To think my daughter shouldn't have to share a room with a boy!

[GColdtimer]

Because if you are in Oxfordshire, the council thinks schools should facilitate mixed sex dorm rooms for residential trips, as well as allowing mixed sex loos, changing rooms and sports.

It's on this thread thread

Yanbu

Bedrooms, bathrooms and so forth should be segregated by sex, not gender. Full stop.

So 'My daughter shouldn't have to share a room with a boy' is inflammatory now?

Why?

YANBU when i was at school people used to do the French exchange trip....you'd stay at a French person's home for a week then they'd come to England and stay at your house for a week.

Most were mixed with the same sex but a girl in my year ended up with a male and ended up having sex with him (both 14)

The school found out after the girl told a few people and the school stopped the trips from then on. There was a huge fuss kicked up but apparently because she was quiet and very academic the school didn't think this issue would occur.

The school now just stay in a chateau in France for a week there is no more exchange trips.

Shocking it was ever actually allowed to happen in the first place. I never did the French exchange as I'd hate to stay with a family i never knew but it just wouldn't ever be allowed these says. This happened in 2001

Or is this just another frothing at the mouth over something that hasn’t happened? And odds of your daughter being in the situ is NIL

So if this is such an unlikely scenario, why are the TRAs frothing at the thought of single sex spaces and demanding that schools, leisure centres, rape crisis centres, women’s shelters and even your granny’s bloody knitting group, let males enter? What’s the point of them demanding that we ignore safety guidelines and ignore the rules, Timmythatyou?

I would like to think my daughter would be sharing a room with her female friends on a school trip whether primary/prep/secondary/senior and I would be checking this out from now on whatever County I am in.

If my child was transgender, I am not sure but can only imagine the bullying if in with a load of rumbustuous boys or vv girls. Is there an option for single rooms?

I'm not going to discuss the other rights and wrongs of mixed sex sharing but if a child is going to have sex on a school trip I don't think that sharing a room is going to make much difference to the chance of this happening. So the pregnancy concern is a bit of a false one.

Of course you are NOT being unreasonable!

Nobody can change sex, it is all complete rubbish. Forcing children into mixed sex toilets, changing rooms and overnight accommodation is, well, I don't have the words.

Disgusting behaviour from Oxfordshire. Whoever allowed it should be sacked and banned from working with children or vulnerable adults.

Of course there will be an increase in teenage pregnancies and sexual assaults now that biological sex isn't acknowledged as a fact anymore.

The combination of this and porn culture is making the world a very dangerous place for girls.

Many teenage boys who consume porn will think nothing of covertly filming girls in their mixed sex dorms. They're being taught it's normal by porn and then adults are giving them unsupervised access to vulnerable young girls.

if we are worried about keeping our girls safe from pesky males, arent they more at risk from the ADULTS in charge of them?

bet you all let your girls go on numerous sleepovers to their friends. bet you don't know how many people have access to them during their visit......aunts,uncles,cousins,other family members.....neighbours,neighbours kids, family friends,babysitters,older siblings, siblings friends, siblings boy/girl friends......nobody bats an eyelid because its an innocent little sleepover with hot chocolate and 'movies'

yet here we are worrying over one little transchild

What it boils down to is this - should we do away with all sex segregation everywhere and let males mix with females wherever they like?

Because that's where this is heading. Unless we stop it.

@LonginesPrime lol its becoming more and more common for teenage GIRLS to view porn

and the world is just a dangerous place for girls? what about the boys, they are abused too. not all about the girls i'm afraid

There is a much higher than ‘nil’ chance of this in dd’s school, given that there is a MtF student in her year who went on last year’s music residential trip (as a boy). Dorms slept 3 to 6 students.

Assuming this year’s trip is similar, should this male student be sleeping in the girls’ dorm?

It’s really not just hypothetical.

I don't think that sharing a room is going to make much difference to the chance of this happening. So the pregnancy concern is a bit of a false one.

So shall we just do away with all safeguards and let any boy share with any girl?

bet you all let your girls go on numerous sleepovers to their friends. bet you don't know how many people have access to them during their visit......aunts,uncles,cousins,other family members.....neighbours,neighbours kids, family friends,babysitters,older siblings, siblings friends, siblings boy/girl friends......nobody bats an eyelid because its an innocent little sleepover with hot chocolate and 'movies'

That is an absolutely nonsense comparison, as not all parents actually do that and the difference is CHOICE! You’re removing that choice from children, by forcing them to lie about someone being the same sex as them or be treated with the accusations of being a phobic.

yet here we are worrying over one little transchild

Aww didums, because they’re all teeny weeny children aren’t they? Seriously, talk about over egging the sympathy vote. Why not just let ALL the boys share with all the girls? After all they’re all little children, aren’t they?

Treated = threatened

Timmythatyou why do you think that this is something that the OP should not be concerned about especially if it is guidance that her daughter's school might well be using?

I know of a situation, during a one night youth group residential trip, where a male child who identifies as a girl shared a dormitory with all the girls who were also on the trip. None of the girls or their parents knew in advance that this was going to happen. During the night the transgender child and one of the girls started a relationship. Not actually commenting further on this situation so my next comment is general.

Clearly it is perfectly fine that two young people are in a relationship. however what is not fine is the fact that a male child could get a female child pregnant and that this could happen on a trip away when the expectation would be that children/teenagers will be separated by sex in order to reduce the risks of pregnancy etc. It is quite shocking that this sort of safeguarding failure is not immediately obvious to anyone putting such policies into schools. All children need safeguarding adequately.

I do know that the safeguarding concerns of the situation that I am aware of have been seriously reflected upon and that different arrangements will be in place for the future. Although none of my children were on that trip, my daughter has been away with the younger youth group and had she been a couple of years older may well have been on that trip and in the situation of sharing a dormitory with a male child. If she had been there then I doubt that she would have had the confidence to explain why she was not happy with the arrangements. No girl wants to risk being the first one to say that they feel uncomfortable in case they are met with the disapproval of their peers.

As a child I was subjected to years of sexual abuse. I would have felt incredibly upset and worried if, when I was a schoolgirl, I had found myself sharing a dormitory, bedroom, changing room etc with someone who was male. I would not have said a word to anyone about my feelings and distress due to the fear and shame I felt about the abuse I had been subjected to. This is another safeguarding concern I think, as this is likely to have a significant impact on the wellbeing, mental health and recovery of some incredibly vulnerable girls.

LoveNote do you think we should do away with all sex segregation everywhere and let males mix with females wherever they like?

lol its becoming more and more common for teenage GIRLS to view porn

Yes, lol.

I appreciate that girls view porn too. But assuming they're watching mainstream porn, the effect is to groom them into seeing themselves as subservient to (often violent, abusive) men and to see it as totally normal to be abused in the name of men's pleasure.

So I'm not sure how girls watching porn makes them a threat to boys.

Plus, girls don't have penises and are less physically strong than boys.

It’s basic safeguarding and I can’t believe so many schools have bought into it. I’m not particularly worried about DD having sex with a boy in a shared dorm or sexual assault etc. I do think it’s completely inappropriate for a 14 year old girl to be sharing communal showers and a dorm room with teen boys. I can’t quite believe that I have to go into school and make sure we are all “singing from the same hymn sheet”, to quote the YH who holds the complete opposite POV to myself.

I really do worry where we are as a society when this is policy in any school.

YADNBU and the worst part is the not knowing.
If I knew (as I do about 3-4 minor children of my acquaintance) that they are telling people they are male when in fact they are female, or vice versa, that would be one thing. I could ask whether my DC would be sharing a bedroom/changing room with them and make a decision accordingly.
It is the secrecy that makes it more dangerous for all INCLUDING the trans child.
It was this point in particular which got me expelled from Girlguiding.

I've written more about it here
medium.com/4th-wave-feminism/a-year-ago-i-was-removed-from-girlguiding-d72f0e9f9692

It's about grooming children.

Telling young girls that they must allow males into female only spaces means they are groomed into accepting adult males into those spaces without question.

So fuck off with the oh poor little trans child rubbish and worry about the AGP adult males using children to further their agenda.

YANBU. Why aren't parents being told about this? If I understand the current guidelines Girl Guides are using for residential trips, the Oxfordshire guidance would be similar, and the effect of both is that rooms/dorms/tents might now be mixed sex and parents wouldn't be notified. Leaders supervising young people on a trip might also be trans-identifying and again parents would not be told that a person of the opposite sex to their child is supervising sleeping and washing arrangements.

Why isn't the privacy and safety of girls considered important? Mixed sex toilets and changing rooms in schools at a time when sexual assault in schools is a major problem and awareness of voyeurism should be increasing, not decreasing. Mixed sex sleeping arrangements on residential trips. Mixed sex sports teams even in contact sports where this isn't safe.

I can only conclude that a lot of people think sexism is old hat and doesn't matter these days. All the talk of 'cis' privilege seems to suggest that.

The morning after pill was a feature of the first aid kit when on Venture Scout jamborees in the mid 90's so I very much expect it is a feature today.

Pre safeguarding rules.