, France confiscated 5 million masks from the Swedish company Mölnlycke produced in France, two days after President Emmanuel Macron signed a decree that allows the government to confiscate stocks of hospital supplies to fight the coronavirus."

"According to the Swedish company, these masks would be sent to Spain and Italy, countries among those hardest hit by the pandemic."

PPE ordered by the NHS blocked by French customs:

"French company Valmy SAS was forced to redirect an order for personal protective equipment made by the UK’s National Health Service. A company representative told CNN that the order was blocked by customs agents off the coast of France."

edition.cnn.com/2020/04/03/europe/coronavirus-masks-war-intl/index.html

Early March:
"A diplomatic spat has erupted between Germany and neighbours Switzerland and Austria over a decision last week by Chancellor Angela Merkel’s government to ban most exports of protective medical equipment."

"Switzerland has called in the German ambassador to complain about the decision to block a shipment of 240,000 face masks, while Austria’s economy minister demanded her German counterpart order the release of supplies destined for her country."

www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-09/germany-faces-backlash-from-neighbors-over-mask-export-ban

So if we said no PPE no patient care what would happen.

Apparently the RCN have said exactly that according to the government update just now. Good for them, I say

Full PPE when doing AGP which obviously include high flow nasal oxygen and optiflow alot of which is used on general wards however,we don't have enough full PPE for these procedures. We are then advised to wear FRM for contact with all other patients either positive or negative unless performing above AGP. Physios use them for chest physio too so our stocks run low on full PPE. So we are not using it inappropriately.

On the other hand our handover is a joke upwards of ten staff crammed into a tiny room, no social distance and no where else to go due to confidentiality. Also breaks the same we don't have anywhere appropriate to go 😔.

Presumably individual doctors and nurses have lodged official complaints at their respective hospitals detailing incidents when they did not have sufficient PPE? You can't have trial by media.

@Thedogscollar, you can’t prove a negative which I’m sure you know. Not quite sure what is arrogant about not jumping on the PPE wagon or telling staff they should be using it appropriately.

We have enough FFP as long as it is used appropriately. Not for walking around the hospital corridors or treating green patients.