Boris moved to ICU

[YeahWhatevver]

www.itv.com/news/2020-04-06/prime-minister-boris-johnson-moved-to-intensive-care-after-being-admitted-to-hospital-with-coronavirus/

old by the government to do something specific like move a patient to ICU

The Government do not tell doctors to move people to ICU. It is the last place anyone wants anyone to be because of the cost and the infection risk both being elevated.

I have been in intensive care and not need ventilation or oxygen - I scared the crap out of a nurse because I got out of my bed and walked to the staff loo at one point - I was there was there was a serious chance I may need to have an emergency ventilation and previous experience had demonstrated that this is not an easy procedure to do on me.

I left 48 hours later, with no oxygen since I had left A and E, had been talking and eating food throughout.

ICU can and is used as a "just to be safe" option too - it always has been.

The Government do not tell doctors to move people to ICU.

I'm sure they would with the PM.

@junipersjuice Well, I am sure you don't have a fucking clue how ICU on the NHS works.

A PP makes a good point. There are a number of DNR requests (my parents for one).

I would be most insulted if I was a nurse at St Thomas and someone told me that I had to give different treatment to the PM as opposed to my other patients.

I think people want to be outraged over something especially if they dont like the Conservatives so what about the worried well, the people who make appointments they never attend. The twits who have too much to drink (alcohol again!) and call for an ambulance or who do something daft under the influence.

The NHS has its issues. I worked as a supplier for a number of years and the waste and endless meetings about absolutely nothing was staggering but do I think a ICU nurse treats people differently because of who they are? FGS - get a grip. Of course they dont!

Agree wi5 you sunglasses, he will get the same excellent care as the other people unlucky enough to be in ICU.

He’s said to be improving and I really hope that’s right...same as any other person affected by this horrible virus,

It wasn’t reported but it’s true. You can believe it, or not, doesn’t matter to me either way. @koshkatt

Well Nochange you will forgive me if I take no heed of some random internet rumour spreader.

@koshkatt Well said and totally agree.

I wouldn’t expect you to. I wouldn’t in your shoes. I’ve never said anything (this comment aside) on mumsnet or anywhere that could ever be perceived as rumour spreading. I’m very careful about sharing links ect and checking sources as there’s so much bullshit around. But I know what I know in this case, and of that I’m 100% sure. Take from that what you will, as I said makes no difference to me.

I hope this teaches him a bit of humility, nothing quite like using a bed pan to make you realise you're not that different to anyone else.

Unfortunately he'll probably just use it to try and ward off criticism next time he wants to do something to fuck up the NHS.

It's really good news that the PM has emerged from ICU and looks like he will recover. Some of the posts on this thread reveal an ugly, tribal political sectarianism. This says nothing about the Conservative government, elected in an 80 seat majority in December, nor Boris Johnson. It does however speak volumes about certain posters.

@bovaryX why the need to let us know about the 80 seat majority. Did you go out and clap as well for Boris to get better and continue screwing the very same people that saved his life?
Boris is still an absolute idiot not only for screwing the nhs (his party) but for being flippant with his personal hygiene and shaking hands.
If that was Corbyn/Starmer/Jo Swinson I’d say the exact same thing without the 80 seat majority (whatever that means).

In fact, lots of the critical posts made say a great deal about Boris Johnson. Especially the ones relating to his stupidity and irresponsibility shaking hands with diagnosed covid patients and his culpability for the NHS being in such a weakened state at the arrival of the pandemic. A majority artificially created by the electoral system says nothing at all about either of these things, however.

@Henrysmycat

Because the sectarian tribalists on this thread are acting as if the government got into power through some authoritarian coup, rather than an 80 seat majority. The niche views on this thread don't reflect mainstream opinion. They reflect the opinions of political tribalists who are incapable of leaving their bigotry behind even when the PM is in the ICU.

The niche views on this thread don't reflect mainstream opinion

We have a first past the post system in the UK, they got their 80 seat majority from a voting minority. The majority of people who voted, didn't vote for the Conservative Party, yet here we are.
And why bang on about anyone not supporting them being "sectarian tribalists"? That's just silly.

Because the sectarian tribalists on this thread are acting as if the government got into power through some authoritarian coup, rather than an 80 seat majority. The niche views on this thread don't reflect mainstream opinion. They reflect the opinions of political tribalists who are incapable of leaving their bigotry behind even when the PM is in the ICU

Well said.

Ffs. As per the way our system works, they got a majority.

And even if they didn’t get a majority of people voting for them (as in more than 50%) they still got the most votes out of any party.
It would be possible to get more votes, and lose, but that’s not what happened here.

You’re acting like labour got more actual votes, but they didn’t.

The Tories won which ever way you want to slice it.

I bet the same people moaning now weren’t moaning when UKIP got like one seat compared to the SNP, when they had many many many more votes.

First past the post seems to be something people only complain about when it doesn’t go their way

This is just you making vague assertions with nothing to back them up though. You've absolutely zero way of knowing this and it's silly to imagine you do.

Nor does the fact that Labour didn't win negate the point that the majority of those participating in the 2019 election, as at most elections in recent decades, voted for left of centre parties. I don't personally buy into the idea that the 2019 election results are at all relevant to the assessment of Johnson's performance and culpability. You can be elected and useless. But if people insist on bringing it up, its 100% valid to highlight the fact that the majority was artificially created by the electoral system.

It doesn’t matter if they voted left of centre parties, because they didn’t vote for the same parties.
If all these left of centre parties had the same policies, they’d be one party, wouldn’t they.

So, irrelevant.
That’s the brilliant thing about statistics.
You can make them say whatever you want to.
As it stands, the only thing that matters is the number of seats.
Which the Tories won.

By a big fat majority

People had the option to vote against first past the post, and they voted to keep it.

Incorrect. It matters colossally when you're pointing out that his majority was an artificial creation of the electoral system and that the clear majority of people voted for parties left of him, in response to people trying to use the 80 seat majority to delegimitise criticism of his party's defunding of the NHS. Responding with yeah but they still won is entirely missing the point. It's as daft as pretending you know anything about peoples history of views on electoral reform.

And I'll tell you what you cant make stats show, however hard you try. Majority support in any recent election for the Tories.

The failure of the AV referendum also doesn't refute the point, not least because AV is an awful system and lots of pro electoral reform people oppose it. Our electoral system creates artificial majorities where they don't exist among the population and this means citing seats won in an attempt to refute criticism of a politician is a poor argument.

Majority literally means ‘the greater number’
So the recent election saw the tories get the greatest number of votes out of all the political parties. Because they got the more than anyone else.

You can pretend it means greater than 50% if you want. But that’s not what it means.