to be worried about coronavirus part 3

[peridito]

starting this in case ivybush is busy

previous thread
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3819574-AIBU-to-ask-if-you-are-worried-about-the-new-coronavirus-continued

Keepgoing88...we are meant to be going to Abu Dhabi on 31 March. I wasn’t worried but I am now due to the outbreak in Iran. I know that there is a lot of air traffic between the two countries. Lots of other Middle Eastern countries have closed their borders with Iran today but I haven’t read anything yet about the UAE stopping flights.

Was going to book to go to Venice in two weeks. Leaving that for the time being!

Can you see it as a UK trend on twitter

@ofwarren in my trending news section three of the top five articles are coronavirus related, one is the British cruise ship people, the other two are Italy related.

I said this morning it was odd how Italy wasn't mentioned much on BBC, I just don't think it was a ploy to use it to then distract from the new British cases.

We seem to have almost filled up another thread, anyone fancy making another and linking here?

www.reuters.com/article/us-china-health-italy/italy-battles-surging-coronavirus-outbreak-as-cases-rise-over-100-idUSKCN20H0A3

Lombardy and Veneto together account for 30% of Italy’s gross domestic output. Any prolonged disruption there is likely to have a serious impact on the whole economy, which is already close to recession.

Lots of talk earlier today before the train was stopped of closing the border between Italy and Austria. There are also calls from French border towns and from Switzerland to do the same.

Oww ignore me, I think i'm a page early

If I knew how to screen shot on this phone I would show you that there aren't any references to the virus in my trends. Not even when I change it to worldwide. Must be something to do with an algorithm but I would have thought if it was then it would show on mine because I search for coronavirus all the time. Ah well.

RedToothBrush... I read earlier that the Italian prime minister said that he wasn’t going to suspend Schengen as it was disproportionate ..seems like some other EU countries may have a different view!

How does quarantining a town work? If you worked in a different town and your home town was put under quarantine would you be allowed home after work? If not and you had nowhere else to go what would you be expected to do?
Was wondering if say commuters from London couldn’t get back to a town that was quarantined for example...

We were wondering this as DH commutes a fair distance into London. From what we have read about the Italian situation it sounds as though special permission can be granted to enter a quarantined town- we are assuming this sort of thing would apply to family members wishing to return home. Don't think you can leave a quarantine area though (and I think the game would be up if London was hit- really don't think they'd even attempt to close the city).

I think the game would be up if London was hit- really don't think they'd even attempt to close the city

You'd have thought that about Beijing though, wouldn't you?

I read earlier that the Italian prime minister said that he wasn’t going to suspend Schengen as it was disproportionate ..seems like some other EU countries may have a different view!

I've just read how the French health minister is 'monitoring the situation' and is meeting other EU health ministers this week to discuss the situation. I'm reading this as including a frank discussion over the border issue.

Politically I think if border areas are asking their own countries to close the borders and there are other incidents of suspected cases coming from the region (we have the Romania case and this Austrian train) then pressure to close the borders is going to be very strong and it will happen.

Given that Italy were the first European country to stop flights from China, its going to be a difficult thing for them to argue against tbh.

Schegen allows for emergency suspension and reinstatement of borders:
ec.europa.eu/home-affairs/what-we-do/policies/borders-and-visas/schengen/REINTRODUCTION-BORDER-CONTROL_EN

The Schengen Borders Code provides Member States with the capability of temporarily reintroducing border control at the internal borders in the event that a serious threat to public policy or internal security has been established.

The reintroduction of border control at the internal borders must remain an exception and must respect the principle of proportionality. The scope and duration of such a temporary reintroduction of border control at the internal borders is limited in time and should be restricted to the bare minimum needed to respond to the threat in question. Reintroducing border control at the internal border should only ever be used as a measure of last resort.

The reintroduction of border control is a prerogative of the Member States. The Commission may issue an opinion with regard to the necessity of the measure and its proportionality but cannot veto such a decision if it is taken by a Member State.

At the moment the Italian government is arguing it wouldn't be proportionate to reinstate border controls whilst simultaneously declaring a state of emergency and locking down 50,000 people.

It's an untenable position.

Fully expect border checks to be put up in France, Austria and Switzerland in the coming days.

Those countries can not afford not to be seen to do so because it will be politically damaging to them not to, due to public fears.

I think the communist regime in Beijing makes it slightly different, but I take your point!

I guess time will tell.

I think if there's an outbreak near home or work and you hear one person in a suit say "extraordinary measures" it's time to pull a sickie and assemble the the family.

Quarantine, or self quarantine is all very fine, but I will repeat, air travel is the key here.

We can quarantine all we like, but as long as the next tranche arrives from wherever into our airports every five or ten minutes we really don't have any buffer.

whats flight radar showing then?

Italians feel like it's entirely possible that Milan will be locked down (hence panic buying) in the coming days.

The fear of the virus is liable to change behaviours and people be more accepting of a lockdown as they have an expectation of it - public pressure being FOR a lockdown - provided people think this is in their own interests.

Much of this being voluntarily, at least in part.

It depends on how long such a lock down would be for. Anything prologue and I can't see it holding.

As I say it depends on the levels of fear involved.

In terms of whether it could happen in London, I'd watch Milan. I think British authorities will be looking to it as an example if it does happen.

It's about civil unrest as much as health care and this needs to be kept in mind.

Lots of talk earlier today before the train was stopped of closing the border between Italy and Austria.

BBC news just said Austria has stopped all trains from Italy now

We can quarantine all we like, but as long as the next tranche arrives from wherever into our airports every five or ten minutes we really don't have any buffer.

Is shutting down every international airline even feasible?

And how does this stop the problem for land borders?

As an island we simply are not self sufficient enough to close all entry to the country. Most of the rest of the world is also co-dependent on global partners.

I do think half term would have been a huge mixing pot for it and cases will rise after it.

I have been thinking about this today. So many friends and family have been on holidays over half term - Paris, Rome, Dubai, Canary Islands and DN has just returned from a school ski trip in Italy. Once they all get back to school mixing with others that have been travelling the risk of a further cases must be must be higher.

My son came back from skiing in Italy just last night. The airport was just 40 miles away from those areas.

Well it's a great diversion from Cummings, Brexit, and all that isn't it?

Agree golden.

Sorry agree previous comment re air travel in terms of diversion its also diversion from any countries problems and also showing the exacerbations of others as red as mentioned above and open border issues.

At some point I think they'll decide there's no point banning air travel from places that have it, because everywhere will have it, and we do have to bear in mind the implications for generally keeping things going (we need systems to keep going so we get the supplies we need, even while lots of us are going through the illness).