How to explain to friends without toddlers life with toddlers

[Onemorecrisp]

Real examples of convo/ messages welcome:

Current repeating questions: “why can’t we go out for lunch ?”
“Let’s meet at this fine dining place- Just bring the children”
Offering to meet late afternoon
Not receptive to meeting early morning !!!

[TwiceAsNice22]

I think most people can find it hard to imagine how things can be different from their own experience (even some of comments from toddler parents on here prove that!)

My DT’s stopped napping early and were a mess in the afternoons because they were so tired. There’s no way I would have gone out to fancy restaurants with them when they were toddlers. There was also no way that they would ever have fallen asleep in their pram. Not everyone has/had the perfect quiet, happy to listen and not fuss toddler(s).

I had a few friends who really didn’t get my situation (they only had one child and didn’t get the logistics of going out with 2 babies/toddlers). I just explained what did and didn’t work for us. I didn’t expect anyone to revolve their life around me, but the reality was that at that time my life was quite restrictive. The good news is that it gets much easier as they get older.

[Mascarponeandwine]

@EL8888 I think I gave up the futile exercise to compromise, as it just resulted in toddler kicking off if not able to roam around. We basically had a week day rain check until my youngest child went to pre school. It was only a few years really.

Different situation to the OP though, as my friends were up for meeting at the weekend so I could leave the kids with DH.

[CustomerCervixDepartment]

Childfree (not childless) women know what your life is like with a kid, hence why we are Childfree 😄. I’d be in bed at 9am, nowhere near wanting to get ready to socialise or be around anyone’s kid, do you need to bring your child with you? That would limit the places, times and participants hugely unless it’s with women from some birthing group or something.

[Overtheknee]

It’s a bit condescending wanting to find a way to explain toddlers to your friends without them. It’s not like we couldn’t possibly understand maybe your friends are being inflexible because you are. I had a friend who told me from now on she would only meet at specific time/place. It was cheeky so I became unavailable. Not every toddler can’t do it, so don’t try to explain toddlers plural. Just tell them it’s too difficult or expensive to go to ... when it’ll be a nightmare, can we do something else? Also you’ve put up the extra barrier of not wanting to go out in the winter because it’s dark. Come on. Give and take.

[Leighhalfpennysthigh]

I think childfree friends should revolve around you for a short time

I had parent friends who thought that. Note the "had". There should be give and take in all friendships, not just one side always being the flexible one otherwise you'll fine they stop bothering. I did.

[Hugtheduggee]

Its not explaining toddlers though is it, but your toddlers. 9.30am wouldn't work for my toddler as they will still be finishing up breakfast. Lunches work well for us, as do afternoons or early evenings. Everyone's toddlers are different.

[ferntwist]

YANBU

[karencantobe]

OP what about suggesting meeting up for brunch at 11 am?

[thedatinglife]

Does your friend work Monday-Friday op? I'm wondering if possibly friend wants a lie in on the weekend as she's been in work all week, maybe that's why she prefers to meet up in the afternoon instead?

Sounds daft but I work Monday-Friday, don't have any kids so I look forward to sleeping in late on a Saturday morning. I appreciate it's not a luxury people with kids have though so it wouldn't make a difference to you to meet up early. Just a thought!

[ThumbWitchesAbroad]

Sounds like they expect you to just carry on with your life as a single adult with no child, despite having one.

But the best way is to demonstrate the problem - so go on the posh lunch and they'll get it. Take the toddler out during nap time and they'll get it.

[HollaHolla]

Put simply.... I don’t have kids. Although I quite like some kids, I don’t want to lunch with them, or have them along for drinks. It might sound harsh but - I didn’t want kids/couldn’t have them when I did, so it’s not up to me to shape my social life around kids.
If I want to see your kids, well, we can arrange a more child friendly visit.

[EatsFartsAndLeaves]

Ask them to do lunch in a Wetherspoons. There's high chairs, beer, crayons, cheap food, kids meals, basically it works for everyone. It's not absolutely ideal for everyone, but once they've been out with you and seen what it's like they should have a bit more of an idea of why this is as good as it's going to get for you for the next few years.

[EL8888]

@Leighhalfpennysthigh exactly this

[Jennifer2r]

I am happily child free but I like driving over to friends houses to play lego with their toddlers and other such things.

Please don't tar us all with the same brush.

[Lizzie0869]

@Jennifer2r I've got a cousin who is very much like you, happily child free and enjoys being a favourite auntie to all the children in the family. She lives overseas so we don't see her much, but when we were on holiday there, she was a great hit with our 2 DDs.

There's a tendency to pigeonhole people in boxes, which is ridiculous, as we're all individuals.

[PurpleDaisies]

It’s so lazy to attribute this to her not having a toddler. Even if you don’t have your own, plenty of people will have experienced other people’s, or actually listen to their friends when they’re talking about what’s going on with them.

You don’t need to have a patronising chat about what life is like with a toddler.

[ToooRevealing]

@HollaHolla fine, just you have to then expect to see your friends only when they can get childcare. If you said "I don't like work, I don't work myself, so I don't want to be inconvenienced by other people's office jobs" - then you'd have to only meet at times when people could fit around their work. No drama.

Im in the middle of a disagreement with That Precious Inflexible Parent Person (Who Used To Be So Much More Fun). She can't see why l don't want to spend weekends off doing what she wants. My partner and l don't get every weekend off and work hard

Your friend doesn't get ANY weekend "off" - the thing you see as her leisure choice is actually part of her non-stop responsibility. It's fine not to want to hang out with kids, but your friend simply doesn't have the option of compromising further. Your time off is still her "work".

I confess it feels precious when a child free friend says "I have only Saturday off this fortnight & couldn't possibly manage 2 hours in soft play". If I am at work all week & looking after toddler all weekend that sounds great! I hear that as "I have 22 hours this Saturday to do whatever I like, and that isn't enough".

Soft play cafes etc are not "what she wants" to do. They are the easiest way for her to discharge her 24/7 responsibility.

[HollaHolla]

Absolutely happy to only see friends with kids when they can get childcare - If we’re going to lunch/drinks. If it’s more casual, then yes, happy to go to theirs/another friends.

I do think it’s disingenuous to say childless people have all of their hours ‘off’. Some of us have other commitments (study, etc.), or caring responsibilities for other adults, etc

I really feel it’s not a race to the bottom, but, the kids of my friends are not my responsibility.

[ToooRevealing]

completely agree - people have lots of responsibilities they can't swerve. This is my point, when someone has more on than me I compromise with them. You're taking care of aged dementia'd mum - I'll come to you with toddler. Person A works hard all week, has no caring responsibility, and fancies a lie in on sat, but actually could flex their schedule to nap later in the day - I would say it is precious not to accommodate the more restricted person.

[ToooRevealing]

Also- big condolences for anyone who is not child free by choice- having to accommodate children can feel very hard under those circumstances. xx

[EL8888]

@ToooRevealing how did l know that comment was coming about her never having a weekend “off” ever. She did choose to have children though as it is a lifestyle choice and she chooses to never leave them with their Dad. Years into this and lm a bit sick of it. I have tried to be accommodating but like l said earlier in the thread, why should 1 person always get stuff their way? Sometimes l will want to do stuff she can’t / won’t do e.g. go to an exhibition so l will do that, not invite her as she won’t come or will invite her. But she will say “it’s not suitable” then suggest a 8.30-9.00 meet up doing something l would never want to do. But yeah she made her choices so why make it into a big thing?

The interesting thing is other friends with young children are not so hard work. So we can find a mid-ground e.g. the park on a nice day, lunch at mine etc. It’s this one particular friend who is always so difficult

[EL8888]

I have sometimes worked 7 weekends in a row. I’m hardly “precious“, l just want to spend my limited time and weekends off doing something relaxing. Rather than dancing to someone else’s tune which is too much like being at work l think

[Lizzie030869]

@EL8888 I agree. I don't remember ever having this kind of conversation, either before adopting my DDs or since. You arrange a time convenient to both parties and do it. It's always possible to make it happen if both parties want it to, that being the key factor.

I've never experienced this amount of difficulty in arranging to meet up with friends.

[Lizzie030869]

It's certainly not something I'd ever do a Mumsnet thread about, it's just life, isn't it?

[Lizzie030869]

In my experience, you just have a look at your calendars and work out the dates and times. It's actually always possible if both of you are not completely inflexible.