To think it’s normal for high earners to get home late/work long hours?

[NCDays]

SiL got a new job last year which was a significant step up from her previous role and she now earns enough to pay additional rate tax (so must be £150k +). The job is in London which is a 30-40 minute train journey away, plus a short tube journey to her office. Over the past year we’ve constantly been hearing about “poor SiL” / “life is unfair to SiL” from MiL and the rest of the family as SiL is not home most week days until 8pm and leaves for the day at 6am. It’s supposedly a 9-5 job, she’s only a year in to the role and is apparently already exhausted and drained from working longer than her contracted hours and struggling to cope with the constant train delays/cancellations on top of that, meaning she has no time for herself or her hobbies during the week. I should point out that SiL is 29 with no DC, so she’s certainly not coming towards the end of her career.

AIBU in thinking that this is all pretty standard stuff and par for the course for successful, high earning city worker?! The rest of the family seem to think I’m mad in thinking it’s to be expected.

Completely normal, and not just for the young! My DH is, ahem, much older than that. Leaves house between 6;45/7 every day, home 7:15ish. Works a bit nearly every weekend, and if things are kicking off in the evening to. It goes with the territory. If she doesn't like it, that's fine, she can take a step down.

We have the same in our family. BIL is the hero for working hard, making millions (literally - penthouse in London, massive country house, overseas properties) but somehow they're the ones that get all the 'poor BIL he works so hard and they are really strapped for cash at the moment' from the family. DH does similar hours, plus travel, but if he complains at all about being tired etc gets told off. Its bonkers we've learnt to laugh about it because otherwise it would make you crazy.

Having had a job like that - but as a graduate so earning nowhere near 150K - I think you are being unfair. It's very hard to do those hours 5-6 days a week (yes weekends are often necessary to make deadlines). You basically lose all of your friends outside of your industry because they all can meet up for drinks at 7 while you are still in the office, or they can stay out a bit later because they don't need to be at their desk before 8 AM. And it can affect your health as you often don't have time to eat well or exercise.

What jobs?
Higher rungs of software development or marketing, for example. The value added at that level is not because they are able to keep jumping 1 foot up for 14 hours straight, but in that they accidentally are able to jump 2 feet up and see over the fence.

Why do you so many high earning City workers burn out? It's tough & by their 30s some people have had enough.

Sounds pretty normal to me, based on my experience of working in London, plus she's got a commute. Hobbies in the week is a mere dream in our house!

My DH and I live and work in London. My DH works for a large firm in the city, he works a 10 hour day most days, when he's contracted the standard 7 hours. He is quite often in the office still at 7pm. Luckily his commute is only 40 mins door to door. That's why we are not moving out of London, ever!

I think it is pretty normal and I made the decision that I didn't want that sort of life, and my earnings would be limited accordingly.

My friend who is in law wouldn't think it was unusual if she had to work 9am to 3am. She still gets up at 6am to go to the gym most days and I think she might be an alien, but she does also have a massive 5 bedroom house in London that I am insanely jealous of.

Different strokes etc. I've always thought that money isn't much good unless you have the time to enjoy it (and not just when you're retired) and that might be what your SIL is now realising.

Yup - par for the course in our house too. I'm out of the house for about 11-12 hours, DP for 12-13. We're exhausted during the week and struggle to do anything more in the evening than dinner, TV and bed. Thankfully no DC or it would be even more exhausting. We both enjoy our jobs and are paid well for them, so we let off steam by taking really good holidays every year to recharge our batteries.

Do I wish I worked shorter hours? Of course, but I accept it comes with the territory of the job.

None of our relatives say "poor CharmingB" though as they understand the trade off. They may occasionally say "I don't know how you do it" but nothing more than that.

YANBU OP!

Bog standard commuter experience I think - which isn't to say anyone enjoys it.

My experience is that extra hours come with any post above entry level though. Any junior management or technical specialist position expects people to get the job done, rather than work to contracted hours. There are often unsocial hours, time away, occasional weekend work too. All that is normal for jobs paying £25k+

So someone earning at your SIL's level is probably lucky not to be working to 8-10pm every night.

Do your PIL also think that people on average incomes can afford nice semis in the home counties? Or that final salary, or at least defined benefit pension schemes are the norm? I suspect their heads are in a different era. That or they're very unworldly and naive.

There plenty of City jobs in the 50-70k range that don't force you to work long hours and give you plenty of flexibility. I should know as i have one. If she doesn't like the hours then there are alternatives, but at a conduit financial cost.

I have a friend in different field to finance who took a new job and went from a 50k 9-5 job to a 300k job. Her job is now her life 24/7. She understood that and has realistic expectations that she won't do it long term, she's taking the cash while she can

Very normal. I couldn't live that life personally but it's very much expected now.

Perhaps I should claridy that my 'extra hours is normal for jobs paying £25k+' refers to outside London. Also, in the third sector, long, unsocial and extra 'voluntary' hours, for very low wages, are normal.

It's normal, but that doesn't mean it's ok.

Difficult to know what we can do about it given that the bosses will never stop exploiting their workers and people are so desperate for money that there will never be any shortage of people willing to work themselves into the ground for them.

Thinking about high salaries & long hours it's very prevalent in Banking & Law. Having said that I know some consultants in the NHS who have a good work life balance & 2 friends in tech who earn high 6 figures but don't work really long hours.

It may 'par of the course' but support her. Be happy for her, that she has got this far! Why is she not entitled to have a little moan, now and again. I have worked those sort of hours, and beyond running a hotel. On so less money than her, believe me. If I was, in those days, to work out my hourly rate. I think I would commit suicide, believe me! Why are you posting against your SIL? Families, who would have 'em??

I'd say it's normal (but that doesn't mean it's right).

I did through my 20s and early 30s. It was tiring but at that age I could bounce back pretty well. I had a role with a better work life balance when my daughter was young. I'm ramping up my career again now (mid 40s) and feel the late nights much more. I had a midnight finish a few days ago and I think I am still recovering.

Yes, normal. I earn similar but I'm 45. Out of the house at 6am, back at 7pm (I now leave the office at 530pm after leaving at 7pm for years). I have a 1.5hrs commute one way. I have Fridays off otherwise I would probably expire. Pretty standard hours for the City.

It's not an unusual scenario but she is obviously finding it quite exhausting so I feel sorry for her in that respect. It's difficult sometimes to find quite the right job, giving a good work/social life/rest balance.
I don't think it is your place to judge, you don't know how she feels. I burned myself out doing a pressurised job, I liked it but was always working late plus commute and if had my time over again, I'd not do that. It didn't help my health.

Your sister in law will have to work this out for herself - she may be fine in a few months, who knows. However a bit of care and kindness for her is a lovely thing,

I work similar hours - out of the house for 12 hours a day - and earn about 35k in London. I’m in my 50s and do struggle.

Dh is in his 50s and works these hours (and often weekends too) as a hospital Doctor. People saying “it’s a choice” well sometimes it isn’t. And actually no the pay isn’t particularly worth it, and the stress and exhaustion really take their toll.

Agreed with Diegosaber - just because it’s the norm for these firms, doesn’t make it ok. I’d hate to work in a culture where you are expected to work many unpaid hours. I’d moan too, if it were me. I earn a high salary and don’t have to stay after my contracted hours - I don’t see why it’s acceptable in some jobs.

I should mention I am child free but have two dogs! with a husband who works from home so he does a lot for me. I don't know how couples who both work similar hours to me with kids do it. Hats off to them!

It's very obvious that a job like that is going to be lots of hours, lots of stress. You choose that lifestyle, I can't imagine she is surprised. She could always move to somewhere close to her office.

Sounds like your MIL is doing a weird stealth brag about how successful she is, or SIL is just constantly complaining.

My brother and I are close in age, he chose this life, I chose a more creative career and now self employment. I earn a good wage, but not 6 figures like him and it's always 'poor me' - nope, you have exactly what you wanted!

Normal

Sorry I'm not sure which PP said that these jobs don't tend to retain mothers. So, so true.

I know a fair few 'power couples' who met in banks in their 20s. Were earning the same salaries. The women are now SAHMs because it's too difficult to keep two roles like that going. You'd never see your kids.

At 29 and on over £150k I think you pretty much have to sell them your soul. There will be lots of people willing to do it queuing up behind her.