Son & wife's attitude issues

[doyafeellucky]

Sorry, this has turned into a longer post than intended but even then, I cannot describe all the situations and my frustrations.

Ive always been one to think I can work out problems but Im at my wits ends now. My wife and I both love our adult son who is now in his early 30's. Before our son and now wife were engaged and married, we thought we had made her feel welcome in both our home and family.

At first things seemed good. We have no problem with our son living a full independent life but, a number of things have hurt me. Im growing tired of the disregard being displayed by our son towards us and I feel we are being made into second choices. I dont expect our son to put us on a pedestal but think he and his wife should be sharing occasions more between the families rather than seeming to prioritise the others.

Prior to their marriage, I was shocked when we were told his future mother in law was organising a birthday bash for our son and would we like to come along? It was almost an after thought but hindsight suggests it was a hint of what was to come.

As most parents do nowadays, Bank of Mum & Dad, both us and our son's future mother in law helped them buy their first home. I didnt know at the time but her mother and partner were invited to house welcoming meal. We got no such invite which I find upsetting to say the least.

With initial income being tight, we asked if they'd like to come for tea, nothing special, once a month and they agreed. Everything was fine for the first 5 or 6 months. After one meal where my wife had spent time preparing, our son's fiancee decided she wanted to leave straight after the meal. I suggested my wife wanted some time to talk with them as she'd been preparing the meal and just upping and leaving was a bit unfair on her. Apparently that didnt bode well.

Later, we learnt my son's then fiancee started saying we were 'too formal,' whatever that means. Next our son says his fiancee didnt like coming to our home which meant they started visiting us less. When they visit together, they are always on their way out somewhere else or are coming back so they cannot stay long.

I have noticed she is always looking for an excuse to leave as soon as she arrives no matter how much effort we make to talk. She's more interested in her phone and What's App. But I come in useful at times for her being asked to take her to the nearest railway station from time to time.

Now, the last couple of times they have popped around, she has started staying outside in the car, again, meaning we dont get to see our son for long.

The actual wedding was something else, Our family was made to feel like it was there to make up the numbers. Unknown to us at the time, numerous official pictures of the bride and groom with all her family were taken. Despite members of our extended family being present we got 2 official pictures of my wife, our other son and myself with them. Even then, we were an after thought at seeing and being able to order the official pictures and given just 1 week before orders were no longer being taken. That hurt me enormously, goodness knows how my wife felt.

I later found out that during the evening reception when my wife welcomed our daughter in law into the family, she said our family name was 'sh*t' and she didnt intend using it although she does do so in all letters etc. I would probably have made a scene if my wife had told me this at the time.

It's the same at special occasions. 2 out of the last 3 Christmases, we have had to decamp to her mother's home because 'she always spends Christmas at her mother's and couldnt give a sh*t whether her now husband is with her or not.' Those are her words. We invited her family to ours in return for the first Christmas and would be happy to do so again but their plans are already made etc, etc so sorry we cannot make it.

Both my wife's and my birthday are near Christmas. Im not too bothered about celebrating my birthdays anymore. My wife and I had discussed it and decided to mark her birthday with some informal pub grub. But my son then says his wife doesnt like 'pub grub' which is strange because the last Christmas meal was at a pub! So we ended up having a restaurant meal which was nearer my birthday and not my wife's as I wanted.

The last straw is son and wife came around on Saturday to say they are going out with her mother for Mother's Day and would we like them to visit us 'on the way there or on the way back.'

If these events were being held at my son and his wife's home, Id have no problem with this but every special occasion has to be at her mother's home, venue of choice or involvement. We dont even get the opportunity to ask would you like to go out for Mother's Day, anniversay etc.

I find myself hoping my son and wife do not have any children, I am convinced we would never see them while they'll spend all the time at her mother's.

Im at the point now where I consider I need to make my feelings clear to our son. If he wants to consider us as second choice parents, Im not inclined to make him first choice inheritance.

My wife seems prepared to put up with this while Im not as I think it's only going to get worse and we continue to be pushed aside. I really dont know how to broach the subject with my son. I find it hard to believe he doesnt see what is happening here because there are lots of other things going on that I havent covered.

Basically, how should I approach this? Thank you for reading and any input.

I haven't read any other posts but the OP's. I understand this dynamic because it was the same when my brother got married - but not when I did.

My SIL doesn't really get on with our family, she looks down on us a bit. My niece and nephew were kept under lock and key practically from birth until they were about 2. That upset my mum a lot and it certainly didn't help foster warm feelings. I think that's not escalated but has become a perpetual cycle.

We see my brother separately now, he visits my mum often and we don't see my sister in law very often. We all seem to be ok with that.

I think you've picked up the salient points of your daughter in law's feelings towards you and your wife, OP. The 'on the way' visiting is defiant and rude. I think your DIL doesn't want to make an effort with your family and the best thing you could do is to maintain a good relationship with your son and stop trying so hard with DIL. Let her do her own thing and leave her to it. If you chase, she will pull away. I personally don't think you're missing much if she's on her phone when she visits or sits in the car outside. She's very, very rude.

I would ask your son to visit on his own, maybe meet him elsewhere on neutral territory - just him - and tell him that this isn't acceptable. That you're ok with DIL not visiting if that's what she wants but that you want to keep your relationship with your son and you expect him to treat you, his dad - and his mother - with some respect.

Families are tricky. Blood is thicker than water and not all marriages last. Your son will always be your son.

This has only been happening for a few years and it's not that bad but you are talking about disinheriting him! Just tell him you are a bit disappointed he didn't get more involved in the special occasions, like your birthday and mothers day and would like to see a bit more of him. I mean that's more likely to improve things. Say if DiL is busy with her family or anything you'd love to see just him on his own. Your wife will be very upset if you cause a worse rift.

• @NotStayingIn Thanks for your comment. We want to see both of them as we view her as part of our family not some outsider. But it's hard when she's sat in the car outside!*

This is where I think you are going wrong.. But she clearly doesn’t want the same relationship with you so stop trying to force it. Invite ds for things and if she comes great if not no bog loss

@doyafeellucky you can only remedy this via your son. Your DIL is off limits here, unless you want to make things worse.
Quite fairly, she is prioritising her relationship with her own parents and just maybe she’s not one for ‘wife work’ where the woman is expected to take care of anniversary/birthday/Mother’s Day arrangements for her husband too. And I wouldn’t blame her for that to be honest.

That said, she has been indirectly rude to you and your wife. Hard to tell from what you’ve written whether she’s aware she’s offended you. Given what you’ve repeatedly said about you and your wife being laid back, it’s entirely possible she isn’t.

So, talk to your son. Do not make it about DIL. Do not make comparisons or accusations. Focus the conversation on the value you, as his parents, place on maintaining a strong bond with him and, in turn, his DW.

Good luck!

I was going to say similar to Beautiful3, step back. The more you push, the more they are going to pull away. Certainly don't threaten to disinherit your son as it will only damage the relationship further.

Be available and be interested but don't try and force the issue, let them come to you whether that's your son on his own or alongside your DIL.

It sounds to me like you threw in the disinherinting thing through frustration. I really hope you didn't actually say that to him.
What I would do. Leave them to it. I have a son similar age partner, not wife yet I continue to message him as I did before they were together.
If he replies all good if not I let it slide.
I have noticed that he talks to me more now (they have been together 3 years and at first we got radio silence) as he seems more relaxed, he sees her parents as they live closer. They do come to see us, sporadically, no routine in it at all. They even came for Christmas day, so I assume we won't see them next Christmas.
The more you push they more he will back off.
So she sits in the car and he comes in. "Oh is x ok she's not coming in?" or "Hows x doing lately, hope she's well" pretend you haven't looked to see her in the car unless it's obvious.
Keep it upbeat, smile and nod when appropriate.
He will come around, she will have nothing to complain about if she is badmouthing you (I'm assuming this as most people don't tell others your name is shit)
When invited go with a smile, don't forget to invite them to celebrations at yours sometimes too. Even if they refuse, carry on inviting so theres no comeback of you never invite us type complaints.

How am I controlling

Considering cutting your son out of your will so he doesn't inherit, is pretty fucking controlling

Really what your son & daughter in law do (or don’t do) is none of your business.
Keep going with this attitude & they’ll cut you out of their lives. Leave them alone & park your jealousy.

OP, you’re getting a hard time here. I would suggest that the main reason for that is that most people here are DILs themselves, and would therefore naturally identify more with your DIL’s position than yours.

Perhaps you would find a more sympathetic and understanding audience elsewhere?

I'm a dil who hates my in-laws tbh but I still make everything equal for dh and my daughters sake.

From your post you don't sound incredibly formal (my in-laws are) you sound very hurt that you feel like basically a piece of sht to your child. My mum is going through the exact same thing with my brother.

I could gabble on for so long but all you can do is be there for him. Try make extra phone calls when you know she's not there, just to get that "bond" back. Send some texts now and again that you miss them. (Pull on their heart strings, well your sons)

As soon as my FIL text my dh he gets in that "I miss them mode and we end up visiting"

Just don't be overbearing!

She sounds like my SIL. She’s been married to my brother for almost 30 years and treats our family like dirt. I have a pretty civil relationship with her but some of her behaviour is just awful. They’ll visit (maybe 1-2 times a year) and she’ll either sit in the car or will come in with her coat on, refuse to take it off, then sit in the corner pretending she’s freezing cold (in a perfectly well heated room in spring) and looking sad and miserable. We’re a big family with lots of sons and daughters in law and all were welcomed equally so don’t think it’s a blanket case that nobody is good enough for my mother’s son.

None of us are ever invited to any events they throw but then pics will appear on Facebook of them hosting Christmas/new year/Halloween parties for her family and extended family. I used to invite them to events on my house but they’d turn up, announced they’d stopped for fast food on their way (they’re a 20 min drive from my house) and can’t possibly eat anything because they’ve just eaten

SIL is just odd. I’ve lost a lot of respect for my brother because of it all.

It got a lot worse when they had their child (she’s now 26 and we don’t have a close relationship). Be warned. Distance yourself now and encourage your wife to do the same. Also, stop supporting them financially.

Hi Op,

When reading your post the thing that really stood out for me is:

we asked if they'd like to come for tea, nothing special, once a month and they agreed.

To hazard a guess, this is was the tipping point when her pre-existing caution about your family, and your undercurrent of judgement about her as a spouse to your son really caught ablaze.

It was the moment that visiting you became a regular expectation, which makes even the most pleasant of plans feel like a burden.

I've read and re-read your post and comments, and whether you know it or not, your judgement of, and distaste for, your daughter in law is leaking out. And yes she may have fanned the fires by distancing herself from you (which is rude when in someone's home), but I suspect there was always an undercurrent of judgement towards her.

Your son is doing the right thing. He has chosen a life partner and he continues to choose her, not only above you, but above anyone, and that is the work of a good partner and, most likely, a testament to his upbringing.

Do not push him, he will choose her. Do not threaten him with disinheritance, he will never fully forgive you.

I have a similar situation with my son and my niece who is quite close in age to me, has it with her son.

You know the old saying 'A sons a son until he gets a wife, a daughter's a daughter the whole of your life'

Can you meet your son for a drink after work or something? Not so you can have a go at his wife but so you can try and rebuild your relationship. How does your son get on with his brother? If they get on well perhaps he can find out why your son and his wife have become distant?
His wife doesn't sound very nice. She uses you and sounds like she controls your son. However your son is an adult he's chosen to be with her. If she won't make any effort I wouldn't give any more lifts or money. Just say you don't feel comfortable giving lifts and money to someone who doesn't like you.
I would try to rebuild your relationship with your son and not worry about your dil. You tried she isn't interested.

I bet she loves waiting for the monthly forced meal to roll around you are far too formal and uptight!

My in-laws could have written this about their oldest son and his wife. There was rigidity and hurt and touchiness on both sides, but the worst thing that happened was when FIL told his son that it was all DIL’s fault. It wasn’t. She reminded her husband constantly to get in touch with his parents, and he didn’t do it. Yes, she was also v touchy, but tbh the first falling-out was engineered by MIL because she wanted all the second cousins invited to their wedding. I have a massive amount of time for my PIL but that was silly.

Relations are really strained, 15-odd years later and 2 GC. Don’t be my in-laws - tell your son you’d love to see more of them, but fgs don’t imply it’s her fault. Even if it is, you can’t win.

It may be that your DIL is controlling/insecure and so has decided to simply cut you and your wife out of their lives. If so, there is little you can do. By all means have a chat with your son about why they are being this way - but if push comes to shove he will prioritise his wife's feelings and although that is probably unfair it is where his loyalties should lie. Sadly it is not possible to make someone like you or want to be with you however hard you try. I agree threatening to disinherit is not constructive in that it will not have the effect you desire. However, I am not of the opinion that you should feel obliged to financially reward anyone who treats you badly - family or not.

@LyingWitchInTheWardrobe Thank you for your comment. Yes, I agree. I always imagined when my son got married, we'd be two bigger, happier families. Life can be a bitch I guess.

@Fannia Thank you for your comment. Yes, I have to admit the comment I made about inheritance was rash. It was made through the hurt I feel. I love my son and have made sacrifices during my working life to give us all a better life. so, it hurts when I see what is happening now.

To the people who have made positive comments, thank you. I know I have to discuss with my son. Despite what others may think both my wife and I just want to enjoy my son's life and future.

To the trolls, give it a rest and find something useful to do with your life for a change.

I know you say that you're laid back but you're coming across on here as being very prickly and defensive.

The fact is, if they enjoyed your company, they would spend time with you. You seem to think that there's a formula for an acceptable amount of time for them to spend with you, but they are not obliged to spend any time with you. Even if they were, would you want them to spend a set amount of hours with you under obligation? I'd rather have time with someone who genuinely wanted to see me than someone who was seeing me out of a sense of duty.

I can see that it must be very hurtful from your point of view.

I think it's vital to see things from their point of view if you want to move on.

Ideally you would tell them that you are hurt and would like to know what you've done wrong that has upset your DIL to the point where she stays in the car. Ask what you can do to make her feel more comfortable in your home. But you need to say it genuinely and listen to the answer and try and put things right.

I'm not accusing you of doing any of these things, but they are examples of things that might put her off spending time with you (but they are all easily fixed when you know what you've done wrong) Maybe you talk about politics/weather/people she doesn't know/birds too much for her? Maybe you ask too many questions and she's a private person who finds it intrusive? Maybe you have different senses of humour or values?

I suspect, that if you are seriously considering threatening to disinherit you son in an effort to force him to spend time with you the you struggle very much with expressing your feelings, especially hurt feelings (this can be worked on with support)
And/or you don't care what they think or feel, you just want them to do as they are told (years of therapy and self refjection to fix but fixable if you're willing)

This is an incredibly tricky and upsetting situation. I have a son (just a toddler at the mo) and am constantly being told by my auntie (who has 2 adult sons) the old adage "a daughter is a daughter all of her life but a son is a son until he gets a wife". Unfortunately, it sounds like your situation is heading this way. The DIL is just close to her own family and as women tend to do more of the social planning it sounds like your son just goes along with it rather than making his own plans.

The dil has said and done some rude things, but the issues about alternating Christmas I think your son needs to take responsibility for.

I think a calm chat where you just explain that you would like to alternate Christmases would be your best plan. Explain that you find it awkward being in your DIL's parents' home and you would like to be able to relax at home and remember some of your own traditions every couple of years (maybe every 3rd year? One year with you, one with DIL's parents and one with the two of them together on their own). Be prepared though that just because you ask doesn't mean he has to agree.

I think you should leave the inheritance out of the argument. It's like paying your child to spend time with you and he should want to spend time with you without that threat. Plus it will give DIL ammunition and drive a bigger wedge between you all. Being threatened tends to make people dig their heels in and is probably counterproductive as it will make DS more reliant on his in-laws in the long run. I'd be tempted to go the other way... people like to feel useful, so could you invent suggest something that your DS could "help" you with that would give you some 1-on-1 time without DIL being there? Eg "DS, could you help me re-paint the spare room? We could do it over a couple of weekends..." or "DS, your mum wants to buy a new tablet, could you go shopping with her and help her pick one?"

It is also harder for DIL to object to your son spending time with you when you need help.

Hi OP, not much advice but I definitely think threatening to disinherit him is a bad idea and is likely to cause a lot of resentment and probably an end to any relationship at all, which I cant imagine would made you or your wife happy. That's not to say you should feel obliged to leave anyone any money but stating it seems a little petulant.

Im a firm believer in the fact that if you can't choose situations you are in, you can choose how you deal with or react to them. That's not saying you in the wrong entirely but maybe spend some time on how you can make it better. Such as talking to your son on how you can improve the relationship etc.

Good luck, Im sure it will all work out.

This has me lost for words.....
Stop obsessing over how they spend their time or who with.
And leaving your son out of the inheritance wtf

chatterbugmegastar, I can discern the frustration in the OP's posts, his son is being a bit of a dick and is deeply disrespectful of his parents who have done a lot for him and his wife.

Inheritance isn't a right. If more people actually realised and accepted that, it would negate so much of the greedy entitlement that some people seem to have to money which isn't actually theirs.

That’s twice you have called people trolls.

Your son is your problem. He should be spending mother's day with his mother, not his wife's. You're well within your rights to say something, but make it about him not about your DIL.