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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To ask if you think there will be a second coming?

891 replies

LuluBellaBlue · 03/01/2020 18:29

This is inspired by the new Netflix show Messiah, about a second coming.

I really hope this doesn’t upset or offend anyone and people can share their beliefs and thoughts openly and without prejudice or judgement as I know this can be very sensitive for some people.

Following on from —binge— watching this series I did a bit of googling and it seems both Christian and Muslim regions predict this. (Not researched if any others do yet)

I’m not very well informed about different regions but the concept of this programme has really interested me, I find it fascinating that this could, maybe? actually happen!

Do you think there could be a second coming?!

(And what would it actually mean for the world? A rise in consciousness? Mass healing???)

YABU - no don't be so daft!
YANBU - yes, this could happen, why not?!

OP posts:
SirChing · 05/01/2020 23:48

You made a comment upthread about how you wouldn't call me a lady due to my comments to you. Well, that very judgemental of you

Oh for goodness sake. I said I wouldn't call you that because you had told me I was wrong to call people ladies. It wasn't a judgment at all!

It was me saying that you don't feel being called a lady is accurate, you want to be referred to as a woman. So I won't be inaccurate and refer to you as a lady.

I am absolutely bored shitless by repeating the same thing over and over. If you can't understand what I have written, then I can't help you.

I am not engaging any more with someone who is going on and on about a point that has sod all to do with the actual thread title.

I have provided my explanation. If you interpreted it as a judgement I can assure that that wasn't how it was intended, and that is all I am saying about that point. If you ask again, I shall simply copy and paste this post again.

roisinagusniamh · 05/01/2020 23:50

That's OK SirChing.
I think you have bigger things to explain on this thread.
One thing you're not doing is convincing anyone that god exists..

ApplesinmyPocket · 05/01/2020 23:51

"The Romans were good record keepers and Jesus of Nazareth existed and was put to to death ."

They were indeed. Can you point me to this record the Romans made?

joystir59 · 05/01/2020 23:53

I believe, and so do most of us when we are really up against it, even the most confirmed atheist will pray for Mercy, for help in desperate times. I spent a lot of time with someone who had been led to believe they are the second coming. This person is sane, rational, down to earth and not egocentric. I had supernatural/spiritual experiences that changed me forever from a stone hearted cynic to an open hearted person with gratitude hope humility and faith, due to spending time with that person.

SirChing · 05/01/2020 23:53

What I don't get is people praying to God if he's so great he would do something, it's like praying for Aussie fires to stop, yet he caused them in first place, eithier he's good or useless

How did God cause the fires? Wasnt that climate change and arson? Made by humans?

Personally, I don't think that God does ntercede with human free will, therefore I don't think he does answer prayers in a "make your dreams come true" sense.

He doesn't interfere with life on Earth, in my opinion, but he does understand, support and love us through it all if we want him too.

SirChing · 05/01/2020 23:56

I think you have bigger things to explain on this thread

Such as what?

One thing you're not doing is convincing anyone that god exists

I am not trying to Confused I am answering questions and giving my opinion. I really don't care whether other people believe or not.

HeresMe · 05/01/2020 23:58

How did God cause the fires? Wasnt that climate change and arson? Made by humans?

Personally, I don't think that God does ntercede with human free will, therefore I don't think he does answer prayers in a "make your dreams come true" sense.

He doesn't interfere with life on Earth, in my opinion, but he does understand, support and love us through it all if we want him too.*

God was a homicida maniac constantly interfering in old testiment.

What is the point praying to him them , he doesn't give a shiny shit then does he.

But this is a god who lets kids die of cancer so best not question him.

If he exists he is disgusting.

tiredvommachine · 06/01/2020 00:20

@SirChing I'm a salvationist and a member of our choir (songsters). Every week, someone has to stand up and do their devotions mid way through practice and mine is coming up next week and I'm searching for inspiration. Maybe dropping the C bomb would be a step too far! 😂
Brilliant analogy though and well done for keeping your humour and patience during this thread Flowers

SirChing · 06/01/2020 00:33

So why is 'Gods' first commandment, written in stone, a warning to not worship any of those other Gods?

I always thought it was because they aren't real and he knew that they were conning people away from following him. Apart from that, I dunno.

The same could be said of Jesus/God, how are we supposed to know who is telling the truth?

Well, if he turns up again, does miracles and all that stuff, then we will know. He has way more powers than Satan (apparently). Aside from that, again, I dunno.

Seriously? Why is it ok for God to make a deal with him and not us? Double standards?

You can. No-one is stopping you. God knew what he was playing with though, I would imagine, but if someone wants to make a deal with the devil, I think they are foolish, but crack the fuck on!

You mean Satan expressed free will? Doesn't make God look good does it?

He was an angel. Made by and working for God. Whose purpose was to do Gods bidding. Our purpose is to do our own bidding, and God literally hopes like hell that we find our way back to him (apparently).

I am confused, I thought Adam & Eve took free will against Gods permission, and all humanity was punished for eternity with original sin

No, they already had free wilI. If they didn't have free will, they couldn't have disobeyed God's orders and taken a bite from the Apple from the tree. I reckon all that's metaphorical any way.

Now I am not a theist but where in the Bible does it say God gave himself to Satan?

Can't remember where it says, it's been years since I read it. I don't think it's in one of the main gospels though.

So God lied and broke a deal he made? That makes him a cheating liar

I suppose you could look at it that way. It's more that Satan had such hubris in his own abilities being as powerful as Gods, that he forgot that God was more powerful and is the ultimate creator who can do stuff like make Jesus come back to life.

It's what CS Lewis based the story of the LWATW on. Alsan comes back after being killed. The Queen is the Devil and Aslan is Jesus. CS Lewis probably (definitely) explains it far better than me.

Where is the evidence that Satan is the bad guy?

The evil in the world and the fallibility of humans to temptation. Of course, the expression that "the greatest trick the Devil ever played was by convincing people that he doesn't exist" could hold quite a bit of truth.

For Christians, it's obviously the case that the Bible tells us what the cause of evil is. You might think it's something other than the Devil. Or that nothing at all causes it. I can only explain what Christians believe.

If only their was evidence he was resurrected/Heaven

Absolutely agree with you. It's something people can only decide for themselves. According to the Bible, he made himself known to over 500 people before finally ascending to Heaven.

I read somewhere (Again, it was years ago so dunno where), that Romans reported seeing him too. Which, as they were the ones who crucified him, makes them look rather inept, so I am surprised they recorded it really. I always find it interesting what you learn from someone's enemies who have every reason to dismiss stuff that mskes them look bad.

That doesn't make sense. The two are a package deal, if you believe in one you believe in the other. Personally I dont find either credible

Exactly. Satan will give no shits if you think both he and Jesus aren't real. He Will be delighted if what Christians believe is true. So long as you don't believe in Jesus, he couldn't care less if you believe in him. Because he knows that means that he has you not God (general you, rather than you per se).

I am not saying I believe all of this totally, but that's what the theory is.

Cant we choose neither, why the need to choose?
Because IF Christianity is true, and people's souls are forced to pick between one or the other, refusing to choose is effectively condemning yourself. If course you DON'T have to choose if you don't want to. But if Jesus says to you "look, your only options are me or the Devil, and if you choose neither then I can't help you", that's fair warning that failure to make a choice is, in fact, making a choice.

I can only liken to the really shit analogy of needing an organ transplant: You need it, you will die without it, or live with it. In that life or death scenario, it's totally up to you if you don't want to choose. But they can't do the OP unless you consent. So refusing to choose, is effectively refusing to have the OP. Hence you will end up dead through your own inertia. Same deal with this stuff.

Anyway, I am not trying to convince you, I can only try and answer your questions from a position of my own crap levels of knowledge. And if you don't believe, don't worry about it, because if people are certain it's all bollocks then, well, it's all bollocks and none of its true so who cares?

Its late and I am knackered. So goodnight Wine

SirChing · 06/01/2020 00:34

If he exists he is disgusting Ok, of you think so.

SirChing · 06/01/2020 00:35

*If not of FFS!

SirChing · 06/01/2020 00:42

@tiredvommachine You are really brave for getting up and doing that. I would be wetting myself about it. You could always say he was a shitbag. They would cope Grin

And thank you, that's lovely of you to say. But I really don't have a vested interest in converting anyone so I don't care if people believe or not. I will answer questions but when I get the "you aren't convincing anyone" comments, they make me laugh because I am here thinking "I'm not trying to, it doesn't impact my life and if you don't want to believe then knock yourself out" Grin

That's why I am not a vicar Grin

Good luck with your devotions, I am sure you will nail it. And if you liked the comment I made, feel free to make it your own! Grin

SirChing · 06/01/2020 00:43

@joystir59 That sounds so interesting. Can you say more?

tiredvommachine · 06/01/2020 00:47

Swearing is a big no no, there would be cats bum mouths a plenty! Grin
I swear like a trooper so am an epic failure in that regard but I try to be nice to people and I'm sure I make God laugh, so hey ho Grin

RoseWines · 06/01/2020 00:51

@sirching
I really enjoyed your posts :)

RoseWines · 06/01/2020 00:58

@heresme
I'm always baffled when folks think God, Jehovah, is handing out wild fires and cancer to kids.
Nope, that's humans filling the world with carbon that is burning through Australia as the result of episodic climate events.
There's poisons and toxins in our water now and plastics and free radicals everywhere, we did that all by ourselves.

It doesn't sound big of clever to be so dismissive, because atheists recognise we're all free thinking humans, so all the shit stuff is on us, it's our fault, we did it. Not the fault of God

SirChing · 06/01/2020 00:59

@tiredvommachine Me too! I imagine that God and Jesus sit there saying "Oh FFS, NOW what are the idiots doing!" Grin

@RoseWines Thank you, that's really kind of you. And makes me feel like I wasn't totally wasting my time GrinFlowers

SirChing · 06/01/2020 01:10

@RoseWines And good point about people who don't believe blaming God for stuff Grin

It always makes me laugh when atheists get cross about biblical concepts in general. Be an atheist, fine, but how bored have you got to be to sit and pick holes in something that you totally don't believe in anyway?

It won't stop anyone else believing what they do, so what's the point? I am happy to answer questions about what I do believe, and what I understand others to believe, mostly because a lot of misconceptions fly around. But trying to persuade others that what they believe is wrong......I couldn't be arsed at all Grin

HeresMe · 06/01/2020 01:13

It doesn't sound big of clever to be so dismissive, because atheists recognise we're all free thinking humans, so all the shit stuff is on us, it's our fault, we did it. Not the fault of God

Yeah but if he can't do anything about it due to our free will there is absolutely no point praying. The fee will aguement completely negates the point of him. It might not be his fault but he could cure the kids with cancer couldn't he.

Eithier he does something or he is a scumbag it is as simple as that. Or he doesn't exist.

RoseWines · 06/01/2020 01:16

I really enjoyed the netflix series @LuluBellaBlue
I think that's how it'd occur, people would watch a miracle and dismiss it as a hoax.

I've got a healthy cynicism.
But (In the show) to see repeated evidence and still cry fake, just like the romans and jews did to Jesus, I'd hope I was on the right side.
Feels a bit like how ppl see evidence of climate change and says it fake news, today. Or believe it and dont care to change their habits. Just don't see what's in front of them.

The % results on the votes suprised me a bit. Thought itd be 60-40.

HeresMe · 06/01/2020 01:16

It won't stop anyone else believing what they do, so what's the point? I am happy to answer questions about what I do believe, and what I understand others to believe, mostly because a lot of misconceptions fly around. But trying to persuade others that what they believe is wrong......I couldn't be arsed at all grin

The misconceptions are yours he doesn't exist.

Prove to me he does please do.

SirChing · 06/01/2020 01:28

@HeresMe

I can't prove something that is a matter of faith. Equally, it can't be disproven.? As it is a matter of faith, there is nothing I could say to persuade you even if I did try.

You can think I have misconceptions and that he doesn't exist, as is your right, I think otherwise.

But why in the world would I bother proving it to you, even if I could? How does you being an atheist affect me?

Your posts read as if you are incredibly angry. But what with? It can't be God as you don't believe in him. And the personal beliefs of some internet random that you don't know surely don't anger you as they don't affect you.

SirChing · 06/01/2020 01:31

I think that's how it'd occur, people would watch a miracle and dismiss it as a hoax

Totally agree with you. I don't only think some people don't believe, I think they don't WANT to believe. I have no idea why, but that's how some people come across.

RoseWines · 06/01/2020 01:31

@heresme
Eithier he does something or he is a scumbag it is as simple as that.

Im not great with written communication sometimes, I'm better verbally. And actually @SirChing explained it in a way I understood, as someone who understands the same idea.
But within the Bible it says how God gave us free will to act, he's not in charge or meddling in our choices. Not a puppet master. He's ruler of the heavens but the ruler on earth is satan. If you Google it, all the scriptures will no doubt pop up and explain it better. Until a time comes, like the second coming, which swings it back to the op's original thread topic, and the current rule comes to an end. Peace on earth happens.

Praying isnt really a wishlist with the expectation of everything being given to you or granted. It's purpose is communication and to build a relationship with God. As I understand it

RoseWines · 06/01/2020 01:33

@sirching
Ive not read the whole thread.
Did you watch the netflix show?