AIBU to ask if you are worried about the new coronavirus? - continued

[IvyBush123]

Here is the old thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3813759-AIBU-to-ask-you-if-you-are-worried-about-the-new-Coronavirus?pg=40

Here is a twitter video from Wuhan I want to share because it so heartbreaking. People happily celebrating shortly before it became known that there was a virus outbreak. There already were some rumors but people didn’t believe them:
twitter.com/WLaowai8/status/1225637845508837377

@Yourtunbridgewells: The info you are sharing (472000 deaths in the UK) is very scary. Is this a worst case scenario.

@justdeckingthehalls: Epidemiologist Eric Feigl-Ding writes that it is airborne on twitter: twitter.com/DrEricDing/status/1226236552059260928
N95 masks help against airborne transmission don’t they?

Just caught up and noticed more and more 'I read that.../I heard that...' appearing on the thread. Totally not a criticism of individual posters but with our sources as Twitter and Reddit and newspapers/news channels which are either behind the curve (looking at you BBC) or making errors (the i on the prisoners), it's no wonder that we're getting conflicting information. The silence from government is pretty deafening at this point and I really think they need to start communicating.

Tbh the BBC and UK press are about 2 years behind anyone paying attention to multiple sources on twitter.

As long as its referenced and reputable I have no problem with 'I heard x'. The key is to reference as much as possible and understand who is reputable.

The problem of the press or government being behind the curve is not unique to coronavirus. Its an issue that effects pretty much all communications now. If you want to find out stuff first, you learn to hunt twitter for multiple sources and cross reference it not rely on the single source of the BBC or the utterly dire government departments who don't know the arse from their elbows.

To be fair I would prefer the delayed but accurate reporting from the bbc (one of the reasons their reports are delayed is to verify and avoid false news) than the reports in my local paper along the lines of ‘Barbara said that her friends neighbour saw a man get taken away by someone in a hazmat suit’

BBC reporting is still slow on reporting official communications coming from government sources and reputable news agencies about cases rather than heysay though.

The prisoner story was ridiculous and you could see it was ridiculous from a mile away. And it was being reported by the tabloid press rather than news agencies.

red do you think the BBC reporting is deliberately slow?

I hate the uncertainty of all this. Worrying doesn't help, but I don't even know whether it's justified!

I'm washing my hands etc etc.

It's so hard to work out how it might pan out, and what to expect.

We've had it with bird flu, swine flu and back in the 1990s and early naughties, it was vCJD. None of those scares lived up to the dire predictions.
This will be our downfall. Past scares came to nothing so people think this one will too, and thus they fail to take it seriously or take proper precautions. This is not the same in terms of contagiousness and death rate, and also in terms of number of people affected. It’s ten times more deadly than swine flu and has killed ten times as many people as mad cow disease.

I know there's a risk, and yes, I'm worried about it, but panicking won't help anyone. We need facts and a plan of action. As the well known saying goes, 'Keep calm and carry on.'

It was very sad to hear my DDs saying that they didn't want to die.

We've had epidemics before and come through it. I'm old enough to remember the days when small pox was still around and it was successfully eradicated. Once they create a vaccine, as they will, things will become calmer.

And meanwhile, millions die of malaria every year with very few people noticing.

red do you think the BBC reporting is deliberately slow?

Yes and no.

The fact checking is one reason, but cuts to BBC news staff mean they are simply don't have the ability to do it promptly.

But I also think there's a desire to tow the government line very closely rather than challenge how badly the government seems to be handling the issue too.

We've had it with bird flu, swine flu and back in the 1990s and early naughties, it was vCJD. None of those scares lived up to the dire predictions.

That means precisely nothing.

It's one thing to reassure children. It's another to tell adults that just because other scares came to nothing it doesn't mean COVID-19 will do the same. Indeed if you look at what's happening compared with past recent scares there are enough signs that this is more widespread and on the very brink of a pandemic.

Adults are not children.

Six malaria deaths in the UK in 2018 - I'm going to go out on a limb and say the NHS won't buckle under the strain.

I hate the uncertainty of all this. Worrying doesn't help, but I don't even know whether it's justified!

I disagree with that as worrying about the virus may be the thing that makes people behave differently.

Six malaria deaths in the UK in 2018 - I'm going to go out on a limb and say the NHS won't buckle under the strain.

I think you've just emphasised the point she was making. Millions of people might die, but we don't care because they're not in the UK.

And meanwhile, millions die of malaria every year with very few people noticing.

If you lived in a country where people are dying of malaria you would certainly notice! It's not a threat here plus we do have medication to prevent it if you need to travel somewhere where there is malaria you can take prophylaxis.

I care about access to healthcare for my children and my family within the NHS, which runs close to capacity in the winter months, in the event of an outbreak which could surge demand past a breaking point.

Malaria isn't usually spread from person to person so I'm not sure why it's even being brought up.

A poster on the prepping board is talking about Normalcy Bias and it really makes sense.
Have a read of this article in Medium
medium.com/@thomasdolphin/surrounded-by-fire-hoping-for-the-best-e7f07fa9d9c6

Humans have a very strong tendency to believe and hope that things will actually turn out to be okay and that the signs of unfolding disaster around them will just go away and things will return to normal. There are extreme examples of this tendency and mundane ones, but they often involve a “suspension of belief” by the person that is so strong (especially in the biggest disasters) that you might find it impossible to accept that they’re not doing it deliberately, consciously and wilfully…

You will too if the shit hits the fan, so don't play the hero.

I know how malaria is passed around, especially since I've had it myself. I'm just saying that there have always been epidemics, for example TB, cholera, in the Middle Ages there was the Black Death, which killed off a third of the world's population at the time.

Chinese flu is simply the latest epidemic in a long line, and a vaccine will be found.

Panicking and fretting about it won't help protect you from catching it. Careful hygiene and avoiding sick people will

People talking about it a lot is not 'panicking and fretting'. It's great that you can reassure your daughters for now, but you might want to plan for how you talk to them if it does get a lot closer to you. There's a good chance it will, and then it being around will be the new 'normal'. Reassuring them by saying this will never happen is fine in the short-term but doesn't give them any resilience for if it does happen.

Also, if you can introduce the extra hygiene precautions early in a matter of fact way now, then they will have time to become habits for the whole family (washing hands as soon as you come home, for instance, or making it a rule that only parents touch door handles and handrails when out - small kids hold parents hands instead). If they can be habits before the virus is widespread locally, then your kids will be better protected when that happens. You don't have to present it as "do this or we dieeee" - just as an important new habit everyone is starting to do. The bonus is you'll miss more ordinary bugs in the meantime.

From www.theguardian.com/world/2020/feb/13/coronavirus-medical-chief-says-uk-hopes-to-delay-any-outbreak-until-summer - the Chief Medical Officer speaking:

"Whitty said that people in the UK should not be changing their behaviour but taking sensible precautions to avoid getting any virus, such as covering their mouths with a handkerchief or tissue when sneezing or coughing and throwing used tissues away safely."

I wanted to shout at the screen when I read that, because taking sensible precautions is a huge change in behaviour for many people. Loads of people just don't bother, even though they know about flu and know that vulnerable people could die. They just don't really care, or think it matters to them personally, so they don't bother.

I would like to see the message from the government being much blunter - basically saying that we know lots of you don't bother to follow the precautions we urge you all to use every year against flu - well you need to change your behaviour right now if we're going to slow the spread of this new disease.

And then, if we all do change our behaviour fast enough, it might actually make a difference.

Alex Sobel MP @alexsobel
Statement As has been reported by @harry_horton I attended the UK bus summit on the 6th Feb, where there was an attendee who has tested positive for coronavirus. Whilst I have been informed that I am at very low risk, I have called 111 to be formally assessed.

As a precaution, we have cancelled all engagements until next Thursday when the 14-day potential incubation period will end. If you think you may have been in contact with someone who has coronavirus, self-isolate and call 111 for an assessment

@ofwarren that's an interesting link. I think in my profession "Normalcy Bias" is pretty much drummed out of people which is good because it's not a very good survival instinct. It's interesting on threads such as these to see how others interpret paying attention to potential unfolding disasters as "panicking". In my experience those who panic ultimately are the ones who didn't see it coming because they were too busy telling themselves that there is no problem.

It's a term I'd never heard of woodchuck but it really makes sense when I read the "it's just flu" type posts. It's something that is studied hugely, especially when preparing for disasters. The papers mention people who stayed behind in Hurricane Katrina and compared it to a rabbit in the headlights type situation.
I've always been a "what if" type person and it's stood me in good stead.

Leeds MP Alex Sobel to be assessed for coronavirus after attending conference with infected patient

Leeds MP Alex Sobel has cancelled all his upcoming engagements after attending a conference a coronavirus patient.

www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/health/leeds-mp-alex-sobel-be-assessed-coronavirus-after-attending-conference-infected-patient-1741206

There's a massive difference between staying behind in a hurricane and not changing my current lifestyle because of a potential viral threat. If someone tells me to evacuate I will do it immediately. I'm watching the coronavirus updates with interest and some concern. I'm sure it will come here and many people will get it. What we don't know is whether it will have become more severe or conversely attenuated by then. What we don't know is what the death rate or complication rate will actually be in the UK as so many factors are different, even down to customs of sharing or not sharing meals from the same bowls, pollution levels and smoking rates.

It's a term I'd never heard of woodchuck but it really makes sense when I read the "it's just flu" type posts.

Yes that is exactly what people are doing when they say it is just the flu or there has previously been a threat with swine flu etc and that was okay so this will be too. It's interesting that those people see those who don't have "normalcy bias" as hysterical or panicking.

Yes, thank you for that. But we still don't know if he's been infected as a result. It isn't automatic that everyone will be infected who has contact with the corona virus, as at least some tests have come back negative.

I'm not going to panic about it, because it won't make us any more or less safe than we are at the moment. We'll just follow government guidelines to the letter, and practise good hygiene, as we always do anyway.

I don't panic because I'm used to trauma, it's been part of my life since I was very small. I'm used to coping with difficult situations.