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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To insist the kids are not equal?

298 replies

Elsielouise13 · 19/01/2020 21:45

Inspired by thread about sitting in the front of the car...

One thing I am fussy about when it comes to choosing seats is in a restaurant. I can’t stand it when children rush to seats ahead of adults in a restaurant and ‘bag the best options’. When we go for meals with friends I’ll always insist to my children they wait til the adults have chosen their seats before they sit down.

Several times I’ve been out with other parents who let the kids decide the seating and then struggle in and out for the duration of dinner.

I’ll be fecked if I’m paying for a meal and miss out on watching the room and get to only see my husband and the wall behind him.

And in our house the adults are the ones doing the adulting and that’s why my children spent most of the afternoon messing about about and I ironed school shirts.

OP posts:
aSofaNearYou · 20/01/2020 18:51

I broadly agree with your mentality, though for somewhat different ways to the ones you have described. I don't think it should be about adults coming first because they are "better" or want to "first pick", but generally children do need consistent reminders that they should not automatically always come first. They can be quite selfish by nature and do need to be taught not to be.

People always say pick your battles but I say you need to pick your lessons also. If my child barged past everyone to get to what they knew was the best seat, I wouldn't be bothered because I deeply wanted that seat, I would be bothered because it's rude of them to do things like that and they need to learn to at least ask nicely.

Drabarni · 20/01/2020 18:57

Equal doesn't mean the same.
My kids have always been equal to adults in many ways.
Love, time, basic needs, luxuries, finance, everyone in my immediate family is equal.
You can still teach/model good manners, and social skills.

mbosnz · 20/01/2020 18:57

@JacquesHammer

So, if the two adults in the house knew that the best decision most likely to achieve a positive outcome was A, but the two children (not having access to all relevant information, or perhaps the life experience to be able to correctly weigh and assess the relevant information even if provided with it) were adamant that they wanted to go with B, what would you do in that case?

JacquesHammer · 20/01/2020 19:01

So, if the two adults in the house knew that the best decision most likely to achieve a positive outcome was A, but the two children (not having access to all relevant information, or perhaps the life experience to be able to correctly weigh and assess the relevant information even if provided with it) were adamant that they wanted to go with B, what would you do in that case?

I dealt with that earlier. I said sometimes stuff goes “my way”, sometimes stuff goes DD’s way. When stuff goes my way it isn’t because I’m the adult, it’s because we’ve discussed the whole situation with all parameters and made a decision together.

Works perfectly for me and DD and there’s never been an issue in 6 years.

mbosnz · 20/01/2020 19:02

Oh, and not being snarky, generally interested - because that was the situation we were in!

mbosnz · 20/01/2020 19:03

Gotcha.

bringincrazyback · 20/01/2020 23:12

Mine is being brought up to understand that respect should be earned and not given

Not from child to adult, imho. Children respecting adults should the default imo (although obviously the adult may subsequently lose the child's respect if they behave poorly towards them, or if they prove themselves unworthy of respect in general). If that default respect isn't there to begin with, the child isn't going to obey the adult or be receptive to learning about life from them.

differentnameforthis · 21/01/2020 01:17

You: where shall we go on holiday?
Dc Australia
You: Darling we can't afford Australia
Dc: but my opinion is just as valid as yours

That whole sentence is how it plays out tho, isn't it? You simply state that while Australia would be nice, it isn't affordable. But their OPINION that it would be a nice holdiday destination is not less valid because it is too expensive.

You seem to think that dc having opinions should always = dc getting their own way. That isn't how it works, but my children do have a say in what they would like to do.

@AlexaShutUp Why can't people understand that giving equal weight to children's wants and preferences doesn't mean giving them everything that they want.

I know, right!!

@bringincrazyback Children respecting adults should the default imo

But they shouldn't be expected to respect them just for giving birth to them, and loving them as suggested below. if I do nothing to earn respect, I don't deserve it. It is not something that someone is entitled to simply by default.

Lizzie0869 · 21/01/2020 06:02

bringincrazyback Children respecting adults should the default imo

Not the default, it does need to be deserved. My F told me that I should never say no to adults, including those who he was allowing to sexually abuse me like he was. I know that's not what you mean, but if you push that view too hard, they won't be able to tell you if someone (like a friend's dad or an uncle) is abusing them.

My siblings and I didn't tell my DM, partly for this reason.

Lizzie0869 · 21/01/2020 06:07

It could be your partner, too, sad to say. You really need to be careful not to insist on respect for adults by default. Politeness, certainly, children shouldn't be rude, and yes, ordinarily a child should give up the front seat. And seemingly normally this girl does, it was just on this occasion that it didn't happen. So there was probably a good reason, which the OP didn't wait to find out,

damnthatanxiety · 21/01/2020 09:58

People seem to be misunderstanding or having different ideas of what 'equal' means. Are children equal in value as human beings? Are they of equal importance and significance? Yes. Of course they are. Are they equipped to make the same level of decisions on behalf of themselves and the family. Of course they aren't. They are developing. We are guiding. We are the CEOs.

AlexaShutUp · 21/01/2020 10:10

We are the CEOs.

Ugh!

bringincrazyback · 21/01/2020 11:17

Not the default, it does need to be deserved. My F told me that I should never say no to adults, including those who he was allowing to sexually abuse me like he was. I know that's not what you mean, but if you push that view too hard, they won't be able to tell you if someone (like a friend's dad or an uncle) is abusing them.

I know what you mean, and I'm so sorry for what you went through. Flowers

TheSoapyFrog · 21/01/2020 11:22

I honestly struggle to find anything I care about less than who sits where in a restaurant.

corythatwas · 22/01/2020 09:19

I have no problem at all with the basic ideas that adults are adults and make decisions. But all this fussing over minor details looks a bit desperate to me, as if you weren't all that sure of your position in that relationship.

dsdddhdcat · 22/01/2020 09:24

Sorry I can’t face reading the whole thread, but what does ironing the school shirts have to do with the restaurant seating issue?

Notborisjohnson · 22/01/2020 09:27

Hmm they are humans too. Not minions or pets.

Glad none of my friends or family are like this. It would be miserable

FishCanFly · 22/01/2020 11:48

In my family the kids must sit together on a separate table

How big is you family if one table isn't enough?

Durgasarrow · 22/01/2020 12:05

I agree with you.

Bluntness100 · 22/01/2020 12:38

I have completely the opposite view. I brought my daughter up by treating her with respect and as an equal, to make sure she knew her opinion mattered. In return she learned to treat others with respect, to listen to their opinions, and understand their wants and needs.

I never have to ask her to give her seat up, or to give her bedroom up if too many staying, because she learned to treat others as she herself wished to be treated,

Treating your kid like they are not your equal, that their needs don't count, yours always come first, is simply going to ensure they continue the cycle as adults and behave selfishly when they can.

FizzyIce · 22/01/2020 12:46

But wouldn’t you also teach her that now and again we have to make sacrifices to help others ?
I would ask dd to give up her seat if she was small enough to still sit on my lap if we were on a train or something and she has given up her bed for an older cousin but she was happy to as meant she could use her Ready bed . Again ,that’s all give and take

FizzyIce · 22/01/2020 12:47

Sorry think I misread your post ..

ChaosisntapitChaosisaladder19 · 22/01/2020 12:50

Goodness you must have a sad lifenifnthisnis you're mindset. When we go out with the kids we sit wherever Biscuit

MsTSwift · 22/01/2020 15:00

I sometimes wonder if the pendulum went too far “children seen and not heard” in our grandparents generation too in favour of adults was broadly about right in the 80s and 90s now too far the other way in favour of pandering to kids which I see alot of in my peer group. Weirdly doesn’t seem to make the kids particularly happy or secure either lots of anxiety etc

corythatwas · 22/01/2020 16:24

When it comes to seating in a restaurant, I am with earlier generations of my family (and I'm not talking 1980s and 90s, more like 1930s and 40s) who regarded this as a training exercise in good manners. You sit with adults, you eat nicely, you make polite conversation, the assumption is that you can be pleasant and interesting to your own family, and eventually to others, and that you jolly well should be.

The aim being to produce young adults who (unlike so many Mners) don't whinge if they have to entertain a stranger during a wedding reception or similar (unless of course there is SN).