To think my daughter shouldn't have to share a room with a boy!

[GColdtimer]

Because if you are in Oxfordshire, the council thinks schools should facilitate mixed sex dorm rooms for residential trips, as well as allowing mixed sex loos, changing rooms and sports.

It's on this thread thread

Women saying no is very annoying for some people.

Hasn’t that always been the way, Datun. When manipulation and gaslighting doesn’t work because women has recognised how female socialisation has fucked them over, then the temper tantrums and insults start. Same old, same old. 🤷‍♀️

*have

@Fairenuff

I dont believe its appropriate to remove it everywhere no.

For example some universities now have gender neutral toilets in some places, which is fine, but there are some situations where it would be inappropriate. Its a issue where there is no one size fits all. And common sense and discretion should be used when considering it.

A child is not able to state their gender one day and given access to female/male restricted spaces the next day.

LittleDragonGirl Why are you ignoring posters such as myself who are categorically stating that this is exactly what happens under these policies. Why do you ignore people with actual real life experience with the issue?

then the temper tantrums and insults start.

Indeed. Fortunately it's now so prevalent when women say no, that these behaviour patterns are becoming widely recognised.

And the plummeting credibility of those espousing them.

I dont believe its appropriate to remove it everywhere no.

Why not?

@KatieAlcock That has not been stated at all. Boys and girls often play with toys undescriminately, but most research has shown from about 4/5 years old children will start to prefer gender appropriate toys when given the option. This coincides with gender consolidation where children start to learn you either are a boy OR a girl and not both. I am fully aware its not that simple not and that there are a lot of difference research out there, I was giving a brief over view of the common and relevant literature via the cognitive development theory of gender development.

@Datun This still dosent answer where these statistics exist? If as of that article they where only being recorded from Nov 2019 there would not be enough reported statistics to form any pattern for analysis, likewise it states they will be identified as male or female not transmale or transfemale which still means that they would not be identifible in a statistical sample further proving the point.

A child is not able to state their gender one day and given access to female/male restricted spaces the next day.

It does happen. How do you think we got to the point where Philip Bunce was included in the top 100 women list even though he identifies as male 50% of the time?

Do you think there just weren't 100 'full time' women in the world that could have been included? Did we run out of full time women, or what?

I said this earlier on in the thread and I'll say it again now:

There's a specific safeguarding course on not being distracted by such dismissive attitudes as this is exactly how abusers work and how safeguarding fails.

Facts: in schools, irrespective of identity or a diagnosis of gender dysphoria, a male who "identifies" as female is male. Fully male. Vice versa.

Throw sex positivity and pansexuality into the mix, plus social media, photos on phones, trips to the British Museum to look at ancient porn and rape scenes etc etc and omg I wouldn't want to be a teen girl these days. Especially if I've suffered sexual abuse at home.

School is potentially that child's only guaranteed safe space.

Except it's not.

And Betty's comment about protecting a boy from allegations, while these seems whataboutery, I do know a family that was torn apart by such an allegation against a brother many years ago egged on by the sister's friend. So yes, safeguarding goes all ways.

LittleDragonGirl

The prison statistics come from the Ministry of Justice.

What are 'gender appropriate toys'???

'Gender appropriate toys' ffs

from about 4/5 years old children will start to prefer gender appropriate toys when given the option

Pretty much social conditioning which is why often children with autism don't conform to stereotypes because they a) don't understand or tap into subtle social interactions and communications between and b) often don't care what their peers are doing or thinking about them, their love for their interests takes president over being socially acceptable.

There is no evidence or statistics which indicate male behaviour patterns change when men identify as women.

One of the problems is that an awful lot of men who identify as women are autogynephiles. And as a paraphilia, it is, apparently, the most prevalent amongst male prisoners.

Allowing those men into women's spaces is not just validating a identity, it's participating, albeit unwittingly, in a fetish.

If you have any means of determining which men are predators, and which aren't, I wish you'd share it. Trans or otherwise.

The bbc documentary about how much gender stereotypes affect and influence children, part 1:

gender appropriate ...I think it would be a lot more accurate to say they start to agree to conform to gender expectation

It has been shown that adults treat even the smallest of babies with gender influenced bahviour ... bet you rarely hear what a strong girl or what a pretty boy

It has been shown that if you take preschool children adults think they conform to sterotype, but if you cross dress them , adults see the same children now behaving according to the sterotype they are dressed as. And the adults feedback the gender expected rewards..calling someone in a dress nice and caring, for example if they pick up a doll

We are forcing ideas of appropriate behaviours into our children and children are very good at learning things, no wonder they know their sex and the appropriate behaviour for their sex quite young.

Gender appropriate toys

Dear lord.

And they've got the nerve to say it's not regressive!

I am very pleased that there are so many posters who are also able to refute the utter rubbish spouted by LittleDragonGirl .

Temple Grandin absolutely eschewed frilly dresses and stereotyped activities as they both annoyed her and she had no interest in them. She is autistic and very gnc.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temple_Grandin

I mean it's so illogical. Who on earth decides what gender a toy is appropriate for?

And, what are they basing it on?

Anyway, comments about environment and poverty are a detailing tactic and as stated many times, when it comes to safeguarding, deflection and distraction techniques don't wash.

So no, YANBU op and I hope that this challenge to the council is successful in court.

HTH

So no, YANBU op and I hope that this challenge to the council is successful in court.

So do I. But even if it isn't, this is not going away.

This thread is ample evidence that most people don't want this, think it's wrong and see the exploitation involved.

It's also incredibly useful to show others just how the attempts to shut women up are done.

This is a brilliant article:

thefederalist.com/2019/12/30/new-study-suggests-playing-with-dolls-proves-a-boy-is-transgender/

[[https://thefederalist.com/2019/12/30/new-study-suggests-playing-with-dolls-proves-a-boy-is-transgender/
New Study Suggests Playing With Dolls Proves A Boy Is Transgender]]
How do we encourage parents to give dolls to their sons and trucks to their daughters if those behaviors are considered scientific evidence of gender dysphoria?

"If, on the other hand, trans women are thought of as a subset within ‘women’ – much like the group ‘white women’, for example – then this just raises the question of why some women’s safety should take precedence over that of others, especially when the risk allegedly posed to cis women by trans women seems to be purely theoretical – not supported by evidence – while the risk to trans women from cis men is beyond doubt.

But transwomen are not a subset of women. They're a subset of men. And all the evidence is that TW commit male pattern crime.

Half of all transgender prisoners are sex offenders or dangerous category A inmates (link). Males commit 99% of sex crimes and about 20% of male prisoners are sex offenders. Among transgender prisoners the percentage rises to over 40%.

So either transwomen are more likely to commit these offences or sex offenders are identifying as transwomen to obtain better conditions, even to obtain a transfer to a women's prison (e.g. Karen White who sexually assaulted two women while in prison).

Either way women have every right - and the evidence - to be wary.

As for the risk to TW from other men, there have been more TW murderers than victims in the past decade in the UK.

The only places and occupations where TW are at significant risk of violence is those working as prostitutes in South America where prostituted women are also at very high risk.