To still like Jeremy Corbyn?

[malificent7]

I think it's right that he stepped down as the public clearly didn't get him...hated him even but i think he stands for the good in society. I actually think he is correctvto call out Israel for being bastards to Palestine and whilst ge apparently supports terroism ( ira), i think he is a negotiator ...the UK shafted Ireland hugely and the IRA is a consequence of that. We need people to negotiate with them.
I slso think remaining neutral on Brexit was the right thing to do but respecting the will of the people.

I don't hate Boris but he has got away with a lot. He has said many racist slurs, he hates women, he has multiple illegitimate children yet blames women, he switched sides re Brexit, oh and he's happy to trade with people like Saudi Arabia who have awful human rights. But apparently Jeremy is the bad one.

YABU. I don't like him.

He's a London champagne socialist, a contrived fake working class type, actually from a well-off middle class background (7-bedroom house, prep school etc). He doesn't speak for the north or genuine working class people.

He would not press the nuclear button so would invalidate our vital nuclear deterrent.

He is untrustworthy, staging fake news such as sitting on the floor in a 'crowded' train which actually had many free streets.

He hides his views on Brexit instead of stating them even if others disagree.

On a political level I would certainly trust Boris more.

(seats not streets)

MarshaBradyo

I’m gutted, obviously.

Brandora

"I have never seen Corbyn react to abuse of any kind"

He delegates reaction to Aaron Bastani.

Then will you accept changes need to happen to improve on this terrible result?

MarshaBradyo

Like I said, not to the policies necessarily.

It was all how can we take from the "rich"
Anyone who has anything, even a little bit, voted against him because they didn’t want it to be taken away. For example not all landlords are rich people with multiple properties - some have inherited their mum’s 2 bed terrace and are renting it out because they’re too low paid to afford a pension. Then Corbyn wants to take it away and leave them with nothing for their retirement. Not everyone who has kids in private school is rich - some are bankrupting themselves to give their kids a better education than what’s available in the poor state schools in their area, and Corbyn wants to increase tax so they can’t afford it any more. Not everyone who inherits more than £325k is wealthy - some are inheriting their parents home which has vastly inflated in value, and it’s the only chance they’ll ever have to own a home because the prices are way beyond their meagre salary. And Corbyn wants to lower inheritance tax and take away their only chance of home ownership. Etc etc.

In which case twelve million doesn’t mean much more.

It certainly doesn't when you are trying to ,make out that the 10 or 12 million all think the same, should be treated like a monolith or group think, especially when we have FPTP.

Labour lost this election, 6% to BXP, 2% to Lib Dem similar to green and 1% to Tories.

The tory vote didn't really increase, labour lost it, people can try and blame a dying media and easily led when you have people such as the OP still parroting Canary level drivel about how Corbyn was involved in the peace process.

Justanotherlurker

Of course there is diversity of opinion on both sides.

I’m afraid you’ll never stop being gutted Church. It won’t work. The policies are the major problem.

I’d find that ok but I personally am sad and irritated that Labour have shifted this way. And many others are too.

MarshaBradyo

Again, I’m not sure what you have to be irritated about. You voted for a party that represents your opinions. So did I. 🤷🏻‍♀️

After decades of people moaning all politicians are the same, we've just blown what I think was our only chance in my lifetime to elect one that wasnt.

He wasnt different.

He doesnt give shit. If he did he would admit him and momentum got it wrong. He would have resigned yesterday. But he didnt because he still wants to cling to a scrap of power and influence who his successor is. Damaging labour further.

His manifesto was bullshit and not financially viable.

He was no different. He simply had a slightly different message of 'let's sack off the people I think are rich, but can everyone kindly forget I am rich'.

Someone who thinks seizing private companies and properties and throwing all the private school kids into main stream schools, will help schools isnt someone you can trust with the country.

Because I want Labour to be centre left. You can shrug all you like and not listen but your failure is because you are not listening to the majority.

MarshaBradyo

It is totally unreasonable to expect others to shape their politics to yours. If you want to vote for a centrist party, either create one or keep hoping. At the moment Labour is further to the left.

You’ll always lose Church with that attitude.

Maybe. Maybe if my objective was just to win, rather than to win so we can bring about much-needed change, I would promote what you promote, but that’s not who I am.

Two issues for me -

1. Do I agree that he has principles that I agree with on fairness, social justice, care and equality? Indeed I do.

1. Do I think he read the room, recognised the once in a lifetime pivotal role the opposition had to play at this moment in history, and performed what was strategic and genuine leadership to prevent Patel Rees Mogg and johnson take us out of the EU and ruin lives in so many ways? I do not. For that I and many others will not forgive him.

This election and the last couple of years represented a very specific, highly particular moment in our history where the matter of Brexit was absolutely front and central and all it took should have been done to recognise that and lead strategically. Much as I might agree with his principles around social justice (and I absolutely do), this was un-strategic behaviour, leadership that did not read the room, chose not to recognise what needed to be addressed at this particular moment in uk history. The gamble was enormous - to try to dilute focus on brexit when nobody would fall for that, to push forth the radical agenda around other issues (which I agree in principle with in so many ways, but now was not the time), and to gamble on this one last chance - that part to me was unforgivable.

At exit polls, McDonnell said wearily that in the end the public prioritised the issue of Brexit. Well what did they think would happen? This was the single most pressing polarising issue for the last 3 years, and this was the one last chance to stop this catastrophe. The radical agenda around other matters could have been reserved for any other election or once in office. But NOW was not the time for it. Why did they not read the room? Why did they not recognise the pivotal role they had to stop Johnson and stop brexit? Why did they just forge ahead with a campaign and a leadership style they fancied at THIS particular historical moment? Why the surprise now that brexit was indeed the main issue most people were thinking about?

I agree with his principles and don’t for a minute think he is a bar person at all. But it is unforgivable to not think and act strategically as political leaders in crunch historical moments.

But you can win and bring about change. Not all of it at once. Bu having a plan that's not a fairy tale.

If a party had a reasonable plan that would work that would end poverty and improve services without the clear distain for those who already pay more tax and planning on bringing people down to make it equal, then I cant imagine anyone wouldnt vote for them.

Again, I wonder which assets JC would have been happy being seized. Or which ones was he offering up?

He has had so many priviledges in his life and he wants to dent them to others.

YABVU.

He (and Butler) were more than happy to eradicate women's rights by pushing through the Gender Recognition Act. He was happy to let men share our intimate spaces, to steal places on women only shortlists, to buy into all this pronouns bollocks, to get into bed with Stonewall, which also believes is removing single sex exemptions from the GRA.
(Butler teamed up with Mermaids, a charity which sees nothing wrong in lobbying for surgery and medication among minors. And Stonewall, which pumps schools full of harmful gender ideology.) But hey, she and Corbyn were great allies of 'oppressed communities' dominated by men.

Since when is it OK to have women's officers who are not women by the way?

Corbyn did not represent the 'underdog'. He damaged women's rights and freedoms and that is unforgivable.

I love Jeremy corbyn and to this day don’t understand the issue with him. He’s not anti semetic, but the fact that people use that as a reason to not vote for him, but then vote for BJ who has said outwardly racist and anti semetic things just leads me to believe that people do whatever the media tells them to, and that most people, at their core, are racist.

Johnson on the other hand: I think he is a racist, xenophobic, misogynist loon. He is surrounded by the likes of Rees Mogg and Priti Patel. I hate their guts.

But there is not one shred of doubt in me that they were master strategists at a crunch moment. They did indeed read the room. They strategised to the core and presented a slogan that was one-point, single issue focused and made sure that was all really to their campaign up front and centre as they accurately strategised what a weary public would listen to. And they got what they needed.

We needed that level of strategy from the opposition. We were flooded with ideology, normative ambitions and justice related questions - principles I aspire to live my life by - but now was the time for strategy, astuteness, shrewdness and clever leadership. They did not deliver. That is the part that makes me feel so horribly let down.

Marleyisme

I respect your view but it’s a right wing view. I’m not sure what you want from me.

This mad worship reminds me of these women who marry feckless men, who make them promises, I'm going to get a job, I will do the garden, I'll clean, I'll look after the kids, I won't cheat, and when they don't deliver it's always someone else's fault. He had a bad back, he can't get to interview, he can't do the training because he doesn't have transport, his bosses don't realise how great he is, she chased him and he was depressed ... excuses and reasons, someone else's fault, why the promises never materialise.

And every one else watches on and thinks can she really not see it? Why does she keep thinking it's not his fault? That he's just a feckless loser who is never going to deliver and never wants to.

And Jc is like this. He makes big promises he can never deliver. Even if he did get in, Has no intention of delivering. Because it would kill the countries economy, He can't even explain his policies properly. He can't get the majority of people to believe him, he can't justify or explain his suspected terrorist allegiances, he can't even get his party to unite behind him.

And some people look at him and go "OMG he's amazing", no, like the feckless man no one will employ, who doesn't look after the kids, who doesn't meet his promises, who cheats, because it's always someone or something else's fault, he is not amazing.

What's the point of promises if you've no hope of ever having the ability to deliver them? And likely no desire to ever do so. Jc doesn't want to be in power. He'd rather gnaw his own foot off than be pm.

He is a failed leader who could not unite his party nor could he get the public to trust him. That's all he is.

You can like what you like but you should do it honestly. There are so many lies on this thread: insinuations Corbyn was involved in the peace process (he wasn't), allegations his constituency vote has risen every election (it's fluctuated a lot like every other constituency) and others. You don't like the man, you like the story you tell yourself about him. The reality is he was weak, ineffectual, ran away or hid from ordinary people and journos, was openly racist, presented a manifesto focused on giveaways tailored to the rich while ignoring the poorest on welfare and lied more often than he had hot dinners. He was a sad, lonely, pitiful figure at the Islington North count; trying to talk to people who barely bothered to glance back in return. But then the popularity never really existed - fake crowds stuffed with plants, fake photos staged to look like there are several times the numbers there (I've been at/witnessed events myself where it's clearly happening). He has to go right now.

The image I remember is him being held back from lunging at a woman journo while being held back by people shout it's not worth it. The last 4 years have been such a bloody waste. I can't trust Labour any more. The party has forgotten who it's meant to serve.

the feckless man no one will employ, who doesn't look after the kids, who doesn't meet his promises, who cheats, because it's always someone or something else's fault, he is not amazing.

Bj only claims 80% of his own children 😂😂