Aibu to think that my kids aren’t coming back?

[SeaOfDespair]

I had my girls removed last month and it’s been a very traumatic experience. My family are so far away, my friends have dwindled away and I’m stuck looking at these 4 walls.

I’m seeing a private child psychologist and doing some work with him. He understands how harsh the system can be. I’m doing 2 different parenting courses online. I’m paying for all of this myself and has been a bit of a struggle recently.

My solicitor just tells me to go along with whatever they want. I’ve ticked one thing off the list, but they’re not forthcoming with starting their own assessments. Social worker is either sick, or can’t be bothered.

My youngest has arrived to contact with bruising to her face 4 times. She is cruising, but never managed to be bruised within my care. My elder one seems sort of happy, but is having a lot of tantrums and isn’t able to communicate with me.

From them wanting to keep them at home on an order, their original intentions until the court hearing, to pretending I don’t exist. They didn’t even turn up to the meeting last week. No apology given. No notification of cancellation.

From a case of closing ranks to keeping the case open, it never did surprise me that they applied for a court order. My social worker’s reasoning? I don’t agree with their concerns, so there needs to be a care order.

Am I being unreasonable to think I don’t stand a chance in hell of getting them back, if they’re not willing to even bother working with me?

@SeaOfDespair - I'm not sure what you mean about that area being your local connection? How often do you have contact? Do you drive? After my children were removed i moved 200 miles away. I couldnt cope with the tjought that they were so close and i couldn't go to them. I had to get away. I either drive or take the train to contact, and I've never missed one at all. There are coaches that maty be cheaper or you could get a railcard for the trains? It can be done, it really can.

My house is "a bit messy". There's some washing up on the drainer, a couple of unwashed cups by the sink, a pile of washed laundry waiting to be sorted and put away, DS1's power pack exactly where he dumped it on the bathroom floor, a few magazines on the table and a cushion on the floor where DS1 knocked it off the sofa. The boys' rooms have their crap on the floor but were clear last Friday. Photos would look shit but a solid day's work would have it sparkling.

How would that shape up against your "a bit messy"?

Regarding the moving goalposts, in the first place i would ask for an email with a list of the things social work want you to do but there's a risk that wouldn't turn up and they would say you didn't listen (they're busy and would put the onus on you to adult).

Better to summarise what you were told and ask your contact to confirm that you have understood correctly. If you get taken to court and have no reply, then you can demonstrate that you have cause for complaint.

I have a close family member who works in SS. Children are not taken away for 'no reason'. It costs the council, where my close family member works, £50,000 per year to have ONE child in SS care. There are many children with alcoholic, drug addict, incapable parents who are not taken into care. It takes months, years sometimes to build up enough of a case to remove children. I am sorry, but I think you are in denial. SS simply won't remove children for the sole reason of a 'messy' home.

Sorry OP, ive just seen you get contact 4 times a week - wow!

OP, dont give up. Get more support, Get some help from your family, keep to all the contact and do everything they say. Try and be nice and polite to the SWs even if you don't want to because then they might soften to you and want to help you and be less obstructive.

As to all the people sayinh it wouldnt happen, and they know this because they are a SW or they've not known it happen. I think you know your own office. Youd be surprised

So a 3 year old who doesnt engage or speak, who has been observed to be dirty, living in a home with rising damp, mould, no curtains being raised by a mother who has had mental breakdowns.

It's not ideal is it?

No, I haven’t. There isn’t mess everywhere, I said I can be a bit messy. I’ve already been told that a bit of clutter in the kitchen doesn’t meet the threshold. Their bedroom isn’t mouldy, mine is. I did my best about the leak and it’s been sorted. If I refused the property, I would have been making myself intentionally homeless. I fought for the repair to be done. I went in there 10 times, I emailed lots, I went to shelter.

As I keep reiterating, this was an old property. I did the curtains myself here. This place doesn’t need shelves. I put the beds together myself. I put the cupboards together myself. I got it done.

I’m not sure why anyone would let kids play with mouldy soft toys, that’s actual child neglect... my room has issues with mould, but the girls aren’t in here. There was a leak in the bedroom caused by works done next door. I didn’t know this at the time, as it got worse. So I made sure the room was well ventilated and the radiator was on, when it was raining.

I’ve complied where something has needed doing. Why would I ask them to do things for me? They’d bloody laugh at me. They criticise, they don’t offer guidance. They don’t actually specifically say what needs doing, in the most part. When I’ve asked for their advice, my sw has said she doesn’t know or shrugged at me. When I’ve followed her advice and ended up in debt, she said she never said that. This is my issue. They’re vague.

i do agree that you need to find someone who can advocate for you. That person can speak up when you feel overwhelmed and make sure you're clear about future objectives - and be witness if you have met them but are still being criticised.

I don' have any involvement with SS but I do have kids with ASD but with every dealing with every person in official capacity I've found (even as a middle class educated mother who can talk the talk) that I need to present evidence. That is a universal experience. I've met some amazing professionals who have changed our lives and some downright incompetent ones who have cause many sleepless nights.

How many bloody times? This place has curtains. I’ve never left my children dirty, which is why the social worker hasn’t ever observed that. The rising damp is mainly in my room anyway, it’s not in her bedroom or the living room.

Yes, I will fully admit I had a mental breakdown, 5 years ago, whilst coping with grief from losses. Have you ever lost a baby? If you haven’t, you have no idea how that affect you mentally. I sought counselling. Nor has it ever even been brought up. I’m not saying it’s perfect, but what the hell else was I supposed to do?

They advised me against private rent. There are two options in a homelessness situation: get what you’re given or find somewhere yourself. Beggars can’t be choosers. It’s 100 times safer than where I was before.

I can sympathise on the mould. I have spots in the house where it just appears, regardless. A dehumidifier helps, but that's expensive to buy and run.

Are they looking into a possible diagnosis of autism in your daughter? Or assuming it’s your fault?

Why were you involved with Women’s Aid if not for DV? Was it because of the antisocial behaviour of the neighbours in your previous house?

I think it’s very hard to give advice, OP, as we only have little bits of the whole picture. No-one replying here has seen how you interact with the social services and other authorities for example. it may be that your autism has inflamed certain situations and given the wrong impression of you. They should make allowances for what might come across as abruptness or rudeness though.

Well, I’m not an alcoholic or a druggy. I don’t have a criminal record. I’m not aggressive or violent. I know quite a few cases around here that they won’t deal with when there’s clear danger, such as druggy parents beating the crap out of each other. I don’t prioritise men over my kids.

How would you know what the truth of a case was, anyway? Reports to ss aren’t scrutinised. They’re automatically believed. I found out that health visitor had only been on the job for a week.

Most of the people I’ve seen in the contact centre aren’t druggies or alcoholics. They’re mostly well presented. I’m sure there are a few people with serious issues, but they’re definitely not the type of people you’d expect to lose their kids.

Due to a not so nice family member finding me

I’m always polite, but they tend to roll their eyes at me, sigh over me and gaslight me, so to make an educated guess, they don’t like me. I can’t make eye contact with people, so sometimes I know this can be taken to be dishonest. It makes me feel really uncomfortable. I have a bit of a ‘tell’ too, but I can usually keep my hand flapping under control.

Well - whatever you’re answer is, id be pushing for them to looking into a diagnosis for your daughter, whether it’s neglect delay or autism

I feel for you and I hope you get your kids back.

Due to a not so nice family member finding me

Was this when your kids were with you? Were SS concerned for the safety of the kids regarding this family member?

I have been pushing them, but she’s not in my care now. I’ve called the unit which deals with this issue, I’ve offered to get a loan for a private diagnosis, from a reputable organisation. She’s had her hearing checked. She’s back on the waiting list for further speech therapy. At her last assessment with the speech therapist, she commented that I’m communicating with her in the right way. I’ve worked with a nursery nurse, but she was quite clueless about those type of things.

Yes, it was and no, because I removed myself from the situation whilst I pushed for more safety in the flat. I followed women’s aid advice and moved out for a short period of time. The only concern the ss took was that I moved the girls around. I proved to them that I was made a load of promises from the council, but in the end, the actual landlord (as it’s leased from a private landlord to a company and offered via the council) refused any alterations. I’ve not had any further grief, I think a bit of time away did the trick.

Oh and I’ve had the additional needs learning people around, so that she could have adjustments for when she goes to school. The school I applied to were a bit concerned they couldn’t meet her needs, I had a meeting with the headteacher. She said her lack of responses needs to be further explored, which I totally agree with. She said children in her situation should fall under team around the family, not safeguarding.

Thank you for the supportive comments, I really appreciate them. Sometimes these situations can make one anxious and let down. Thank you again.

Good luck, OP. I hope you get treated fairly and that your autism is allowed for, and your DD’s possible autism is followed up ASAP.

@RightyWrongy they’re disregarding a possible diagnosis and are using to suggest neglect. The speech therapists who’ve been involved have actual concerns about autism, especially with her being totally non-verbal and the family history. I had a really nice health visitor (I’ve had lots now) until she was taken off the case, who said that she doesn’t believe I’m doing anything wrong. She said that I seem to interact really well with her and try to engage her appropriately. She was the only ever health visitor who made time to sit down and watch her. She tried very hard to stay on the case, so that my daughter had appropriate support. The one who replaced her was okish, I had to push her to make referrals, but she did. As she got to know me more, she warmed to us a bit, she said she would like to recommend de-registration, but she can’t if there isn’t anyone else who is supporting that. She went on maternity leave and was replaced by someone who read the ‘history’ and was particularly confrontational with me. I asked whether she’d had any update on my eldest’s referral and she said that she doesn’t need one.

@CurlyhairedAssassin thank you for your kind words