To think that there are too many personal insults and attacks on Tory voters

[Soimblue]

I’m really sick of it now. I don’t log on here to be called a cunt, told I hate disabled people and want to ruin the NHS.

I’m interested as to whether others feel the same or if it is just me. If it’s just me, I think I’ll piss off.

The thing is, if people voted Labour and it had won, then those on 80k would have lost an amount they would not have noticed, investing it into the NHS, into new housing, into schools and libraries and help for disabled people.

If people vote Conservative then they are voting for cuts to vital services and benefits, for more people to be made homeless, for people to lose rights as workers and citizens, for more ill and disabled people to die in poverty.

As a Labour voter, the absolute worst you can be is misguided in trying to help society.

As a Conservative voter, the absolute worst you can be is allowing possible suffering and death of the most vulnerable.

alsohuman logic 101 is also that people can be more complicated than that, and that you are incorrect in your assumption. As a PP said (I don't remember the name, sorry), people don't fit into little boxes. So, again, please go away. I do like how everyone's taken the not being told I'm right-wing bit of the post but not that I'm an inferior species to vote Tory to run with, funny that

Leavera and Conservatives are bad winners!

Right. How fucking dare anyone have the temerity to defend themselves against accusations of racism/disablism/sexism/xism/ysim/zism.

The nerve.

Ah, yes...the “left wing feminist”. She is only interested in the plight of white women because calling out the biggest threat to women worldwide is “racist”. That charming specimen.

I don’t think it’s quite as simple as looking at which government was more right wing than the others, there’s way too many variables in place to be clear exactly. I think DC managed to shift the Overton window much further right though, in a way it hasn’t moved back from since. But then again Thatcher selling off council homes without putting any money back into building new ones was a big part of what lead to the recession (buy cheap sell high forcing up prices quickly, banks giving out 100% mortgages was all going to crash down dramatically- although obviously it wasn’t just a UK crash so it’s not the only factor). I remember thatcher thatcher the milk snatcher rhyme, I remember poll tax introduction, I remember being dirt poor and hungry but families have no (or little debt) and a roof over our heads that wasn’t under threat and schools to go to that had plenty books and pens and equipment. Memory is unreliable measure though, even if my experience was representative. But from what I see now it seems poor are again hungry, with no stable roof over their heads, and schools that don’t have books or supplies, but (even) poorer people now have things like iPhones (no judgements- I’m aware all life is no internet based, applying for jobs, benefits, speaking to kids doctors or teachers is all on line) and designer gear- all of which benefits the top super rich companies that fund tories and control msm and therefor advertising. There’s plenty evidence to show that when people feel under threat, unstable or insecure (on a large social scale) that they spend more, so social upheaval benefit consumerism, which benefits big corporations and they fund tories.

I was one of the pencil waverers. But I was certain I didn't want Jeremy Corbyn for PM. I'm convinced he didn't want to win either. Parliament was in a state of paralysis and Corbyn promised even more of it. If labour get a decent leader and a set of practical policies then I'll vote for them. I don't care what names people call me and if it's too bad then the post will be deleted. There is no decent debate on here and for that OP YANBU.

Well, except that that you didn’t say that, ButchyRestingFace or anything even close to it

Yes, I know.

@duffeldaisy that’s not objective truth though - all political opinion is polemic which is why certain manners standards ought to be adhered to. I could say business owners might be driven to suicide by Corbyn’s policies - wage hikes, corp tax hikes etc.

I’m sure only psychopaths vote for murder and that’s only a potential 4 percent vote!

Cunt is somehow supposed to be ok and reclaimed now when used at men, but you only have to hear a man calling it at a woman to understand why it should be off limits @Baaaahhhhh

Pencil waverer here too - honestly wasn’t keen on any of them but voted for the suffragettes!

my dad and family were called the p word often as it was standard it wasn’t even seen as an issue it is now (or have been recently)

I am well aware that racism has raised its ugly head but what was considered acceptable then certainly isn’t now

Your experience is very different from my families and mine then - I was supported through University being a single parent my aunt used to go to evening classes to get a pitmans working class women didn’t need a university education. I struggle with money especially through changes of UC (many of my friends better off but I do have a mortgaged property so have money to fall back on) my standard of living is certainly higher than my families was HB no longer take into account maintenance has helped many single parents as so few get regular payments

Being poor in the 60/70/80’s was different as standards of living were poorer. It wasn’t unusual to go round to a friends and the house would be absolutely freezing (we had no central heating but kept a fire in upstairs when it was very cold or the oven on), sharing bath water, food was more basic with fewer choices. We shouldn’t have food banks but it wasn’t unusual for children and adults to be hungry (not starving) through lack of food

The sad case of the woman with 14p left shown on the news a feed weeks ago was so many peoples lives i knew growing up we didn’t understand what that meant as children. that shouldn’t have been the case then and certainly not now but I really don’t think things are worse now just haven’t progressed as they should have

Duffle the worst you can be as a labour voter is to vote in the erasure of women’s rights and put even more rapists in female prisons.

Same goes for tories, greens, Lib Dem’s and UKIP.

HTH.

@reallychristmasaaagain

But business owners are not being systematically brought to the edge right now.
Plus actually Corbyn’s policies would have hugely helped businesses by giving a large percentage of the population some disposable income. Those currently homeless, or almost at breaking point or using food banks aren’t able to use shops or services when they can’t feed themselves on their wages.

People currently on UC or who are carers or who are ill or working long hours in temporary jobs, those needing the NHS are at very real, very immediate risk from more Conservative government.

Wow!
I voted Tory! I have a son with a disability and have friends with children with disabilities who also voted Tory!
Not 1 party was perfect and none of them tell the truth but everyone has a vote and chooses what they believe is best at the time!
Insulting people just shows how rude some people are!

They deserve all they get!

Alsohuman I wasn’t being remotely pedantic. You were wrong

No I wasn’t.

@ChestnutSmoothie

1. I 100% believe you voted labour
2. I don’t consider mindless swearing an ‘intellectual debate’
3. Very confused who the ‘you’ you are referring to is because I didn’t vote for anyone in the GE
4. If you wanted me to read to the end of your post you could have made sure it want an incoherent random rant of vitriol

5. Disablist is not a word

I agree with you zdjg it was like trying to find the best of a bad bunch this time. Hated Boris Johnson although the photo I saw of him this week sat scruffy and dishevelled on the front bench actually made me laugh. How can you be that scruffy and that self confident ?

I didn’t think Jeremy Corbyn was enough of a Leader although I liked him as a person more than Johnson.

It was hard to make any choice tbh.

Disablist IS a word. ...and disablism sadly exists.

Are the a Conservative Party disablist? Probably as much as the rest of society, there will be inclusive and not so inclusive attitudes.

Doesn’t mean that people who vote Conservative are evil and I won’t ever support attacks on people who voted differently to me.

The thing is, if people voted Labour and it had won, then those on 80k would have lost an amount they would not have noticed, investing it into the NHS, into new housing, into schools and libraries and help for disabled people.

But it’s not that straight forward. We would have paid more tax yes, but all this tax (& VAT) would mean we couldn’t pay the kids school fees so they’d go back in the state system. Corbyns high spend manifesto draining big business would put our jobs at risk, so the private health care might go and we’d be using the nhs. If we then had problems with the mortgage, again we’d be looking at state support. I could go on and on.

So this extra tax you think you’d be getting wouldn’t even cover the expenses of us going back to use state services never mind funding libraries. I don’t want the state to be shit but we need a sensible way of funding it and that was not what Corbyn proposed. He went for easy politics of envy and it has not brought the best out in people.

According to Oxford English Dictionary disablism is discrimination or prejudice against people with disabilities. Ablism is discrimination in favour of those with abilities.

Spell check on iPhones is not the be all and end all of knowledge, dictionaries have held the actual meaning of words for a long time now. No one says retard because of discrimination in favour of those with abilities, no one calls people on disabilities benefits lazy or undeserving because discrimination in favour of those with abilities, no one tells me my kids should be smacked because of discrimination in favour of those with abilities, tories haven’t cut disability benefits because of favouring those with abilities. Rewriting disablism as ablism is a form of othering me and my experience and writing the reality of my disabilities and caring for my kids disabilities out of the treatment we get. Using ablism for disablism is a form of disablism and is fucking offensive.

"However, I have yet to see a Tory voter willing to answer for the human suffering caused by austerity yet. They just pretend it isn't happening."

I would like just once that they say "yes we know people will die or have severe lack of support but they matter less than what we see as the greater good". I need them to say that so I properly understand that they DO know about it but they think the people are of less importance than reducing debt or reducing taxes.

@duffeldaisy I refer you to my earlier statement about polemic. I don’t think the ones I know were rubbing their hands together with glee about the prospect of new customers. Perhaps you know other business owners - as this is subjective argument we’ll have to agree to disagree.

I wish labour had had a better leader, better top team and a more reasonable set of policies, but they didn’t and no amount of calling Tory voters less human is going to change the past result.

would mean we couldn’t pay the kids school fees so they’d go back in the state system.

So what? Maybe if paying an extra 20 quid a month in tax means you cant afford private school then you shouldn't stretch to try and afford it and put that money into something more practical like actual savings for your kids.

At least one who rings the food bank each week to see what they need and then goes and bulk buys that particular item for them.

Has she not made the connection between her vote and the need for more foodbanks than mc donalds branches in this country?

fullfact.org/electionlive/2019/dec/9/food-banks-more-mcdonalds/

Cant fix stupid I guess

As a Labour voter, the absolute worst you can be is misguided in trying to help society

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

Surely you so not believe this.