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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To not allow my son to sleep over at his dad's house?

191 replies

housesharemum · 09/02/2020 17:12

For context: we are both in our mid 20s, DS is 5. We've been split up for 3 years, DS's dad only sees him every 3 weeks and he lives approximately 45 minutes away.

I live in a two bedroom house, DS has all his amenities here and his own bedroom. He has never stayed over with his dad, except during the holidays when they go to ex-dp's mum and dads house.

We have just got into an argument because he wants DS to come and stay with him overnight when it is his weekend. Ex-dp lives in a house share with 4 other men (his university friends), all around our age. I said I would not let DS stay there for the following reasons:

  1. I do not know the 4 other men.
  1. They are mid-20's, so likely to want to drink and bring women home. That isn't appropriate with a small child around. It is also not fair to expect the 4 other men to adapt their behaviour for a small child.
  1. DS doesn't have a bedroom there, so he'd been sleeping in ex-dp's bed whilst ex-dp slept on the sofa. He also does not have any toys, clothes etc. there.

Ex-dp is saying I am massively unreasonable and he should be able to make whatever decisions he wants when it is his weekend. He has said it is not 'cost effective' to drive 45 minutes each way, over two days, every 3 weeks. This weekend they have done nothing (despite me giving ex-dp £10 to take DS to an arcade) because ex-dp can't be bothered to book or organise anything in advance. So essentially he wants the option to be able to take DS back to his house and sit around watching netflix etc. all day.

He also didn't say goodbye to DS because I wouldn't agree to the above, and also insulted me. Irrelevant to my AIBU, but you can understand the type of man I am dealing with.

AIBU to not allow DS to sleep over at his dad's house given the circumstances?

OP posts:
independentfriend · 09/02/2020 19:49

When I was at university, my 9 - 11 year old sister came to stay with me for a night or two most terms. We both slept in my room - airbed/sleeping bag for me and she had my bed. In my second year, I shared accommodation with ten other people - we had a small kitchen. In the other years I shared a building and bathrooms with others.

I have no recollection of there ever being a problem with drunk people coming back very late and keeping us awake or otherwise posing a risk to her. She was with me and perfectly safe.

So, I think you are prejudging house share/men/likely to get drunk quite a bit. Have you met any of these men? Who is studying? Who is working? If it's really a houseful of people in their mid twenties who have jobs, it may not be the drunken party house you're imagining.

I would suggest going to see the house and meet some of the housemates - this will either be reassuring or it'll give you concrete evidence for why it's not a good place for your son to stay.

I don't think it's unreasonable for your ex to reduce avoidable travelling costs/time by having your son stay with him at his house.

Rhea1981 · 09/02/2020 19:50

I understand your concern but I think yabu. You're both his parents so I don't think it's fair that you get to dictate. Does he dictate who you're allowed around the child or does he trust your judgement? Why don't you trust his? If he's been to university with these men then they're not random strangers, they're friends he's known a long time. I think you're making a lot of assumptions that they're all getting drunk and bringing girls home, I know old university friends who house share and they're perfectly responsible people, just keeping costs down while renting. I think you should go and meet his house mates and just have a chat with him to make sure that he won't leave the child alone with his housemates etc. Unless he's done anything awful or put your son in danger before then I think it is unfair to try and stop him and if he took you to court I'm sure he would get over nights. He's both your child so you don't really have anymore say than him unless he's proven himself irresponsible. I can understand why he doesn't want to keep driving back and forth

housesharemum · 09/02/2020 19:58

They do go out and get drunk, go clubbing, bring women home. I had a vague relationship with this group of friends when we were together, so I have them on social media and they are constantly posting photos and videos of their weekend antics.

I just don't think it is appropriate for a 5 year old to be spending overnights in a HMO, with 4 other men, without even having a proper bedroom of his own or facilities.

Ex-dp isn't arguing that he would love to see DS more, spend time with him, do the bedtime routine and stories. He is arguing that he wants to make his weekends (of which he only has 1 in every 3) as cheap as possible.

He refuses to tell me how much he earns and has changed his job several times, he has been paying £50 since we split up. I am currently in the process of taking him through the CMS because he refuses to have an adult, reasonable discussion about finances.

...And I suggested going to the arcade because I dropped DS off to him in a retail park and there is a little arcade with bowling there, I thought it might be a fun activity for them to do together. I went to Blackpool as a child, many times a year on holiday and played in the arcades a lot, I am now thanking my lucky stars I didn't end up as a gambling addict Wink

OP posts:
PestyMachtubernahme · 09/02/2020 20:11

They are mid-20's, so likely to want to drink and bring women home
Two and a half hours later
They do go out and get drunk, go clubbing, bring women home

He has known these friends longer than he has known you. They are not strangers.

Relax and let him start parenting.

TwiceAsNice22 · 09/02/2020 20:35

You are definitely not being unreasonable. I’m really surprised that so many people think you are. There is a big difference between micromanaging/ dictating what your ex does and putting boundaries in place to keep your child safe.

copperoliver · 09/02/2020 20:53

@Karencantobe.
I'm sure I read Op said he gives her £50 per week but we are all speculating as we know nothing of this man, none of us know if he gets benefits or not and just posting our views as we see fit.
My friend has his own flat and gets the majority of his rent paid on a low income that's why I said about his own flat in my original post.
We are all giving our point of view with the facts we have. X

.

Butterymuffin · 09/02/2020 20:59

I wouldn't like this either. Why can't he stay over for the night he has your DS at his mum and dad's house, as happens in school holidays?

All the 'poor lamb' comments over a 45 min drive too. Plenty of people drive that to work and back every single day.

As for:
you either trust his father or you don't
You can trust people up to a point. It's not either 0% or 100%.

karencantobe · 09/02/2020 21:01

@copperoliver No none of us know.
Universal credit will only pay for the cost of a room in a shared house. I have never lived anywhere where a 1 bedroom flat is not a lot more expensive than a room. Although if social housing the difference would be less. But maybe in some places the difference is less.

atomicblonde30 · 09/02/2020 21:02

I thought the same @PestyMachtubernahme story keeps changing to suit the pictures she’s trying to paint. I think it’s sad she won’t even give it a trial run to see how dad gets on with overnights, she’s operating on judgement and speculation instead of hard facts. It’s sad really her son will not thank her for keeping him from his dad when he’s older, I’ve seen it thousands of times.

karencantobe · 09/02/2020 21:02

45 minutes drive is not an issue. Only the OP knows if the cost of petrol would be an issue.

karencantobe · 09/02/2020 21:03

@housesharemum can you apply for proper maintenance then.

Whatisthisfuckery · 09/02/2020 21:29

YANBU OP, and I bet SS/family court would agree. I certainly wouldn’t let my DS spend the night in a house with four unknown men either, even if I did trust his father.

ItsAllTheDramaMickIJustLoveIt · 09/02/2020 21:43

YABU, this is his dad, you once trusted him enough to sleep with him. How is he supposed to build a relationship up with his daddy if you prevent him seeing him?

What? The OP is giving her ex money to take his own son out. That’s hardly preventing him from seeing him Hmm

Speaking of which, stop doing that. It’s a fucking piss take that he takes money from you at all. “Cost effective” in relation to seeing his child every 3 weeks as well? What a wanker. No wonder he’s your ex. More to the point no I wouldn’t be happy allowing my child to spend the night with in a house share with strangers when his “dad” is so immature and shows a lack of judgement. I wouldn’t trust him at all.

copperoliver · 09/02/2020 22:20

@Karencantobe Let's agree to disagree as that is my point. None of us know. Lets leave it at that. X

KipperBang · 09/02/2020 22:26

@Whynosnowyet and you supported this? You're a terrible parent if you do. Ugh

Cherrysoup · 09/02/2020 22:31

Your son must barely know who he is! No to overnights if he is living in a shared house, especially with 20 somethings. I’m thinking back to my early 20s at Uni/first job. Not a child friendly situation. Watching Netflix all weekend, also not child friendly. No. Go through CMS, get proper maintenance and tell him to do overnights at his parents’ place. I’m sure they’d be thrilled to see their dgs.

Graphista · 09/02/2020 23:22

Genuine question - do you think he’s actually honestly interested in having a relationship with his son? In being a father?

You need to be honest with yourself on that one even if you choose not to be here.

Because if the answer is no, based on my own experience and that of many others you’ll see reported here and others I know of in real life, then actually the best thing you can do for your son is NOT to make it too easy for your ex, but NOT to make it too hard either and end up goading him into seeing the child purely to bug you.

It would be better for your child in that instance to let your ex fade out of his life while he’s young enough to forget him.

In hindsight I wish I had been given that advice.

Give him “enough rope” as it were. Don’t give him money to entertain your son, don’t bend over backwards with contact, don’t accept poor contact arrangements.

As per pp I know of several people where the ex took them to court trying to get overnight contact in hmo type set ups and I don’t know of one instance where it was considered acceptable to the court.

The men concerned were told to make alternative arrangements for their contact weekends which were more appropriate or to find more appropriate permanent accommodation.

The setup you describe I am confident would not be considered appropriate, especially for such a young child.

It hurts I know to accept that your child’s father isn’t interested in them but I wish I had done so far far sooner than I did. It would have been much better for dd if I had.

Is his £50 pw maintenance the cms min? If so then he’s on approx £23000 pa which while not a huge salary is certainly enough for him to live in a 1 bed flat in most places or even a self contained studio apartment. It’s not that he can’t afford to be a decent father imo it’s that he chooses to spend his money elsewhere. Ah - and it sounds like from ops update at 1958 he may actually earn more!

“if he's driving for 45 minutes there and back twice over a weekend that's 6 hours of driving” er...you need to rethink your maths! That’s 90 mins a day for 2 days so 180 mins which is only 3 hours! It’s nothing! As op said many people commute more than that daily!

When I was at uni as a mature student when dd was little I once locked myself out of home (lost keys although I suspect they may have been nicked - long story) and some uni friends very kindly let us stay in their shared house for the night. It was fine for one night in an emergency but it certainly wouldn’t have been appropriate as a regular thing with what seems apparent to me to be an uninterested, irresponsible parent who wouldn’t necessarily even think to cover areas like hygiene, child proofing, especially ensuring alcohol and other recreational substances were well out of reach, let alone regular meds like paracetamol and even vitamin tablets which I wouldn’t expect 20-something non parents to realise were a hazard. Let alone contingency planning for a 5 year old wandering in the night in an unfamiliar place, possibly sleepwalking or half asleep.

That one night the other students were very good with dd and as soon as they knew there was a child staying over asked me what needed to be out of reach etc but things were forgotten as they simply weren’t used to being around a young child. I did that thing cautious parents often do of only really “half” sleeping that night next to her (I had the sofa, she had 2 armchairs pushed together forming a sort of “cot”) and whenever dd did anything more than minor stirring I was up and alert.

I can’t see this guy being like that! So no, like hell would I put a 5 year old in that situation!

cowboy · 09/02/2020 23:23

YANBU. It sounds very much like my ex who would never do anything with his dd except let her watch YouTube on his phone and do colouring with an occasional visit to the park if the weather was dry.
I certainly wouldn't be happy about my child sleeping in a houseful of people I'd never met either just because he couldn't be bothered to spend money.

Ferrochrome · 10/02/2020 03:18

YANBU

If he took you to court he would be denied overnight access for not providing a safe place to sleep for his son.

Tell him to take you to court if he pushes the issue. I don't think they would take kindly to his reasons for choosing every 3rd weekend as opposed to EOW

KaptenKrusty · 10/02/2020 07:40

You need to back off a bit and let him parent! You are being controlling. Full of assumptions about the house ! Of course a group of single men go out drinking/clubbing bring woman home - am sure though if they are such good friends with your ex that if he says your son is staying over please don’t being anyone back tonight they wouldn’t

My dh and I have no children together - he has 1 from another relationship - child is now 13 - been in my life since he was 5! When we don’t have him staying over we go clubbing, have parties at our house etc - we don’t do that when he’s here though obviously!

I think you aren’t even giving this guy a chance to be a dad and it’s not fair

Vulpine · 10/02/2020 07:45

How does bringing women home make it more unsuitable

EverdeRose · 10/02/2020 09:54

I wouldn't let him stay either, if he wants his son to stay overnight he needs to make appropriate arrangements. You've made it clear it's because of his living situation and not him.

If he wants to him to stay overnight he needs to sort something out either temporary or permanent.

couchlover · 10/02/2020 10:06

Yabu, he is the childs father and has as much right to decide these things as you. You might not know these men but your ex does, in fact it seems he has known them for years and lives with them. Its up to him to discuss with his flat mates how they feel about modifying their behaviour if they need to not you.

He doesn't have toys and clothes at his house as he doesn't need them, once he does need them I would expect him to sort these things out.

stophuggingme · 10/02/2020 10:09

You aren’t being unreasonable at all.

People seem unable to read that you have no issue with overnight access. They also seem to be unable to read that you have actually enabled him to do things with his son that he couldn’t afford otherwise even you have been mucked about with Child Maintenance.

It doesn’t sound appropriate to me, just to save him a few quid.
Building a relationship with your child also involves being able to adequately care for them in an appropriate, safe and stimulating environment. Being a parent. He wouldn’t even be in the same room as him. It just sounds a bit ill thought out.

And as for sending your children away to a house where you knew they were sleeping on chairs........
there’s being amicable and cool and then there’s don’t give a

stophuggingme · 10/02/2020 10:14

@Graphista that’s a very sensible and well reasoned post.
I totally agree.

When I was in my early twenties I would not have considered it my responsibility to help child proof my shared house for my mate’s little kid once a month. Especially not on a Saturday!

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