To ask what you are supposed to do

[drspouse]

DS has an EHCP.
It's not very good and we have a tribunal coming up.
He has some challenging behaviour. We admit this and we are doing our best.
He moved school in Sept after we looked at 8 new schools, including 4 special schools.
The new school has just permanently excluded him. They have not tried all the suggestions of EP, OT etc and we know this is illegal but it doesn't help with the fact that he now has no school.
They are suggesting he goes to the PRU. I'm sure it's very nice but he has only just started to settle at the new school.
He's 8, in year 3, and loves to play with his teddies. We were told some of the older children at the SEMH schools we looked at had pulled knives on teachers. If there's any child like that at the PRU it will break him.
We both work, I've just been told I can't reduce my hours any further and DH has just started a secondment which will be for a year. The PRU has no after school club. We both have meetings at any/every hour of the working day. Giving up either of our jobs is not an option.
So we can't HE (and we don't want to, and we shouldn't have to, and it would be awful for DS).
What are parents of a child with SEN actually supposed to do? Is the idea that we are both supposed to sit at home with our child and keep him away from other children/schools/the public? Are we not supposed to work? Is the country going to pay us our (fairly high, which is partly why we aren't giving up work) salary for not working?
Note before you suggest it: yes we know we can look at out of area schools. We did, they are included in the ones above. We live quite rurally. We can't move (I have tried to move jobs for years). But we need school for DS NOW. Not in 6 months time after we've moved/fought for a private school place (there are none suitable anyway)/I've lost my job.

@sleepismysuperpower1 I have already answered that.

@drspouse I'm genuinely at a loss as to why people are trying to help you on here given how rude you're being. If you don't want to listen to people's advice, don't ask for it!

Op is it possible for one of you to go full time and one take a sabbatical until things are more settled.

From seeing my dsis struggle against exactly the same situation (I posted further up your thread) I know there is no easy solution. Residential SEN school is the only possible solution for my nephew. Nearest one is 30 miles away, waiting for a place and have been for 18 months. He's done mainstream, mainstream with support, PRU, SEN school fulltime, SEN part time. Non work, he either gets excluded or refuses to go. The last SEN school was so far removed from what he needed dsis walked out after 10 mins. Said it would have been a masive safe guarding risk for the other dcs (mainly severely physically disabled, much younger than nephew). Fortunately the head agreed after watching nephew have a meltdown in the car park and attacking dsis car.

It's wrong, it's unfair, it's illegal. But the reality is there are very few schools that can cope with the type of needs your ds and my nephew have. Nephew is high functioning autism with PAD and ADHD. Plus dyslexia and some other learning difficulties.

He's also a big, strapping 11 year old now. Incredibly strong and fit, has absolutely no fear, climbs like a monkey and is frightened of no one.

At his PRU placement he escaped from the secure, padded room they had put in for him by going through a ceiling hatch. Then got onto the roof of the building. It took the police and fire service to get him down. My dsis is about 2 stone lighter than him, lives alone with him and is absolutely on her knees with it all. She phones the police (as advised by the mental health crisis team) at least once a week to come and help her when he's smashing the house up. Her car is usually undriveable because he's either smashed the wing mirrors off or put the windscreen through. Her house is more holes than wall. She has no internal doors left. The council have stopped replacing her windows and offered security shutters instead.

SS don't want to know. The LEA don't want to know. CAHMs don't want to know. The police are the only ones who have offered some support and have said that they will take him, then the only thing she can do is refuse to collect him which will mean he will become SS problem to solve. But no foster family could cope with him and he will just walk out of residential foster homes. The only hope she has is a secure boarding SEN place which are like rocking horse shit.

It won't be a solveable problem for you in the short term. Take some time off sick, assess your options realistically and then decide what you want, what's available abd what is possible. It might get worse beforw it gets better.

Dsis is 3 years post diagnosis of autism, 2 years since the PAD and ADHD diagnoses. He's had serious issues since he was 4. Even once he's an adult she will be his carer. It won't stop once he is 18.

My job requires core hours availability and DH commutes which turns a half day into a full day so his part time is full days. I've already asked for more half days and been told it's not going to happen. I actually have two half days and I am never going to get more.

You’ll likely already thought of it/tried it but I wonder if instead of half days it’s posdible for you/your DH to negotiate 3 days/week or two longer days per week. The reason for saying is that my workplace wouldn’t consider school day type hours (because I’m needed across the working day) but happily agreed to a 2/3 day split meaning that we only need 2 days childminder to collect from school. It was just easier for my work to know there were days I didn’t work and to get a job share for the other half.

If I’d asked for half days up front they would have refused but will accommodate me being a bit later/leaving earlier on occasion because it’s 20 mins out of a 7 hour day instead of 20 mins from a 4 hour day if that makes sense. Half days will have made perfect sense with previous schooling arrangements but things have changed drastically.

Might be worth looking at a complete change of work pattern rather than trying to adjust what you have - if your employer will play ball.

@Frouby while non SEN parents won't see the difference, my DS is not even in the same city let alone the same ballpark. For which I'm very grateful. One of the SEMH schools we saw thought he was too "good" for them and when he has a good TA he's calm, he learns. We take him to church, he goes to the shops, he has a birthday party, the boys at his school ask him to sit next to them at Beavers. He's made massive academic progress since Sept. It's only when his triggers aren't handled or considered that he's aggressive. He coped well in Reception and Y1. He's getting calmer as he gets older - we are worried about the teenage years but I don't think we're that concerned about him getting too big to handle as we rarely need to actually handle him.

It's only when his triggers aren't handled or considered that he's aggressive.

That’s the problem though with schools and teachers that aren’t trauma informed - they don’t get that fairly normal things can trigger a child into fight or flight, especially if the child otherwise looks like they cope.

You said the PRU is for pupils to find a plan to move on, but won't send DS there because he doesn't have a plan for what's next. Surely you'd get a plan for what's next once he attended the PRU?

In your shoes I'd take the PRU and at least try. Right now you have nothing. Something is better than nothing. DS might be absolutely fine, he might make friends. Until you try you can't know for sure. Or you give up your job and tutor from home for the time being until you make it to tribunal. Yes what has happened shouldn't have happened but you can't undo the violent incidents, only learn from them going forward to find the right environment for your son. Now the exclusion has happened it's not going to be undone. It's a crap situation, I understand your frustration and anger.

I'm saying this as a parent of a child with SEN and as a professional who works with SEN children.

You said the PRU is for pupils to find a plan to move on, but won't send DS there because he doesn't have a plan for what's next.
It's for pupils who are either on dual registration or who already have a plan.

I agree so much with jellycatspyjamas posts.

I'm so sorry this has happened to your DS OP. I'm appalled his school has handled this so badly, especially given his background. I don't want to assume anything, but I know some adopted children can be particularly sensitive to rejection (which is how an exclusion can appear to them). Which makes the schools actions even harsher imo.
I totally understand how imperative it is for the next school to be 100% right, and I think you're right not to accept a placement if you're sure it's inappropriate.

I'm really sorry OP but I can see where you said he can't attend residential, but not why. would you mind explaining again? I can understand why you are so frustrated, this must be a really difficult situation to be in

I know you've said there isn't a question on this thread you haven't already answered, but I can't find the answer to mine, so if you wouldn't mind answering them again...

Does your son's EHCP specifically mention his triggers? Does it specify for e.g. that no-one is to sit in his seat. e.g. that they MUST use a timer to end an activity?

I know in the OP you allude to the EHCP being pretty crap, but what is actually on it?

The OPs child is adopted, placing an adopted child in boarding school or residential would significantly impact their attachment patterns, which are already impacted by adopted. If at all possible adopted children should live at home with their parents. Besides, if the child’s plan is followed properly it sounds like he does really well so no need for residential care. The principle should be the least amount of intervention needed to hold him steady, but enough intervention to hold him steady.

sleepismysuperpower1 it's because he's adopted. Lots of adopted children have attachment difficulties/trauma so you can't just send them away to boarding school, especially aged 7 or 8.

I've been in and around lots of Prus, both primary and secondary. (As well as having a SEN child) Yes some of the children are violent but they work really well with these children to unpick there issues and before they move on they train the new staff in how to handle the child.

You could try Disabled social services for support - in my area the criteria is actually unlawful - only the ones who shout get heard 😥

oh ok, I must have missed the bit about the dc being adopted (skim read the thread very quickly)

@drspouse you undermine the issue you’re trying to highlight through your vile attitude to other posters.

Wish you well for the child’s sake but ffs appreciate that people are trying to help, and take accountability for sorting out the issues that have arisen from your son’s violence. Short term it may be worth you getting signed off sick with stress to look at options.

And maybe your attitude is as a result of your stresses so maybe some therapy for you

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/boy-excluded-school-age-five-21258598?utmsource=facebook.com&utmmmedium=social&utmcampaign=mirrorrmain&fbclid=IwAR2Gw0EE2C0hKAxADzPr2Ykkd87VlJKZhSR7JrdcvXp5R6cPEEtRNbSBOso

Some of the stats here are interesting

Don’t blame the teachers. Everyone has the right to be safe. Schools don’t exclude for no reason it costs thousands.

What do you want?

You wont

Change locations
Downsize
Career change
Accept a pru
Take sick leave

What do you want that maybe even remotely possible? In reality?

You have had loads of good advice on here yet you don't seem to want to compromise, other than throwing money at the issue. The hard truth is, it's rare that both parents can work with needs such as your DS. That's not right, and it's not fair, but that's how it is. A PRU would aim to get him back into mainstream education, a plan doesn't already need to be in place already, but they will help create a plan. IMO you just don't want your ds mixing with 'that type'. Time to face the music, your son needs help which mainstream education cannot provide. Out of interest what are yours plans for ds tomorrow?

If it weren't for the sickness, would one of the further schools be an option? Even as a "long shot but we'll give it a go" option? If so there are medications that can be used to gradually build up tolerance for travelling. I didn't used to last 10 minutes in a car at his age without hurling but managed to get about 45 minutes before I started feeling sick. Obviously while you are on it, you don't feel sick at all its only when you start reducing. Anyway I wont waffle on in case it's no help but if you are interested feel free to PM me.

They wouldn't for him at the moment. One might be good for secondary but there are lots more options at secondary.

This is getting to be one of those threads where the OP says "I need to get the kids to school and I can't drive and can't afford lessons and I'm SO STRESSED and we're up to our ears in debt and I'm about to lose a major account at work and I have to do all the housework because my DH is in a wheelchair" and everyone says Well learn to drive! Sign off sick! LTB! Go on a spa weekend! Resign! and then shouts at the OP for not trying all their suggestions Right Now.

This is getting to be one of those threads where many, many people try to emphasise and try to help, and are very rudely shot down by the OP.

Who lives in an area with no suitable schools
And the little boy in the middle of this can't travel more than 4 miles without being ill
But the parents don't want to make any more changes to their lives, even temporarily
So really the government need to build a suitable school in the local area
And open it tomorrow
Nothing else will do

I shall take that as a "no" then.

Do you want your DS back in the school he has just been excluded from? If so, do you trust them to carry out his care in the way that you believe needs to be done? Is it realistic? Are they willing to sit down with you and listen to specific strategies that you want put in place, then review at an agreed time?

What do you think this school can/will do that the PRU won't/can't?

OP
You have been unrelentingly negative and prickly on this thread.
People understand you are in a horribly frustrating situation but it isn’t one you can control. You are up against a wall of procedure, bureaucracy and budgets. Unless the strategies for managing your DS’s triggers are clearly spelt out in mandatory language in his EHCP the school may be able to justify the exclusion.
What then?
It must be painful that people are not seeing your DS for the boy you know he can be BUT schools are not currently meeting his needs and will probably claim that they cannot do so in the future.
I know people who moved to be near a good specialist private school.