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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

DD kicked a child in the face

833 replies

OutlawTorm · 27/12/2019 14:04

Took DD (10) shopping for clothes to spend her Christmas money. She was trying on clothes in a cubicle when a little girl (aged about 6?) came along and bent down to look under the cubicle door. DD told her to away. The girl laughed and stuck her head under the door again. DD shouted at her to stop it. I tapped the girl on the shoulder and asked her to stop it as it was rude. The girl laughed at me and stuck her head under the door again. DD shouted and banged on the door. I asked the girl where her mum was and she stuck her tongue out and put her head back under the door. DD then kicked her in the face. The girl scrambled away, started crying and holding her face. I shouted at DD and asked the girl if she was ok and where was her mum (so I could go and speak to her!) the girl shouted “shut up” at me and ran off. I followed her, out of the changing room, into the main store, followed her until she went up to an adult and started walking over. The woman asked her why she was crying and the girl shouted at her to shut up. I walked over and explained that my DD had kicked her as she kept sticking her head under the door whilst she was getting changed. The woman said “well, now you know not to do that!” ... she apologised to ME and walked off!!!

DD came out of cubicle as if nothing had happened. I said “what were you thinking? You could have seriously hurt her” and DD replied “wish I had”.

She is currently under CAHMs for behavioural problems, suspected aspergers, worrying behaviours. DH thinks I’m over reacting as “even the kids mum wasn’t bothered” but I am! It’s not a normal reacting to being annoyed is it? Kicking them in the face?

OP posts:
Aaarrgghhh · 27/12/2019 15:15

It is someone bigger/stringer kicking someone who won't stop annoying them. Not rocket science is it?

Your thought process is very concerning. Peering at someone under a changing room door is not just simply annoying someone. It’s looking at someone’s possible naked body while they are trapped with nowhere to run, invading their personal boundaries. Actually try and understand he situation here. Maybe you are okay with females not having boundaries and wanting to keep their bodies hidden from others while changing?

DoesntLeftoverTurkeySoupDragOn · 27/12/2019 15:15

The OP should have removed the girl before it got this far.

DoesntLeftoverTurkeySoupDragOn · 27/12/2019 15:17

Your thought process is very concerning

Not as concerning as your where you think it's OK to kick a 6 year old in the face.

Peering at someone under a changing room door is not just simply annoying someone.

So you'd be OK with a man kicking his partner in the face in similar circumstances?

Aaarrgghhh · 27/12/2019 15:17

Yes people, kicking is not ideal. Stop saying the op could have stopped the situation before it got to that point, that clearly isn’t true. The op acted like a wet blanket and did fuck all to protect her daughter, she even left her kid to go and follow another one through the store.. If op did act like a parent then yeah I doubt the kick would have happened. As it stands, the daughter wasn’t getting any help and so dealt with it the only way she could.

DoesntLeftoverTurkeySoupDragOn · 27/12/2019 15:17

Like I asked someone before: where is your line drawn.

skittycat · 27/12/2019 15:17

If I'm honest I think you need to look at your response to what was happening in the situation.

You were aware that your daughter was uncomfortable about what was happening, and you didn't intervene in a sufficient enough manner to make your daughter feel safe in that cubicle. As a consequence she took matters into her own hands and kicked the younger child AFTER repeated efforts to verbally ask the child to stop.

That's not to say that I condone your daughter kicking the younger girl, but I can understand why she did it in this situation and clearly the other mum could understand also.

JeezyPeeps · 27/12/2019 15:17

I absolutely agree that the mother is at fault for not effectively dealing with it.

But my question is about what the ten year old should do, given that the parent DIDN'T deal with it. And it was repeated. More than once.

What is the ten year old supposed to do? Nobody has given a reasonable answer.

Moonsick · 27/12/2019 15:17

This is on you OP.

You could have got a member of staff, there are usually staff in changing rooms.
Should have been firmer with the 6 year old instead of wishy washy. "Stop that" "go away" "she doesn't like that, stop".
Could have told DD to cover herself and wait whilst you sorted it, reassured her.
Could have blocked the bottom of the door.

Instead you left your DD feeling unsupported, frighted and vulnerable, getting increasingly distressed. And a 6year old got hurt and you could have got into some serious aggravation with the parent. You can have a talk with DD about non-violent methods of managing these situations, but you owe her an apology for your own mishandling.

VivaLeBeaver · 27/12/2019 15:17

I’d have been out the cubicle before it had got that far and frog marched the brat to the sales assistant.

Or at least have bawled her out rather than tapping her on the shoulder and asking her to stop.

Aaarrgghhh · 27/12/2019 15:18

DoesntLeftoverTurkeySoupDragOn

You can make up many scenarios to make me agree with you but I won’t be. I disagree that the kick was wrong in this particular case. Plenty of time for it to be avoided but her mum didn’t want to help her.

DoesntLeftoverTurkeySoupDragOn · 27/12/2019 15:19

Stop saying the op could have stopped the situation before it got to that point, that clearly isn’t true.

Of course it's true. She should have removed her when she first went up to her and asked her to stop. She left her there even when she did it again. Stop saying otherwise.

eveshopper · 27/12/2019 15:20

Stunned that anyone thinks a six year old deserves a kick in the face Confused

It doesn't matter what she did, the fact that she was left to wander and her mum didn't care just shows a lack of parenting and responsibility. She is six and people are happy that she got a kick in the face Hmm

OP I would be horrified tbh if it were my child who did that. The fact that the six year old antagonised her is irrelevant. It doesn't make it ok. The thing with ASD is that they can be violent and I would be punishing her for the violence but making sure she knows how that situation could have been dealt with effectively, because if she kicks someone in the face in a few years she is going to end up with a criminal record or a knife in her back.

I'm quite sickened by the amount of posters that can't see 2 separate issues here and are almost floating about a poor six year old, which she is as her parent doesn't seem to give a fuck about her, getting kicked in the face.

Mumsnet at its best.

DoesntLeftoverTurkeySoupDragOn · 27/12/2019 15:21

I disagree that the kick was wrong in this particular case.

And I disagree that violence ppl kicking a 6 year old in the face is acceptable no matter how you try to justify it.

Where do you think violence becomes unacceptable? You clearly don't think it's OK for a man to kick his partner (or anyone else) in the face in the exact same circumstances but you seem unwilling to explain why.

Aaarrgghhh · 27/12/2019 15:21

DoesntLeftoverTurkeySoupDragOn

Did you read what I wrote? Clearly the op couldn’t stop what was happening because well, she didn’t.. she chose to do nothing to help her daughter.

DoesntLeftoverTurkeySoupDragOn · 27/12/2019 15:22

Anyway, I note the OP's previous posting history and I'm out.

churchandstate · 27/12/2019 15:23

What is the ten year old supposed to do? Nobody has given a reasonable answer.

Of course there’s a reasonable answer. Stop changing. Cover up. Keep objecting to the presence of the 6 year old. Not violently lash out at her.

happycamper11 · 27/12/2019 15:23

Meh, kids sounded awful, even mum didn't blame your dd. Id have stern words but leave it there

eveshopper · 27/12/2019 15:23

The little girls Mum had the right idea,

Yeah, letting a six year old run about a shop and then being happy they got assaulted is great parenting.

FoamingAtTheUterus · 27/12/2019 15:24

She's done the kid a favour imo. 💁🏻‍♀️

Aaarrgghhh · 27/12/2019 15:24

I didn’t say I’m exact same circumstances.. are you blind?

Okay, I’ll bite and I’m fact I’ve already said this elsewhere on the thread. Perhaps you could brush up on your reading and comprehension skills? If I was in a changing cubicle and a man kept looking under and laughing and being a perv basically then yeah, I would kick him in the face if he wouldn’t leave and I had nowhere to run. I don’t even care about the sexes and it could be the other way around and I’d agree it’s ok and the person deserved the kick, obviously if it’s a woman looking under a mans cubicle a softer kick would be better.

ShadowOnTheSun · 27/12/2019 15:24

She hasn't done anything wrong (and clearly 'victim's' mum agrees). OP's DD was half-naked trapped in a cubicle. She was being harassed by this girl. She asked her to stop 3 TIMES, didn't start kicking straight away. Her mother was standing right there and did nothing, couldn't manage to deal with a 6 year old. What was the 10 year old supposed to do? Continue dressing with someone watching? She verbally asked her to stop and it didn't help.

As for a hypothetical man kicking a woman in the face. Sure. Imagine, a man is dressing in the cubicle, standing there half-naked. Some random woman sticks her head in to watch. He asks her to stop. She does it again and sticks her tongue out to goad him. Shop staff is doing nothing. He shouts at her to stop. She does it again. He asks her for the third time. She laughs at him and does it again. If after that he'd kick her in the face I wouldn't blame him. If the roles were reversed and woman would kick intruder in the face no one would blame her. So it also works other way around - equality and all that. Just because someone is a woman, it doesn't give her a free pass to be a pest and a dick.

justdoityourself · 27/12/2019 15:26

@WheresMyChocolate she was a bit more than annoying, she was totally invading someone's privacy/personal space, despite being told several times to pack it in.

WorldsOnFire · 27/12/2019 15:26

OP I agree with others and wouldn’t blame your DD.

There’s a very thin line between raiding ‘gentle’ kids and ‘victims’. She was naked/changing and vulnerable, another person (they’re both children of a similar age category it’s not like she kicked a 3 year old or baby) invaded her personal space.
Children (especially girls) need to be taught from a young age that they have the right to stand up for themselves in certain situations. Changing rooms, toilets...etc if anybody over steps those very personal boundaries you have a right to defend yourself!

I’m 27 and would have acted in a similar way had another woman done that to me. Asked them to stop several times, if they continued I’d have felt entitled to defend myself. ‘No violence’ is all well and good until it comes to situations like people watching you change, toilet or (later in life) sexual situations.

I’m surprised you didn’t do more to help, and that your reaction probably made DD think that a stranger watching her change was ok 🙄

Notodontidae · 27/12/2019 15:29

Well, you've got a 6YO that not only is rude to adults, but does not care about them, and is running around without supervision. Then you have a 10YO with no empathy or understanding of age difference who kicks another child in the face and doesn't care if they have a head or eye injury. All this in a society that refrains from any form of corporal punishment, and all I hear is ADHD, ASD, Aspergers, I dont here what a naughty little rascal who deserves a very severe punishment anymore?
I give up, I’m speechless?

RedHelenB · 27/12/2019 15:30

Your child was older. Kicking out like that was bad behaviour and if that happened in a school situation she'd rightly be the one in bother.