Single parent wants to change career into medicine, but has no support.

[Puzzledbyart]

Just out of interest. Let's say we have two primary aged school children (on the younger side of primary). Is it feasible for their single parent to go through the medical school (with a foundation year, they are in 40s, so long out of school), whilst retaining 100% custody of the children? There is no family help nearby, and no substantial savings to pay for the childcare either. Is it realistic at all?

A Masters in a humanity subject. I understand he has an offer already, or close to it.

Don’t you need science A levels?

He will have less free time studying medicine than he would in a full time job. It’s 9-5 most days . Then there’s studying for exams and doing your e-portfolio which would happen at home. You would probably be expected to go in on the evenings or even overnight during clinical years. The summer holidays are only 4 weeks towards the end of the course .
Doesn’t sound like he’s done much research .

Are parents not allowed to choose family friendly shifts?

Strangely enough, people don’t get sick just between 9 and 5. Why do you think parents can choose family friendly hours? What if everyone is a parent and wants these hours? Does this mean any non-parents get stuck with the shit hours at nights and weekends?

If this person, who is not you, is going into this thinking that they should get preferential treatment and be mollycoddled from the start I would suggest that the gruelling reality of medicine is not for them.

He is in for a massive shock!

#fedup21
I honestly don't know, after some googling isn't it what the entry / foundation year is for?
I did not research this topic in much detail before. The first (compulsory pre-court) mediation session was this week, the mediator was an experienced barrister, and she was making very approving noises of his plan. Or I am imagining that she did, but panicking anyway.

You dont need a science based subject to do the foundation year. Thats what the foundation year is for

If he's doing a foundation year, this may be a 6 year course that mitigates for the lack of Science A-levels.
He sounds dreadful and really lacking in insight. It's a worry for you, but looking at it objectively, I wouldn't have thought he can go from 0% to100% child residency.
Surely the court considers what is in the children's best interests rather than the father's best financial interests?

Is he your ex because he was controlling or is that a new development?

I can’t imagine any judge taking custody of children away from their mother to give to a father simply on the basis that they’re going to study medicine therefore have more free time - there’s so much wrong with that sentence I don’t know where to start!!
Med students are literally some of the busiest people I know. It involves weekends, nights, and hue amounts of personal study. Being a sole carer of multiple children at the same time...the mind boggles. When there’s a caring, active, capable mum on the scene who’s had them since birth?? Give over!

@theboxfamilytree

Yes, it did not work for us because of the controlling issues from his side. But he left on his own accord, found someone new, and the someone new again, then disappeared almost completely and now resurfaced again.

What planet is he on? He doesn't sound like he's ever even watched an episode of ER. These are simply ludicrous ideas that I can't imagine anyone with a brain taking seriously.

OP, I would suggest that you look at the prospectuses and websites of various medical schools yourself. Even contact them as a potential prospective student in your ex's position. See what they say, and use that to build your evidence. Adam Kay's book is another really good starting point. And if you know any doctors, get them to put in writing their experience of training, especially their clinical training and time as junior doctors.

The really big issue is around overnight childcare because there is no way he isn't going to have to do long shifts, night shifts and weekend shifts. There's also very limited flexibility around annual leave at that point, so he'd need to cover school holidays. It is not 6 years of dossing around at university that he is proposing. Even the first 3 years will be full on studying, though with less of the anti-social hours. After that it will be impossible to manage without help.

But also, courts don't generally like to approve 100% residency to a parent who is proposing moving to the other side of the country and asking for the other parent to have limited contact unless there is actually some problem with that parent. If you have shared custody now, they would have to have a much stronger argument than him wanting to study in order to grant his request.

He sounds insane! That's one of the maddest plans I've read on here.

Full time medical student + full time single parent + prior disinterest in his children = delusional individual

So his proposal is that he moves his children across the country, removing them from their main care giver, reducing contact with main carergiver to zilch, and all while he will be undertaking one of the most stressful and demanding career changes a person could do, whilst parenting entirely alone and with no income?

And he thinks that is what is best for his children? And he’s found a solicitor that not only didn’t laugh him out of their office but actually agrees and has taken it to court?

It's doable for those with children. Those with children need serious family back up - the hours are long, brutal, and last for years. Meanwhile, the child pays the price.

There are other medical-type professions that don't require completely sacrificing all time win the child.

*doable for those without

It seems unlikely the mediator would suggest the children move to a different part of the country, with a parent they've had limited contact with to date, just because he says he will have more free time than you.

When I graduated in medicine around 10 years ago I was scheduled for teaching or other activities approx 9-5 each day, and weekends and nights were unusual as a student. Summer holidays I had completely free, other holidays we had some work/ revision taking less than half the holiday. So one workable option would be that he have more contact in school holidays.

The shorter graduate courses though were generally all year round without the long summer break.

As a junior doctor the rota was challenging, lots of long days/ nights/ weekends, and hard to leave on time.

Sounds like he's just messing with you, OP.
Else I want to ask if he has always been a fantasist.
I don't think I would engage very much. Don't dance to his tune.

Getting Foundation places is tough! They are especially meant for kids who went to lousy schools where no one or almost no one got amazing grades.
Unless you're leaving out details of your own huge parental failings, I should think there are at least a dozen reasons why you can convince a court that it's not in the children's best interest for him to get 100% custody.

Meanwhile, the child pays the price.
Thanks for that.. actually my studying is greatly beneficial to my children's future.

I think it might be the most selfish thing they could do. It might well be their dream, but they have responsibilities which have to come first. Get them to read some anatomy and physiology texts, to design a research model quantifying the effect of amino acids on something and such forth, to read abstracts available online (full research usually has to have a subscription) and that might wake them up a bit if the thought of their lonely children doesn't.

What are your own working/studying hours like?

OP, it may be worth asking him to explain the depth of detail to his plans to the Court and let them make up their own minds that he is utterly deluded. Key questions I would be asking, and apologies because I'm making an assumption based on what you've said about him doing the pre-entry year.

1. How far into the pre-entry year is he.
2. What percentage of those on pre-entry get an offer to study medicine at the attached University
3. How sure is he that he will be in that percentage and what is this based on? E.g is he getting top marks out of the class for all assessments? Not just his assumption but backed up by fact.
4. Has he got a guaranteed/close to guaranteed offer in writing? If not, when will he have? (If ever!)
5. Is this offer (if he has one) for the specific hospital and shifts he needs? If not, which hospital(s) and shift(s) does it cover?
6. Does he have it written in the contract that he doesn't have to do nights/weekends?
7. What are his firm plans for school holidays, nights, weekends that he can't avoid?
8. What are his firm plans for emergency cover - either an unwell child or if he is caught late at hospital.
9. Have the Uni given him a guarantee that these favourable conditions will continue in his CMT/Foundation years as a junior doctor (they won't have!!)

Hope this helps

Anyone getting into healthcare especially nursing or medicine has to go in with their eyes open to the shifts that are expected of them. Especially in the foundation years there will be nights, there will be weekends, there is no wandering off from a cardiac arrest because its 5pm. And there are no exceptions for those with families. And there shouldn't be.

Further down the line there are roles that are more family friendly but they involve rotations and extra study, so to become a GP for instance you're looking at about 10 years training from entering medical school.
Lots of people do medicine and nursing in later life and manage fine, but it is a massive commitment for you and your family.
An AHP course with post graduate entry might be a better option?

Well that's why I did not want to mention the whole ex/ custody dynamic. I appreciate that the audience is usually sympathetic to the topic starter, but I honestly wanted some independent thoughts.
There are parenting failures on my side, sure. I am working full-time (more than full time in reality) in a professional job. There are forgotten PE kits, overdue dentist appointments, missed sports days, I do not volunteer as a parent help at school, three thousand jumpers were lost since September, there were instances when I was stuck on a broken train and late for more than an hour for collection. Put together as a neat court pack, it does paint me as quite a neglectful parent. Which maybe I am.