To say sod it and actually go and help children who need it!!

[SimpleSaying1]

I run a Beaver scout group. When it started there was a great understanding from parents that this was a community thing and parents regularly volunteered and helped out. I was involved as my kids both went through and then I stayed on. As it has grown it has become a really popular and active group, with a big waiting list. But the generation of parents who grew it with me have moved on and it has left this really entitled and difficult bunch of parents who seem to think it is a service they are paying for and have no involvement. I struggle week on week to have enough leaders. The only person who really helps is my son who I helped start it for his peers and is now older!! This week I cancelled an event because after asking numerous times no one would help and I didn't have safe ratios. The ONLY comments I got were angry at me for messing up childcare planning and parents demanding part of their subs back because the session didn't run that week!!! I'm a good scout leader, I do a lot for the kids and I love it but even they seem to have a different attitude now. The area has become increasingly wealthy and I feel more and more that I'm providing after-school childcare rather than a meaningful activity that enriches children's lives. In another local town which is really much more deprived they are starting another group, they've got lots of parents volunteers and need an experienced leader. I am so, so tempted to jack it in with the group I've got (it would only carry on if a parent then picked it up) and go and work with this other group?

It always used to be said that if you want anything done ask a busy person. The reasoning behind that is that it is the same people volunteering all the time and lots are just happy to let everyone get on with it. Brownies, Rainbows and Guides is something my girls did and although I did not help at every session I often helped out with trips and was the Treasurer and secretary of the local Guide Association as I could fit that in with work and looking after my other daughter while the first one was in Brownies. Same went for PTA.

I think you are obviously annoyed and I would not blame you for giving up and saying you are not getting enough help and there is another group which needs you more and is more appreciative. You are not providing childcare. If people want childcare to attend Yoga or whatever then they should pay the going rate from an after school club which is way more than Brownies or Scouts subs.

The danger here of course is entitled parents produce entitled kids bu that is not your problem.

OP quit and join the other group. The families can source “alternative childcare” and get a rather rude shock when they realise the price of actually paying in the private sector for all the activities that are done at Scouts.

I'm a leader for a similar group. I started volunteering before I had children but now I do, and also a full time job. We have a lot of volunteers but only one of them over 10 years has been aparent. It's never occurred to me to be irritated by that. Some volunteers even go out of their way to give lifts to the children.
Maybe the parents volunteer in a group for other children or that my children are involved in or just have other things on.
We've very occasionally had to cancel a session when we know we don't have enough volunteers but we would always give at least a weeks notice. I've never heard anyone blame lack of parent help for this it's just one of those things.
Obviously the abuse is out of order and you'd be justified in quitting based on that alone. But it seems simplistic to assume the parents aren't helping the community in other ways which may in turn benefit you.

I'm a Cub leader. After a house move this summer, I've moved from a Group where I was the GSLs wife as well as the Cub leader. DH was the GSL and Scout leader. We had four other leaders. I did all the admin, shopping, finances etc. I ran Scouts and Cubs simultaneously when DH was a way. I started dreading Mondays and the minor complaints and moans. The only reason DH and I kept it going as long as we did was because of the kids, our own in particular.
My new group... We have 5 Cub leaders and share all the tasks. DH is running the Scouts, but he has help. The Beavers have their own leaders. There is a bunch of keen parents. I'm enjoying it all again. So I'd say move. But do talk to your GSL/ District etc and see if there is some more help available.

Scouts and Guides do need parental support to run, but it doesn't necessarily need to be at meetings... There is a lot of background stuff you can help with. But mostly remember it's run by volunteers.

I feel bad reading this. My son does Beavers and whilst I'm always very grateful for what our Beaver leaders do and think they do an amazing job, I just don't have time to volunteer. I have a full time job, 2 children, elderly parents and in laws who need support, a dog and a husband who had a long commute daily so most of the Monday to Friday stuff is down to me. Thankfully, we've not had any requests to volunteer yet but having read this I will try if we're asked.
In answer to the OP you are not being unreasonable and I would leave if I were you citing your reasons why.

Reading these posts.... so many of the beaver volunteers come across as angry and bitter.

Perhaps volunteering isn’t for you?

I'd move. My son is in Cubs now and it's ALWAYS the same parents who turn up when help is needed, time and again. I even had one little girl say to me 'why do you always come to help, my Mummy never does'. I am amazed at the amount of time and effort leaders dedicate to running the group, none of whom have children in the group anymore as they've all grown up and moved on. It's the same with the school PTA to be honest. People are lazy and selfish, and can't be bothered to reschedule their very important diaries to do something that actually benefits their own children. There's always an excuse, but if you really want to help you will find a way. I've been to cub events with a newborn baby attached to my boob, I work, my DH is away (military) and I still manage to do my bit, even if I have to pay for a babysitter for the LO.

OP, you are doing great work, but if I were you I'd go somewhere it's not so unrewarding.

I once had a child at a group ask ‘my friend Amy wants to join, can I bring her next week?’ I said ‘we are one over on our adult to child numbers already, sweetheart, so I can’t accept any more kids.’ I mentioned this to her mum later and yes, apparently Amy is soooo desperate to join. I said that maybe her or Amy’s mum might want to help out so I could facilitate her joining, weirdly they were not so desperate for her to join when they realized it involved them helping out !

Nothing is ever good enough for some people: they don't want their DC confined to a hall, but no one wants to volunteer for an external activity and of course they'd be the first to complain if they felt there was inadequate supervision.

I'd be angry and bitter if someone claiming something for next to nothing started treating me as the hired help.

Wanting a sub refund for a cancelled event? Arseholes.

Pmsl, here you go love, here's your £2. Knock yourself out.

Obviously the abuse is out of order and you'd be justified in quitting based on that alone. But it seems simplistic to assume the parents aren't helping the community in other ways which may in turn benefit you

Agree with this.

I also think though that if you never help, nobody thinks any worse of you. If you start something and then quit, everyone gets offended! So you're almost better off not volunteering at all.

With cubs etc you have to accept that some parents will not be comfortable with volunteering to help with the children. But maybe they can do something behind the scenes instead, eg helping with fundraising.

Yes, dreadful attitude. I admire you OP.

Some of us had to always stay at Beavers in a rota as at Cubs and Scouts.

Was discussing this with dd the other day as her local group has a long waiting list. You can see why.

Its not just Scouts/Beavers/Guides that has this problem! I coached a sport for 10 years but stepped down due to the increasing militancy of the parents of the players coming through. Complaining because I didn't give them enough notice of fixtures so they could arrange family events - in the sport I was involved in everything was last minute as it was still fledgling in its field! I did suggest that the complaining parents took on the organisation leaving me free to coach but they went quiet. I really miss coaching the players - it was so incredibly rewarding watching them improve week after week - but I don't miss the parents in the slightest. The whole club is struggling now because the 'old' volunteers whose kids are now out of the age range of the club cannot get anyone to take over.

Definitely go to the other group. And when the entitled lot complain. Tell them why Mx

Like many clubs and groups, those running them are struggling to find volunteers to help and ensure things can go ahead. Whereas, in the past, there might be three or four leaders of a group, increasingly it is just one person and that's not viable without some helpers. It can't be a 'drop and leave - job done' if there are not enough adults to run it.
My DM gave up running the Brownie group as it became just her on her own and increasingly demanding parents who complained about other children (one actual written complaint that some children attending 'aren't the sort of children I expect mine to have to mix with' i.e. came from the estate that had a bit of a reputation) and were really picky about things. It's a shame as people want these groups and they are so good for communities and for children who attend them...but if you can support another group that can make a real difference to children, it might be time to move on, OP.

I’d go to the other group. The parents can clearly afford to pay for actual care. Lol at what Jaynetheplane said. Her weekly £2 would get the maximum of 10 mins childminding.

@Lovemenorca "bitter" is quite a reach, but I suspect you're the sort of entitled person who feels that not only should other people volunteer but they should do so without complaint at arsehole parents

Absolutely go, no question.

Many years ago my mum and dad ran a group for a similar organisation. They dedicated at least three nights a week and every other weekend ti activities. They put on an awards night for the families and at the break all the day stents went to the pub. That was the day they decided to give up.

It's a hard position. I'm a cub leader and have always helped leading, gardening or maintaining a scout hut since I started in scouts but that was due to my mum not being able to help volunteer.

I completely understand that some parents can not help weekly but it does not stop them or their children helping when they can.

It is forcing GSL, leaders and committees to enforce parent helpers even though they don't want to due to the fact without enough people it simply can not run. We understand parents do what they can but because the parents who never want to help seems to be increasing and the parents who always help are helping everywhere else too so they get burnt out or simply don't have the time to help anymore it's hard to know what to do.

In my group I have one leader but he is in the navy so at any point I could lose him then I'm desperate. I am for next week and sent a begging email. Out of 18 I have had 2 which I am very grateful for but it's really sad. They are people that always try and help.

In your place I would go for the other group. Please do!!!! You'll have help and it will be marvellous.

Im never asked to help out at my DS's current cub group because they have a large explorers group who help out, I think as part of their DofE.My kids did go to a group where we used to live that had a parent rots. It worked out at about one session every 2 months because everyone was required to help out.I worked full time, but one evening every 2 months hardly put me out, especially as the rest of the time, my kids got to do an activity that cost peanuts . Tell them to bugger off and go to the other group. Lifes too short.

YANBU I helped at Brownies as a permanent extra helper while my girls attended and a little while after. Have to say everyone here DID appreciate it and we had a rota so extra parent each week, but it is hard work and noone (including me!) was willing to train and become an assistant leader which meant if main Brown Owl was away or ill, it couldn't happen. She was also a volunteer of course. The subs were something like £10 a term, ridiculously low, just to cover costs - the whole point being that you're trying to make it as inclusive as possible. We used to do loads of preparation and often spent our own money on craft materials so subs went towards trips and so on. There is also now a huge amount of paperwork to complete for every activity (health and safety gone mad!) and accounts to submit to the central organisation, so it is not just the 2 hours of the meeting that the leader is giving up. I realise its 'their choice' but if they didn't do it, then it wouldn't happen. I would definitely say go somewhere the children will benefit from your time and experience because their parents can't afford different after-school clubs every night, I'm sure you won't regret it.

I think the point here is that you would not need parental volunteers if there are sufficient permement voluntary leaders (for the number of children).
But then, voluntary parents on, say, a rota of one a term, would help in case one of the permement leaders was sick, or absent for any reason.
It requires many hours of dedication for leaders to devise activities for the children, which are usually of a semi-learning variety.
My children loved beavers and cubs, and it is a shame if these groups closed through not enough helpers.