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Original poster

VG/Prince Andrew - to say I wasn’t sure before but I believe her

999 replies

churchandstate · 03/12/2019 07:05

I posted in a thread after the Prince Andrew interview, and although I didn’t believe him about everything he said, I wasn’t wholly convinced at that time that he was lying about sleeping with young girls, about seeing things in Epstein’s houses that should have repelled him, about having sex with Virginia Roberts in particular. I just didn’t think there was certainty to be had.

I am convinced now. I believed every word she was allowed to say last night and I am only sad they didn’t give her more air time. Prince Andrew has very serious questions to answer.

OP posts:
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7
bigjambun · 05/12/2019 15:40

Oh hello what?

Lizzie0869 · 05/12/2019 15:46

@MinervaSaidThat

I don't think anyone has said that misogyny only exists in primitive societies. Obviously that isn't true. That poster was challenging the suggestion that paedophilia is only an issue in the Western world. That definitely isn't true; it's just not seen as a crime in other parts of the world, as they allow child marriage and girls are forced into prostitution.

It's a question of degree. Thankfully, in this country, teenage rape victims won't be stoned to death for adultery. Obviously, there is misogyny here, too, as there is the world over; for example, the disgracefully low conviction rate for rape means that women get accused of 'crying rape'.

Beaverdam · 05/12/2019 15:50

I didnt say i was brave? This place can be really rude on times.

SchadenfreudePersonified · 05/12/2019 15:51

"Those abused girls in Rotherham and elsewhere just need to shut their mouths. For the good of diversity.”

Hell's teeth! You couldn't make it up.

The many grooming gangs were not of western culture,
quick look
huge sigh

The point is, had they not been "brown" (as a PP described them defensively), the whole foul, obscene, situtation would have been investigated and have been dealt with much, much sooner. And all of the girls involved, as far as I am aware, where white girls - these men did not target children from their own ethnic group. They targeted vulnerable girls from a different (white) ethnic group who they regarded as having no value.

MinervaSaidThat · 05/12/2019 15:52

I don't think anyone has said that misogyny only exists in primitive societies

I think they are. They said:

the reason they don't have paedophiles in other countries isn't because they're better than us it's because they are so backward and primitive that they think it's fine to abuse women and girls
Misogyny is part of a backward primitive mindset

Are you seriously defending this POV?

MinervaSaidThat · 05/12/2019 15:53

"Those abused girls in Rotherham and elsewhere just need to shut their mouths. For the good of diversity.”

Hell's teeth! You couldn't make it up.

Yes you can, it was from a parody article.

Pumperthepumper · 05/12/2019 15:54

Beaver - it can be rude, yes. People tend to be rude to those who don’t believe sexual abuse victims.

Lizzie0869 · 05/12/2019 15:55

*They have fully integrated into our society, the mainly Pakistani grooming gangs had not, and in fact referred to their victims as "Kuffars", thus indicating that they felt, non Muslim, white girls were "unbelievers" and therefore "fair game".
*
Who are you quoting? They preyed on vulnerable young girls, they were far from religious.

But so many religious people are abusers. what about the scandals in the RC Church? And it's equally rife in other denominations. There is a wall of silence around it as well; survivors are told not to report it because it would bring shame onto the church.

DSis and I were abused by our F, who was seemingly a very devout Christian.

Sadly religious people are as likely to be abusers as anyone else.

Lizzie0869 · 05/12/2019 15:59

Of course I'm not defending it. I was a victim of childhood SA myself. But I'm also very aware of what women face in Central Asia, because of the Christian charity I'm involved with.l that supports victims of abuse.

You will accept, I suppose, that child marriage isn't legal here? And girls aren't stoned to death for adultery? It's a question of degree.

andyoldlabour · 05/12/2019 16:04

"A quick Google shows that that tweet was from a parody account of newspaper columnist Owen Jones.
Or are you pretending you didn’t know that?"

She liked it, retweeted it, then a while later - presumably after "being advised", she deleted it.
Every news source was aware of it and to this day she has not apologised for her actions.

andyoldlabour · 05/12/2019 16:12

"And his made up wife."

You are seriously deluded and insulting.
The better half of my family is from Asia (Iran) and has been living here for 29 years. I have spoken about her in other posts.
You carry on being in denial, because that is what enabled these poor victims to suffer abuse and be ignored by the relevant authorities.

bigjambun · 05/12/2019 16:41

I remember the name pumper the pumper from posting on a women's day post. kill me now. This is how it happened.

bigjambun · 05/12/2019 16:42

People need to stand up against this fucking shit.

SlightlyBonkersQFA · 05/12/2019 16:46

This gives prince charles all the amunition he needs to stream line down the monarchy.
In fact maybe he wanted andrew de-titled before all of this came out

Beaverdam · 05/12/2019 16:49

No need to be rude. Have some class god damned it. I am entiled to my opinion anyways.

raspberrymolakoff · 05/12/2019 16:54

Forgive me, I haven't followed this at all. When she was 17 how old was he? It makes him a dirty old man if true but surely it wouldn't be illegal if she were over 16 in this country (was it here)? If there is a rape allegation that is legally quite different of course and morally even worse.
The poor Queen!

Devereux1 · 05/12/2019 16:59

Excuse me too, but I just thought I'd see where we are with PA and Victoria. I can't make head nor tail of the past few pages. Confused

bigjambun · 05/12/2019 17:06

Take a fucking look at yourselves. The woman was abused'

Puzzledandpissedoff · 05/12/2019 17:13

Naz Shah, MP for Bradford West liked and retweeted this comment about the Rotherham victims:

"Those abused girls in Rotherham and elsewhere just need to shut their mouths. For the good of diversity”

Dear god, I hadn't heard about that one Shock

And yes, I read that she was quoting someone else, but what kind of a mindset "likes" something of that sort?

CleansUpDragonPoo · 05/12/2019 17:15

I can't make head nor tail of the past few pages. confused

Not surprising as a few vocal militants are trying to hijack the thread and browbeat anyone of a different opinion than theirs into submission. Usually with filthy language, gratuituous insults and ad hominen attacks.

ohprettybaby · 05/12/2019 17:18

@raspberrymolakoff

Forgive me, I haven't followed this at all. When she was 17 how old was he?
About 41.

It makes him a dirty old man if true but surely it wouldn't be illegal if she were over 16 in this country (was it here)?
One occasion was here. The other occasions were in New York and on his island off Florida. I thought that at first about the age of consent but someone kindly pointed out that the age of consent for "a travelling American" is 18 so she was underage.

If there is a rape allegation that is legally quite different of course and morally even worse.
There hasn't been a rape allegation by VG but she said that she had sex with PA 3 times as she was coerced into it by Epstein/Maxwell.

The poor Queen!
I do feel really sorry for her.

ohprettybaby · 05/12/2019 17:19

Excuse me too, but I just thought I'd see where we are with PA and Victoria
Just letting you know her name is Virginia.

Bluerussian · 05/12/2019 17:23

Schaedenfreude:- The point is, had they not been "brown" (as a PP described them defensively), the whole foul, obscene, situtation would have been investigated and have been dealt with much, much sooner. And all of the girls involved, as far as I am aware, where white girls - these men did not target children from their own ethnic group. They targeted vulnerable girls from a different (white) ethnic group who they regarded as having no value.
.......
Not sure I agree with you. Situations like the Rotherham scandal have happened in many places in the UK with different demographics, always have. The police are always slow to do anything. In Rotherham it took the efforts of a woman who worked with the exploited girls and a senior police officer to get prosecutions going - but it still happens. In other parts of the country at different times it's a slow moving business.

Regarding the Rotherham men exploiting only white girls, that too isn't true; they also exploited vulnerable Asian girls but less is known about them. Some of those girls spoke out about it afterwards but not much came of it.

SunsetBoulevard3 · 05/12/2019 17:28

I don’t feel sorry for the Queen. She should have taken a hard line with Andrew a long time ago, and his ridiculous ex wife. They are a total embarrassment. He may be her son but he’s always been an entitled shirker.

Lizzie0869 · 05/12/2019 17:33

@Bluerussian Sadly girls from their ethnic group are targeted. But not in the same context; they get taken to Pakistan in their school holidays and forced to become child brides. Others become victims of so-called 'honour killings'. It's about contempt for women and girls in general.