Wanting wife to do more

[Shroppfly]

I’m probably going to get shot down here and that’s okay becAuse I want honesty.

I’ve been married to my wife for 10 years and we have two children. 6 and 3.

I work as a director of a medium sized company and work a lot of hours.

My wife Is a part time student 2 days a week

Kids are at nursery and school full time.

My wife makes dinner in the week and does the laundry. Since she started college she no longer irons.

We have a largish house and two dogs as well as the sprogs.

The house has been hard to keep on top of and it’s been stressing me out.

I know it doesn't bother my wife as much as me so I’ve been taking Saturday morning to totally blitz the house, because I just don’t get time in the week, out at about 7am after walking dogs and usually back just in time for bed time for the kids.

By the time the weekend comes I’m usually filling a bin bag of rubbish before I start cleaning and just tidying the mess takes a couple of hours.

The idea of doing this would be it would be easier to keep on top of. However it’s just meant my wife is leaving everything until the Saturday for me.

I really don’t want to be chauvinist pig, but the simple matter is that I don’t like living in crap and if I was at home more and she was working the hours I am m, then I’d have no problem doing more housework.

I’ve spoken to her about it but she just shuts down on me.

I’ve suggested getting a cleaner but she won’t entertain it.

I feel frustrated by the situation as I don’t feel we ever get beyond just about coping with the house, so it’s disorganised and nothing gets improved - silly things like sorting out draws, putting up pictures etc

I’m bloody exhausted and just want to relax at home. I don’t mind doing the housework at the weekend, but I want the house not be a stressful shit pit in the week as well.

She’s not depressed, she just doesn’t want to do it. When she was doing more (before I started the big cleans) she’d do a job a day so that in reality the house was never in good order all at once.

I Love her very deeply and believe me I’ve got a lot of faults but this one thing is really getting to me.
So there you go, rip me to shreds mumsnetters, tell me I’m being a jerk and how I should handle this. Ta.

So glad you are getting a cleaner.
She can get to fuck. if she won't do it and you want to outsource it then you can and you should.
At least you can have more family time at the weekend now.

@lolasmiles - I used the example of MEds and OU courses because you brought them up as examples of degrees that are manageable alongside work. My point is that I agree they are indeed courses which shouldn't take up too much time - as you say teachers do MEds alongside fulltime jobs - not all courses are like that. I stand by my view that there are many courses which although part-time might indeed take up the bulk of school hours (ie prob no more than 6 hrs per day if she is doing drop-off/pick-up) three days a week, especially if the student is very ambitious. I also don't think we have any evidence she is doing NOTHING over those 3 days -- eg washing, dogwalking, meal prep, grocery shopping.

The comments "I bet it's art" says everything you need to know about the people condemning this woman imho. Her studies can't be anything serious, and she should definitely cut down on how much time she spends doing them so she can do more housework so her husband doesn't have to do any at the weekend.

Put it another way, you would fail a full-time challenging academic degree if you only spent 5 or 6 hours three days a week on it! So the idea she is studying fulltime is just, in my experience of academic study, incorrect.

Her studies can't be anything serious, and she should definitely cut down on how much time she spends doing them so she can do more housework so her husband doesn't have to do any at the weekend.

No. She should be, as any other adult, able to have house to some standard where you don't need to walk around with a bin bag collecting random rubbish and spent hours tidying before cleaning.

Agin. I am astound and concerned about the number of people defending filth as a reasonable standard. However, we all know it's just because the culprit is a woman, isn't it...
It takes 30 min a day max to put rubbish in a bin and do some little bit.

How do you know the house is filthy? Have you been there? It could be OP has higher standards than his wife. Some people see dirt and rubbish everywhere and others aren't bothered.

If you collect bag of rubbish, it is filthy.

Btw I am a messy person, even I can see that this is wrong.
My rubbish goes to the bin right away though...

@bodies yeah, on top of your snide comment suggesting the wife can't be studying something serious, your use of the word "filth" (are you a Daily Mail writer?) disinclines me to take you seriously. There is absolutely nothing to suggest that the house is "filthy" and that the OP is collecting dogshit and rotting fruit as opposed to papers and the odd coke can (the kind of rubbish that accumulates in my living room). Except of course that it's fun to screech 'FILTH! FILTH I TELL YOU!" Jog on.

I consider having rubbish around the house being filthy🤷 You can defend the mess as mucha s you want to, it's still not ok

Well you can use language how you like, but freesheets on the coffee table, for example, is for most people rubbish but not filth. HTH.

Fresh sheets on a coffee table don't go into a bin 🙄

Her studies can't be anything serious, and she should definitely cut down on how much time she spends doing them so she can do more housework so her husband doesn't have to do any at the weekend.

I have every confidence that your response would be much different if the OP were a woman.

We have bins in every rooms, small things, the sort which used to be called waste paper baskets in my youth. Only dry rubbish goes in them. We empty them once a week; it's easy to go round and collect a binbagful of rubbish once a week if you're emptying the waste paper baskets. It's not filthy to have them you know.

I am astound and concerned about the number of people defending filth as a reasonable standard. However, we all know it's just because the culprit is a woman, isn't it...
Pretty much. That's how it works for some posters.

Woman says they're fed up having to pick up after a man, few consider if her expectations are reasonable and condemn him as a pathetic man child based on the fact there's a lot of lazy men around. Even so much as acknowledging her does something is proving that the patriarchy is in action.

Man says that he doesn't mind doing his fair share and certainly isn't seeking a good star for it but would like his wife to pull her weight, he must be wrong. His wife must be doing loads he doesn't see (so he's imagining having to pick up before he can start cleaning), she has a hard time with childcare despite the children being in school/nursery during the day, she must be working full time hours on a part time course and saying part time courses have part time hours is basically promoting scholarly laziness. In fact there's a whole load of possibilities why he must be wrong in the eyes of some posters. At least we haven't had the accusation that he sounds controlling and is clearly abusive.

Thankfully most people on this thread have been fair.

@marginal - nope, my husband was finishing his PhD while I was doing pupillage and starting work as a barrister. I didn't nitpick about how many hours he "should" be spending on his studies and expect him to cut down in order to do the housework. We worked out housework together. Because I am fortunate to be in a mutually supportive relationship.

It's interesting, your assumption that any additional hours OP's wife might spend on housekeeping would necessarily be subtracted from her studies.

Are you assuming that she has no free time?

I'm assuming that her "working hours" are the same as the OP's - ie until the kids go to bed. The OP has free time after the children's bedtime and won't consider doing housework then, so I am allocating the wife the same. I assume that she is looking after kids until school and nursery drop off at say 9am, so gets back home perhaps 9.15 or 9.30 on those days. Then assuming pick up from nursery/school at 3.30 she has to leave college/home at say 3/3.15 and then is occupied looking after the kids and sorting dinner until their bedtime. So on her non-college days she has around 6 hours in the middle of the day - so 18 hrs per week. During this time I am guessing she does SOME housework eg laundry, changing beds, cleaning kitchen/bathroom (which OP does not suggest he does), taking dogs out. So perhaps 15 hrs a week left. Which IMHO it is perfectly reasonable for her to spend studying if that's what she feels her degree requires. Both partners get free time in the evenings. The husband tidies Saturday morning, during which time I guess the wife is looking after the kids. I admit I am someone who values study a lot, but I am not feeling the outrage about this.

"I'm assuming that her "working hours" are the same as the OP's - ie until the kids go to bed*
Which is unreasonable because it's a PART TIME course.
What you're really saying is:
OP has a full time job
OP's wife does a part time course 2 days a week and has 3 days at home childfree during school hours.
Therefore the OP and his wife have the same commitment during the working day.

So perhaps 15 hrs a week left. Which IMHO it is perfectly reasonable for her to spend studying if that's what she feels her degree requires.
2 days at university and 15 hours at home is almost full time study.

I also value studying but I don't believe anyone can claim it's reasonable to be home over half the week, leave mess for their partner to sort out and use studying as an excuse. It's a question of choices. Of she wanted to study full time then she should have done a full time course in 3 years, not do a part time course and then claim it's a 5 day a week thing for 6 years.

Part time courses are not full time hours, nor are they convenient excuses for someone not to do their fair share.

If she actually HELPED him on a Saturday morning, those defending her might have a bit more of a leg to stand on (though barely). But she doesn't. She lets him do it by himself. Presumably sitting on the sofa with a cup of coffee.

2 days at university and 15 hours at home is almost full time study. Well, I think you did a different degree than me, because no way was this "almost" what I did every week for my degree. I had about 6-8hrs of lectures a week, 2-4 hrs tutorials plus an essay to research and write and translations to write each week. I absolutely took more than 30 hrs a week outside class to do this - sometimes a lot more. This was a humanities degree! What happens if you are doing science and have labs etc? Some of the law students at my college were in the library practically 24/7.

I also think it's really unfair to suggest she could be doing a full-time degree. Even the dossiest of degrees wouldn't be possible in only school hours unless you are a mega genius or happy to do get a shit mark.

I'm not saying she should be doing a full time degree. I'm saying if she wants to claim 5 days a week for study then she should be doing a full time degree, not a part time one over 6 years.

It's a piss take to take an open ended interest in study and use it as an excuse not to pull your weight at home.

I have lots of book about education research and teaching. I really enjoy developing my knowledge and it's valuable CPD, but I don't tell DH I couldn't possibly do the laundry because I'm working. It's personal interest and I'd be lazy if I tried to pass it off as work to get out of doing chores.

Both DH and I have done higher studies. Neither of us used it as an excuse to not pull our weight around the house. In fact part of doing part time study involves time management, identifying when you've gone down literature wormholes that whilst interesting aren't relevant to the task at hand so are an interesting extra (so not something you'd sack off your share of the house for and expect your partner to pick up the slack over). And no, that's not having the attitude of doing the minimum, not is it an attitude that gets shit marks. It's a healthy sense of time management and respect for each other.

I don't think they will have that problem now. She saves loads of time travelling to uni so can use it proactively

Sounds like she might be depressed but wont tell you that.
It took me a few years and an episode of nearly going off the rails to Realise I was depressed and a further year or two to confide in my lovely partner.

The house was a mess in that time and I wanted to do it- but i literally couldnt.

If she is a sahm (as i am) and still studying while you are earning she may be feeling dependant on you, resentful that (im only asuming this is right) you have a higher earning potential than her as you are IN work and she is (most likely) paying to study, while being a mum to 2 young children the rest of the time and having 2 dogs who i expect cause more mess.

I wouldnt be quick to say she isnt depressed. I remember feeling so hopeless and trapped.
Do you plan on having more children? This may make her feel like whats the point?

I am almost certain she is feeling more than she is showing because she said no to a cleaner. It might make her feel like you're criticising her as a housewife/ sahm

Plus i expect she is stressing about studying too.