I honestly don't understand why anyone who cares about anyone other than themselves would vote Tory.

[ilovetofu]

https://amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/apr/27/doctor-nhs-vote-labour-austerity-conservatives?CMP=sharebtntw&twitterimpression=true&fbclid=IwAR2JhAMh9bEiRfeALJeTzeP8ogAByuwaitNpshoQ8oEQfYLvlTc7tvJ50

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@Alsohuman I can assure you I understand those industries very well. I work in one of them. Private companies do not simply take all the profits for themselves. A hug amount of investment goes into the product to ensure it meets EU standards and that it remains attractive to customers to ensure business stability. If you look at any industry franchising model you will quickly see that bringing these kinds of industries back to public rule will not ever be operated in a way that generates a profit. Only continued public debt.

I would like to clarify I'm not referring to the NHS. That should always remain public owned. I wholly disagree with privatising our health service.

Private companies do not simply take all the profits for themselves.

No, in the case of rail, the profits are used to subsidise other countries’ railways. I don’t want utilities privately owned by foreign companies.

I agree. I can’t hunk of one good thing they have done. They support greed and racism. Their leader is openly racist.
They don’t provide any actual policies just slag off everyone else.

Oliversmumsarmy
I get that you had a deprived childhood and I had a similar one so can empathise. What I don't get is how, given the level of deprivation you describe, you were able to set up a business and afford to pay staff? And make that business successful.
My Mum, as a single mother in the 70's never ever got to a stage where she had any kind of contingency money. Never. We lived hand to mouth and there was never money for extras. Owning her own house was a pipe dream and owning a business would have been impossible.

'Corbyn far left raids on private enterprise' - here we see my point being demonstrated. Rather than saying 'The Tories are to be trusted economically because they've achieved x, x and x' a Tory supporter immediately attacks Jeremy Corbyn. It's meaningless deflection to avoid trying to think of Tory policy success stories.

Rather than smearing the opposition please can some Tory voters try to change my mind by giving me a positive reason. Why are the Tories the best political party? What concrete evidence is there that they have benefited society as a whole as opposed to just the top layer of income earners? I'd be genuinely interested to know, just as I'd love to hear one genuine faultless reason as to why Brexit will benefit us in concrete terms.

Funnily enough the attached has just showed up on my fb timeline....names blocked out for privacy but posts marked black are all from the same person evidently triggered by post from labour suggesting that dental checkups should be free to all- imagine- that bastard Corbyn wants to try and prevent dental issues caused by poverty.
Post marked in blue was a response to the angry op which I enjoyed.

Rebuttal.

Rather than smearing the opposition please can some Tory voters try to change my mind by giving me a positive reason. Why are the Tories the best political party? What concrete evidence is there that they have benefited society as a whole as opposed to just the top layer of income earners? I'd be genuinely interested to know, just as I'd love to hear one genuine faultless reason as to why Brexit will benefit us in concrete terms.

Explain how 13 years under labour is not true labout, explain why Labour are losing the traditional heartlands, etc etc.

If we are to look at stupid policies that is just a quick simplistic kick the can down the road and put the burden on our children we could highlight his 2010 'fully costed' policy of eradicating student debt and making university free for all and how they backed away from, we could highlight how he wants to nationalise broadband and not highlight the slippery slope argument of future governments having full control of what we can see online, even that is ignoring the shoddy economics involved.

We could highlight that all of corbyn's policies are a simplistic fix that ignores the burden we are putting on our children under the prospect of greater austerity, if we are to believe then some economists are saying a global crash is due because we haven't really balanced the books since 2008, it's the tribal labour supporters to balance brexit, globalised economy and pretend simplistic solutions is the answer.

Royallyscrewed ''Something for nothing'' has forgotten the bank bail out; and that the following year the bankers refused to refund the money to the treasury but instead paid themselves bonuses that equaled the bailout debt.

Will add, I am wanting Corbyn to win the next election so I can witness the not true labor when it is hit with real world globalised politics.

@inebriati- I’m neither one of the posters in the pictures- I just thought they were apt for the topic and demonstrate quite well the current “othering”mindset being engendered by the Conservative party.

So, apparently in response to an appeal to tell us something positive about a Tory government, you launch into three paragraphs of vitriol about Labour @Justanotherlurker. Not really furthering debate, let alone winning anyone over.

Royallyscrewed I know, and I think the person in the image has a short memory.

So does anyone have a positive reason to vote Tory? Other than the benefits of funding people who come up with such genius ideas as garden bridges, ferry companies that don't yet own any ferries, and killing off the poor and undeserving?

@inebriati I don’t actually know what any of their policies are except that it’s their policy to be diametrically opposed to anything Corbyn suggests regardless of any benefits to the population. They’ve been very successful with the anti Semitic Marxist rhetoric their friend Murdoch is peddling in the media and the sad thing is that large proportion of the people that Corbyn’s policies would benefit the most, blindly believe the propaganda being fed to them by the likes of the Daily Mail.Massively simplified I think BJ/ the Tory party appeals to the idea of class mobility- Id say a huge part of the tories new voter demographic will be 1st gen university graduate offspring of working class parents, mortgage on a new build, working in corporate roles and committed up to their eyes on various goods on finance. On paper they will look well off compared with their parents... people buy into the dream- rich people vote for the Tories, I perceive their political goals will benefit me more than Labour’s will ergo I must be rich or at least on track to become rich....but wait....

@Oliversmumsarmy, of course you and your family weren't 'lucky' to live in overcrowded property decades ago. But how, other than luck, do you explain the fact that you and some of your family members are now comfortably off when other people who worked just as hard as your family member have no assets, no wealth, no secure housing etc? People whose starting point is deprivation, insecurity etc might end up as comfortable as people whose ancestors have a lot of wealth and assets - or they might not. It isn't about the amound of effort they are wiling to expend.

I totally agree with the foolish aspirational vote. You get people on £30k a year voting like they are millionaires.

As for the positive policies. It's like the tumbleweed has floated through here since I asked that.

And public broadband? Are we so naive that we think governments can't already see what we get up to online? The broadband policy is a really good one, we need to have fast reliable broadband - we are so behind other countries on this - and it'll really benefit business. Also think about how much more informed some people could be without their only source of news being the Daily Mail!

If the economy is so good under the Tories then why us everyone so skint spart from the top 1%?
I suspect a good economy to a Tory means the rich have all the weslth.

I rhink people think Corbyn is anti semetic as he friticises Israel....so he should...they have behaved appaulingly. Nowt to do with anti semitism..just anti genicide.

Criticises

just anti genicide
Genocide means killing lots and lots of people and reducing the population. Like Hitler did with the Jews. Compare the stats for the Jewish population of Europe in 1935 with that in 1945. That's genocide.

Now go and compare the stats for the Arab population, in Israel itself and also west of the Jordan, between 1948 and now (or, indeed, between any two dates you care to choose). That is NOT genocide.

Israeli government policies are definitely open to criticism, but when you use terms like 'genocide' in this context, you completely devalue its meaning and are either not being honest, or have been misled.

And one has to wonder why. How is it that the world's only Jewish state gets so much flack compared to other countries? How is it that people are so willing to believe that the Jewish state is committing 'genocide'?

This sort of language is sadly what I expect from the far left of the labor party.

And we are to what pretend that this is anti Semitic

What other world issues are the far left so interest in what’s happening in North Korea or maybe Yemen - no the fixation is on Israel so they can pass off their anti semitism as siding with the Palestinian people it’s plain for everyone else to see

Sorry meant it is not anti Semitic...

As for the positive policies. It's like the tumbleweed has floated through here since I asked that.

I’ll give you a big clue. Read the thread title. Read it again. Read it again. Now, why would anyone considering voting tory bother to discuss their reasons with you?

We are very much looking at a scenario where it’s going to be either Boris or Jeremy in Number 10. For many voters it’s a case of ‘anyone but Boris’. For others it’s a case of ‘anyone but Jeremy’.

Sadly, any threads which are critical of Jeremy/current Labour policy always end up in the same way. The same phrases come up again and again - ‘stupid, gullible, thick, racist, all-right-jackery, right-wing media smear, selfish, lacking in empathy, lacking human decency, turkeys voting for Christmas’. The list goes on.

Occasionally, someone who’s obviously never been around MN during elections before attempts to explain why they would rather vote tory than Labour at the moment, despite not agreeing wholeheartedly with all their policies. It only takes two or three replies before the insults come out.

How can you possibly accuse Corbyn of only criticising Israel and no other state committing human rights violations?

He’s been an MP for 35 years. His voting record and speech history demonstrates this is not even remotely the case.

If he appears to only criticise Israel it’s because that’s what the media is covering, not that this is all he’s saying. It’s categorically untrue that he is more concerned about Israel than any other state.

Maybe read his own words:
jeremycorbyn.org.uk/articles/jeremy-corbyn-my-speech-on-international-human-rights-day/

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/apr/15/un-inspectors-not-bombs-peace-syria-jeremy-corbyn

Or just look at google for 30 seconds:
www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/oct/14/jeremy-corbyn-china-human-rights-record-buckingham-palace-state-banquet

www.politicshome.com/news/uk/defence/news/84841/jeremy-corbyn-theresa-may-sacrificing-human-rights-altar-arms-trade

To say he’s only concerned by Israel is demonstrably untrue.

And Corbyn’s voting record against Johnson’s makes for interesting reading...

www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/10133/jeremy_corbyn/islington_north/votes

www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/10999/boris_johnson/uxbridge_and_south_ruislip/votes

I’ll never agree with any politician on everything, but taken on record alone I know which of these politicians I’m more comfortable with. If anyone hasn’t read these I would strongly encourage you to do so. It’s a good way of cutting through the media bullshit on both of them.

And when available, after manifestos are launched, I would do the voteforpolicies questionnaire, to see which party you most agree with.

How would you explain Corbyn's decision to attend the state dinner for Xi, but boycott Trump's?

My explanation: he admires Xi. I think he gave him absolutely no shit about his human rights abuses as he claims to have, more likely just told him that China is an amazing model for humanity.