AIBU to think these Welsh language requirements are ridiculous (and bordering on discrimination?)

[DimDimDiolch]

Context: I run a micro business in urban South Wales, where I rarely hear Welsh spoken, and many Welsh born-and-bred people don't speak a word of Welsh. I lived my whole life in England (no Welsh lessons at school - or anywhere else!) until about 18 months ago. I've picked up the odd bit of Welsh here and there (diolch, dim, croeso, nos da, bara, araf - that sort of thing) but I'm far from fluent. My business isn't yet big enough to employ anyone else.

My business is the sort of business where you attend events, pay for a pitch and sell products to the general public.

I've now been denied pitches at a couple of events purely on the grounds that I don't speak Welsh, even though literally everyone locally speaks English (except those who only speak Polish or Urdu...). AIBU to think it's a matter of anti-English sentiment, bordering on discrimination, that I'm experiencing? It all feels a bit 'jobs for the boys' to me, when my Welsh speaking ability has nothing to do with the products I sell.

Very similar arguments against the retention, value and use of the Welsh language as are heard and used against the retention value and use of the Maori language. Having read through all the posts I can't see anyone saying Welsh should NOT be retained, taught, valued. It should be, no doubt about that. The loss of Kernewek and the subsequent trails of rebuilding a 'dead' language show that!

Just wondering about throwing the baby out with the bath water!

Not knowing too much about it other than what frinds with some family connections have said (they are white, Scottish and English roots, and really scarily racist) I thought the Maori issues are quite different...

''Wales is not England - legally services provided in Wales must be bilingual - definitely not discriminatory. Its a bit cheeky to think that as an incomer you don't have to support Welsh''

I live in just about the Welshest part of N Wales.. I remember when two of our local Post Offices closed, they had boxes and boxes of unopened and unused Welsh language forms, documents, information leaflets etc

The change in the use of the Welsh language in Cardiff has been relatively rapid. It was only in1978 the first Welsh medium Secondary opened in the city and that was a split site with an English medium school.

I used to live in Chester and I'm learning Welsh on Duolingo for old times' sake. It's good for basics.

I'm from Cardiff and can barely speak Welsh, lol!
Can you not use a 'Welsh - English' translator app on your phone?
As long as you can say Hello, Please and thank you, then you shouldn't be banned from attending.

The language needs to be preserved. My family spoke a Welsh language from the 1600's until 1960 when it eventually disappeared. I would love to speak it but nobody uses it now, so no chance.

@Drabarni Why not learn it online, then you can watch all the 'Pobol Y Cwm' series?

I live in Wales and I am a Welsh speaker. But we are actually quite rare!. Most people who are born here have no respect for the language. When I have visited (more welshy) villages, they have assumed I'm not able to speak Welsh and are so rude because of this!.
One time the lady behind the counter started talking in Welsh talking bad about me and my sister. Her face when we started talking Welsh to each other.

Just looked online and apparently one third of teachers in Wales speak Welsh. Given this is significantly higher than the population as a whole, it does look as if speaking Welsh will make it easier to get a teaching job in Wales.

And comparing the genocide of the Maoris to Welsh people is hyperbole.

I grew up in S. Wales when Welsh wasn't really spoken. The first generation of children who had to learn welsh at school are in their 30s. They were taught by people who couldn't really speak Welsh, their parents didn't care about it, and neither did they. Most of them came out of school with barely any welsh and forgot what they had. Sitting GCSE Welsh was compulsory but unvalued.

However every year since, the amount of Welsh learned has increased. That is the direction. Do you want to get on board, or be left behind?

Nice phrases here...

Forestwitch

I've searched extensively for it but as there's few that remember the language, it's harder to find. I've even contacted organisations researching the language but they don't know how i'd find it now. It died out somewhere between the 50's/ 60's, those who spoke it are long gone, or very old.

This is ridiculous. Just look at it as learning another new skill that will help your business grow.

(Currently learning Welsh so I can give my son the optio of Welsh language primary school and for work, Duolingo is fine, there's even a (free)Meetup for learners. BBC Bitesize is good, S4C with subtitles is good).
The Nadolig Llawen thing can't possibly be true.

Just looked online and apparently one third of teachers in Wales speak Welsh. Given this is significantly higher than the population as a whole, it does look as if speaking Welsh will make it easier to get a teaching job in Wales.

Teaching has long been a popular profession amongst Welsh speakers. But the demand for teachers who speak Welsh is driven by the demand for Welsh medium education, which is driven by parents not all of whom are Welsh speaking.

@Drabarni are you referring to a Welsh dialect from a particular area? I'd love to know more about it.

So you applied to a Menter Iaith event but you don’t agree with their (clearly stated) aims and you being there won’t help them work towards achieving them ?

I really don’t understand why you’re so surprised at this and why you’re making such a big deal of it.

It’s like going to a vegetarian restaurant and demanding a steak.

The language needs to be preserved. My family spoke a Welsh language from the 1600's until 1960 when it eventually disappeared. I would love to speak it but nobody uses it now, so no chance.

The Welsh language has been preserved. There are huge archives in libraries all over Wales containing Welsh language recordings and dictionaries, these dictionaries are sometimes centuries old. There are records in English archives of the Romany language, dating back to not long after the Romany arrived here, in the 15th or 16th century? Also English Cant records, arguably a language in it's own right, that are centuries old. Bar some major catastrophy, they will always be there.

But should people, meaning Welsh people, be forced to learn and speak Welsh if they don't want to?

OP is cutting off her nose here. With a new business there are so many grants and monies available for her especially crafty stuff. My friend does Airbnb. Wanted a four poster bed, no problem just source and provide invoice. Want a computer, no problem. Need a refurb. no problem. The WAG fall over themselves to help out tourist industries.

It's Cale, spoken by Welsh Romany.
It was their own language but spoken from the 1600's when they first arrived from Europe.
As like any other language if it isn't continued by further generations it dies, and it's such a shame.
The families were living throughout North Wales, but travelled down the left of the country (excuse my lack of geography) across to Shropshire.
They didn't speak Welsh, but understood it, and of course over time Welsh crept into the language, but it was their own. There were thousands who spoke it, as there were many large Romany families. Mine were Wood, Roberts, Price, Ingram, Taylor, Williams, Jones, just to mention a few

I'm not suggesting that it should be taught or anything, but as an example of a language disappearing. I don't think Wales should lose the identity of it's own Language and it would be so easy for it to happen.

Also tourists love to hear the language and I'm sure I read the slate mines have been given Heritage status, Welsh as well as English imo should be offered at every opportunity.

No-one is forcing anyone to speak Welsh, all these organisations have said is that she can't have a presence at events aimed at Welsh speakers....which seems reasonable.
It's not as though there's s shortage of English speakers she could do work for.

Flax

Hello, help? can you tell me which libraries to seek. I love you. x
I'm doing a road trip in the spring, visiting my ancestors areas.

I would like the Welsh language to continue to live, to be used. Not just preserved like dinosaur bones in a museum.

Flaxmeadow, they aren't forced to. They'll just do better in certain jobs if they do.

It's Cale, spoken by Welsh Romany.

Which has it's origins in English Romany, the language I mention above. The first Romany families iin Wales were from England. The Woods family in North Wales, the oldest, migrated there from England in around 1700?. But that's a whole interesting and very complicated story in itself.

Hello, help? can you tell me which libraries to seek. I love you. x
I'm doing a road trip in the spring, visiting my ancestors areas.

I would think any library in Wales would be able to help you. Good luck and have a nice trip.