To ask what you are supposed to do

[drspouse]

DS has an EHCP.
It's not very good and we have a tribunal coming up.
He has some challenging behaviour. We admit this and we are doing our best.
He moved school in Sept after we looked at 8 new schools, including 4 special schools.
The new school has just permanently excluded him. They have not tried all the suggestions of EP, OT etc and we know this is illegal but it doesn't help with the fact that he now has no school.
They are suggesting he goes to the PRU. I'm sure it's very nice but he has only just started to settle at the new school.
He's 8, in year 3, and loves to play with his teddies. We were told some of the older children at the SEMH schools we looked at had pulled knives on teachers. If there's any child like that at the PRU it will break him.
We both work, I've just been told I can't reduce my hours any further and DH has just started a secondment which will be for a year. The PRU has no after school club. We both have meetings at any/every hour of the working day. Giving up either of our jobs is not an option.
So we can't HE (and we don't want to, and we shouldn't have to, and it would be awful for DS).
What are parents of a child with SEN actually supposed to do? Is the idea that we are both supposed to sit at home with our child and keep him away from other children/schools/the public? Are we not supposed to work? Is the country going to pay us our (fairly high, which is partly why we aren't giving up work) salary for not working?
Note before you suggest it: yes we know we can look at out of area schools. We did, they are included in the ones above. We live quite rurally. We can't move (I have tried to move jobs for years). But we need school for DS NOW. Not in 6 months time after we've moved/fought for a private school place (there are none suitable anyway)/I've lost my job.

Of course I do baileys. Though I guess I'm supposed to not want the best for my child? Are other parents not allowed to pay for specialist music lessons? Can parents of ill DCs not pay for private medical treatment because not everyone can afford them?

I dont think so no.....that case neither parent work.

What ChazsBrilliantAttitude said basically.

The system sucks op, but mass education is exactly that, designed to cater for the masses. As a teacher, now working as a specialist 1-2-1 with an autistic child who would benefit from a specialist education instead of squishing into mainstream, I agree with you. We home educated for a few years when our eldest was young as school didn't suit her. However, practically speaking you have to do what you have to do. Your child doesn't have the same needs as everyone else. The mass education system cannot provide a scintillating and safe environment for him, which is what you, as a parent should want. So you may need to reject it.

As a whole, I agree this is a somewhat feminist issue, as on the whole it will be women giving up work. But this doesn't have to be the case for you. You both have the responsibility to change to suit your son's needs. Even if you get a school place, you will need flexibility around wraparound care etc. This is the same for all parents, but especially those with children with additional needs. That's just life.

Whatever your profession, you hold the same worth as every other parent. And will potentially need to make the same sacrifices.

So what is your plan for tomorrow? Rest of the week?

I don't think that you really grasp how tricky it will be to teach your child in a mainstream school, with the level of resources they currently have.
I think you need to adjust your perspective.
And seriously, just because you can earn a lot doesn't mean you're more entitled to care.
Fact is, your kid has issues, you with pay for adequate care or you provide it yourself, until this gets sorted.

We moved him when the old school said he had to go. We didn't want him at a school that didn't want him.

Well, which is it, OP? Either the old school insisted that he had to go, or you moved him of your own volition.

In either case, why do you want him to return to this school now?

Do you have other children? What school are they at?

Attitude or not (and believe me and send parent would be hard tasked not to have it) the realisation and the reason I believe the thread was written is to point out how much the system fails send kids.

If your child is non send and doesn't attend school you have to jump through hoops to prove legitimate absence as it could affect their GCSEs etc. If you choose to remove your child for a holiday you are fined.

Yet children with send can go years without an effective and suitable education despite the law also stating they are entitled to the same. Parents do have to fund private reports to get specific ideas legal ones the law states they should get from la services. Parents have to go to tribunal to secure an education for their child. Imagine a parent of a non send child having to do this?

There is no surprise that when you look at poverty figures a high number of those families are parents of children with disabilities. Because when it comes to send the attitudes are different.

Parents of children with send are fighting for their children to get an education. Parents of children without send are fighting schools to accept that the 2 days off they had for a cold were legit.

The education system is chronically underfunded. That is a fact.
It is also much, much too focused on exams.
All kids are being failed to some extent. Most Sen kids are failed more.

But parents of sen kids I know, don't expect to be able to put their kids in wraparound care as they understand how overwhelming that can be for heir child and how much human resource of the club their child will take up. That is where the op is doing herself no favours. She needs to move and sacrifice for the good of her child, not just the education system.

Bud says it all. OP your attitude is abhorrent

Completely agree with Atalune 11.11

Sorry but I would try the pru. It's all you can do. For the safety of all involved, Inc your ds. No they are not brilliant, yes other kids kick off but what is different about your child kicking off and hitting people, and someone else's child kicking off and hitting people?
Why should staff and pupils be attacked? My dds school has several violent children. Classrooms have to be evacuated frequently because Johnny doesn't like the word maths. So when the teacher said "right children get your maths books out" little Johnny threw a chair at the teacher. Teacher ended up in hospital with 8 stitches in his face. The TV in the room was smashed and no longer use able and 6 desks were broken beyond repair. Who pays for that? The teacher didn't ask Johnny to get his maths book out, Johnny has a 121 and sits in the corner playing with his therapy putty all day. But he was triggered by the word maths. But Johnny has extra needs so everyone must tiptoe around him. My daughters education is disrupted but no one give a shut about that. It's unacceptable. The school won't exclude them, but it's OK for My child to be scared!
The child kicking off should be removed, maybe to a separate room. Not all schools have a separate room, they can't just magic one out of thin air. Yes your son has additional needs but why do you want him in a school that can't give him what he needs? Why should other children witness this violence. Sorry but the world doesn't revolve around you and your child.
He is your responsibility, end of. You say you can't take time off, well tough you're going to have to.
Yes the school should follow the ehcp, but it's not always that simple, these things take time to. Put into place, they cost money that isn't instantly given, training takes time. Etc etc. I feel for you op but look at it from all angles.

The education authority is doing what is required of it by providing a place at the PRU. It's primary so I don't think you need to be worrying about knives.

The PRU staff are likely to be helpful to you. They deal with children like yours all the time. They'll have contacts at other schools. PRUs are a temporary measure, so they'll be able to help you navigate the system and give you the informal and support that you need to find the right place for him.

My advice would be to take the place, and then, calmly and cooperatively, work with the staff to find a long term solution.

I've been in this sphere of education for forty years. I totally understand your frustration, but at the moment you're lashing out and refusing everything. It's really not the way forward. I've rarely seen parents as angry as you, get the best from the system. Calm determination and co-operation (and being pleasant to those who can help) is what wins the day.

Informal= information

trouble is, unless the recommendations by the OT were written as absolute 'must haves' they would simply be recommendations, which means that the school do not HAVE to comply with them. This is why wording is so very very important in the EHCP
so many times 'would benefit from' is used rather than 'must have' - its an aspitration not a demand to comply.
the LEA are keen on this kind of wording because a parent looks at it and thinks, great, look at all the stuff they are saying he is going to have/benefit from
a school looks and sees a minimal number of 'must haves' and thinks it can slot them in alongside their standard SEN provision.
If the timer, for example, is not written specifically as a 'must have' for transition between activities then the school were not at fault for not doing it, even though we all know that this would lead to the behaviour that happened.
the school would argue that as the activity wasnt scheduled, they improvised with a verbal intervention / countdown

We pay for home wrap around care for my son who has autism. So before and after school someone comes to our house and looks after him and his brother while I go to work. It's expensive but it's a lot cheaper than giving up work. The lady who comes to us is an experienced and qualified retired primary school teacher. I found her by putting an ad in childcare.co.uk.
It means that he gets to come home and have a rest rather than coping with after school club , and I can go to work.

I am still surprised that children are not searched for weapons at the start of each school day, if this is a regular problem (the knives at the PRU which many have mentioned).

the PRU is also good because as others have said, they are a moving forward place. They will have dealt with many many kids with the same issues over the years and have unbiased views and opinions as to which secondary for example, that you can start working towards. They can also open doors to access for lots of other EOTAS provision which may work well for your boy. In our area some kids went off and did outdoor education with a fantastic group who really made huge differencesin these kids behaviour - facilitating improved self control and team work and building self esteem. when they came back into the classromm they were like different children. This would not have been available otherwise, and there are many many alternative provision schemes that can really help.

what are the plans for tomorrow @drspouse ? Really hoping you're ok

It's so depressing reading this thread. Nothing will ever change with SEND if most people just think that we should give up hope and get on with it.

We didn't want him at a school that didn't want him. We didn't realise that no school would want him.

That's heartbreaking to read...

Nothing will ever change with SEND if most people just think that we should give up hope and get on with it.

But I don't think that's entirely the case. Most people agree that this isn't fair on the kid, or his parents. But at some point a plan has to be made that is realistic right now - that's not saying to give up hope, but it is saying to a certain extent that you have to get on with it, because the alternative is that this kid bounces round schools, not getting much of an education, feeling increasingly like an outcast, and finishes school with much less of an education than he deserved. It happened to my sister, years ago, it still happens now. It's well and good arguing that there should be somewhere, that the school should comply with the EHCP, that someone should be there 1:1 to help, but nothing actually happened other than a lot of fighting and tribunals and she had no prospects when she finished school. She has no prospects now.

It SHOULD change. I wouldn't count on it happening at any time in the near future, though. Look at the Government that has won the past few elections, look at current events and culture. It's hard and most people are "everyone for themselves". Sadly I think there will need to be massive shifts in society before this becomes an issue that is big enough for any real investment in it.

I hope you've got something sorted for this week, @drspouse

I'm not worried about knives. I'm worried about DS being scared by children who have used them. And yes, we were told that there were children in the SEMH school, primary school children, who have brought and used knives to school. The PRU is mainly years 5-6 and there's no reason to think the children are different.
He is aggressive when he is triggered, and he doesn't remember doing it. That's to adults. Mainly when they are standing over him and (in his mind) shouting at him. Not children.
He has also occasionally pushed other children in playground incidents but I really don't think there have been more than many other children.
He has never been exposed to a child who is deliberately violent. He's afraid of violent images and violence on TV. And of course if he feels the other children are standing over him and shouting at him he may not just get scared but fight back.
It's like saying a child who's afraid of noise should be immersed in a drumming school.

I usually work 0.6 (to the PP who asked why I hadn't dropped my hours, I had already said that I had but they won't let me drop any more nor drop any more afternoons - please people read the OPs posts). This week I'm moving my work days to the end of the week and crossing my fingers something is sorted.

Nothing will ever change while people continue to vote for a conservative government who are intent on cutting funds to public services to the absolute bone.
Schools are literally on their knees. Unable to afford pencils and glusticks never mind specialist sen TAs.
If a school literally does not have enough money, then what is it supposed to do?

It sucks. The NHS is on its knees. CAMHS are desperate.
We should a be rioting on the streets. Instead, we give the Tories another 5 years in power to further the damage.

The op is right...the schools should provide the help her son needs but reality is , there isn't the money for training, for resources, for staff. It sucks.
Lobby your MP, join a political party; the changes need to come from the top. As a society, we have embraced an ' I'm alright Jack" attitude. This is the problem.

In the meantime, I think you should go and see the PRU and talk to the staff. Get a real idea of what they are doing and what they can offer.

OP - is private school (not specialist) an option?

I note you say you’re in the north of England. If you want to PM a rough idea of where (no issues if you don’t!) I can recommend a school that might work for him.

I’m really sorry things are so tough at the moment.