To invite Conservative voters to gather here

[Goddessofgrowth]

It’s ‘best of a bad bunch’ in my case but there are three threads petrified of BJ/Tories so wondered if any MN Tories would like to gather here!

“Tory propaganda”

This comparison between Swedish and US spending vs quality of life is interesting - yes it’s the Guardian, but the figures are evidenced and quantified.It’s worth a read, even if you disagree. And it’s balanced since it points out potential pitfalls.

One of the pitfalls in your link;

"But a word of warning. Sweden has evolved its model gradually whereas Labour’s plans involve abrupt change.The price for a big state is high levels of taxation–and it is a price the Swedes are prepared to pay.Overall, government revenues are 49.5% of GDP and taxes on the average Swedish citizen are substantially higher than they are in the UK."

taxes on the average Swedish citizen are substantially higher than they are in the UK.

Not just the 5% then?

When it comes to Nobel prize winners, the countries have similar records once their differing populations are taken into account – 383 for the US and 32 for Sweden. Here, though, the US has the edge. Only three of Sweden’s laureates have come since the turn of the millennium while 130 Americans have been awarded during the same period.

the NHS could develop proper systems in house which could be used universally and make everything joined up.

I've been through two EMR system implementations and both were nightmares. I'm skeptical that the NHS could successfully write their own. Software development is not a core competency of theirs as far as I know and these systems are really complex. The big mistake was not picking one system and implementing it across the board, at all NHS facilities. Then everything would have joined up.

Posted too soon - the lack of Nobel prize winners will be the result Labour's plan to 'integrate' private schools.

The link also points out that Sweden's unemployment rate is over 6%.

the NHS could develop proper systems in house which could be used universally and make everything joined up. But we are already part way down this road and getting back requires huge change and huge investment.

The only option worse than bloated overpriced (but theoretically designed for the job) external systems sold by IT companies, must surely be a solution dreamt up and built in-house by a government department. It is a disaster in the making, as per every other large scale IT project they've tried to run.

I agree that we've dug ourselves a crazy deep hole though, and there is no way way out of it.

If you don't want all this then vote Tory, if you do care about the less fortunate members of our society then vote Labour.

Here we go again with more of the "you're a bad person if you don't agree with me"

My son will be old enough to go to university in 2022, I don't want him to be saddled with around £30k of debt when he finishes

Yes, what start date have Labour promised to abolish student loans? Ds1 doesn't want to pay for Ds2.

@19lovelyupnorth the the

Grayson Perry is going to make a special arty pot for each of us

Completely OT, but I was so charmed by EffervescentElephant’s post that I had to post some pics from one of his exhibitions.

I think I’ll hold my nose & vote Conservative. I’d happily vote Labour if there was a Milliband in charge.

My MP is actually Corbyn. Apart from the well discussed reasons to date, he’s a hopeless and completely absent MP. He continues to protect MP Margaret Hodge who led Islington Council during a period of a horrific child abuse scandal in North Islington‘s council run homes in the 80 & 90s that he still won’t acknowledge despite the many survivors who have come forward.

Bizarrely, the only people campaigning locally for Corbyn is the Communist party. They’re out most weekends at Highbury tube station & on the Holloway Road. When the Communists actively want you voted in, you know there’s a lot more sinister about the man than he’s letting on.

I'm a floating voter and vote for the party I think will be better for the UK overall, there must be a balance between maintaining a healthy Economy, promoting growth (boosts the economy), and of course Social Welfare responsibilities.

I am 62 so have been voting a loooong time, heard every pre election promise, heard every furious accusation by one party of another, seen every election winner start back-peddling like billy-o when they win and have to justify breaking the pre election pledges.

This time I will be voting Conservative as I believe the only way to support the Welfare State is by having a strong economy. I have looked at all the manifestos, and discount Labour as being recklessly spendthrift.

Oh and I am a WASPIE (?) but did appreciate Johnson saying "Sorry, no" to the QT audience member the other night. A straight answer, if not the one she sought.

Presumably, given that Corbyn has a 33k majority, not a lot of canvassing is necessary. The Conservative vote was 6k in 2017.

Now you’re all gathered in one place wonder if we can set fire to it and save the country.

Charming.

Just to be clear, I'm from "up north" and this is not what passes for wit there.

if you do care about the less fortunate members of our society

As I posted above, I very much DO which is precisely why I will vote Conservative this time.

Now you’re all gathered in one place wonder if we can set fire to it and save the country.

And the Tory party are supposedly nasty...

I think I’ll be voting Conservative. Rather than not voting at all. I won’t vote for anyone else, there is no opposition. I could see myself voting for a Miliband but never for someone as far left and in such a cloud cuckoo land as Corbyn. No way.

I’m not a Boris fan, and as a leave voter who has regretted their vote as the months and years have rolled by, this is the question mark I have over voting for the Conservatives. I don’t want a no deal Brexit.

As mn posters always underline the necessity to use our vote and how precious it is, I probably will. But it’s the best of a bad bunch, not from total conviction.

You literally quoted me saying the article highlighted the pitfalls, so I’m not sure why you think this is a surprise to me?

As for the NHS data systems, contracting out is a completely false economy, when there would be a lot of value in having an in-house development department. We are only becoming more dependent on digital. The savings and benefits would be astronomical.

BMW6 - did you see this?

This is not the definition of spendthrift by any means.

Apologies, wrong image!

What relevance does the estimated spend under Labours plans in 2018 have to their manifesto for this GE? And what is your source of information?

Apologies, wrong image!

I see that the Labour plan is in close proximity to Greece and Italy...
And slightly above Portugal - Portugal's Socialist Prime Minister threatened to resign earlier this year if his parliament approved a back-dated teachers' salary increase...

Read the thread @BMW6, the source is named earlier. Presumably the 2019 figures aren’t available so Labour’s current manifesto figures can only be compared with last year’s.

This time I will be voting Conservative as I believe the only way to support the Welfare State is by having a strong economy.

I can't fathom this argument If the Tories get a majority we will be going straight into Brexit and a prolonged period - years in some cases - of negotiations. This means more uncertainty which means yet more damage to the economy.