To think that women going on holiday to places like Tunisia should be warned

[Moomin8]

By holidays reps About these men who are waiters / bar staff / animation workers looking to get money from older (or younger) western women by this 'Bezness' culture?

My friend is 40 and met a Tunisian guy who is 24 - he was working in the Tui hotel resort she was holidaying in. He's just asked her to marry him and she's considering moving her two little dds to Tunisia. Cue photos of diamond encrusted gold engagement ring. She has only spent about 3 separate weeks with him!

She will want to believe he's different I guess. But really, what I hear is that these men are sometimes players of a very long game, will keep up the act for 3 years or more to get what they want (a visa, or money / access to wife's possessions so that he can then afford to go back to Tunisia and pay the dowry for his 'real' wife).

I don't think people are aware of just how these people operate. My friend is a vulnerable person. My heart sank when she announced the engagement 🤦🏻‍♀️

Doesn't Take A Break run Tunisian Love Rat Took All My Savings stories every year?

SeaEagleFeather. Yes if you read by earlier post again you’ll notice I said one of the reasons an Iraqi may be interested in kidnapping a Northern European looking child is for political reasons. By this I meant Isis followers. It will get them attention in the European press and possible ransom money.

However, again this does not mean that non terrorist Iraqis genuinely prize the blond child over their own.

I think you are confusing what vulnerable means. You think she is vulnerable because she has kids and alot to lose.

Having a lot to lose doesnt make her vulnerable. The fact that he is poor does make him vulnerable. Just like women here often end up working as a sex worker through poverty, here.

They are very poor and have figured out that plenty of older women abroad are a way to keep the wolf from the door.

The fact that your friend doesnt view it as that, has nothing to do with it. Men going on holiday to shag Thai women, dont view what they are doing as wrong.

I really think these women who go abroad to shag these men in exchange for money and gifts are exploiting the fact that they are poor. The fact that then, they get emotionally involved doesnt make there any less exploitation.

It is true that people are responsible for their own stupidity. However, the holiday companies could at least make an effort by banning hotel staff from flirting with tourists in hotels they use. If you go to the café, theoretically the transaction is limited to purchase of beverage, service of said beverage, and a bit of polite chat. You didn’t spend all that money on a holiday to be treated as a sitting duck by the people who are meant to provide a service.

I think you are confusing what vulnerable means. You think she is vulnerable because she has kids and alot to lose.

That's not specifically the reason why I see her as vulnerable. Some of the things that have happened to her in her life have made her vulnerable (some as a child).

She's not 'choosing' to see it differently - this man has made an actual proposal of marriage and has sought to make it look authentic by offering her an authentic looking engagement ring and introducing her to his family etc. She really does believe that this man truly loves her.

I don't think you can compare it with men going abroad for sex tourism (which is vile and exploitative and there is a power imbalance between men and women in any context. You can't just switch it around).

There is a power imbalance. Money is the power imbalance. Both men and women can be in either side of that.

Generally the power imbalances in is mens favours. In individual circumstances, that's not always the case.

When she started this with him he hadnt proposed. She was just faltered by the younger man giving her attention and was happy to go with it without thinking about his vulnerabilities

Also, with all due respect many of us were abused as children and then as adults and had awful things happen to us. We dont then put our children at risk.

My point is that you friend is a fully functioning adult. You may think shevis vulnerable but totally ignoring how his economic situation makes him vulnerable.

At worst your friends is a sex tourist. At best they were both taking advantage of eachothers vulnerabilities. And quite frankly you are being naive if you dont realise that plenty of groups of older women go to these places, on purpose for sun, sex and sex with younger men.

However, the holiday companies could at least make an effort by banning hotel staff from flirting with tourists in hotels they use.

How anyone, including a holiday rep, enforce that. Wherea the line between flitting and chatting or being friendly.

Would you really want to see these people lose their jobs for chatting people.

Maybe they should ensure staff work in silence and stare at the floor.

Tellmetruth4

well, my friend is much more afraid that someone will kidnap her to sell her to someone to marry once she's a bit older. It's the unstable civil order there - people are beyond desperate and societal standards are not what they were, she says - and her daughter is a very pretty blonde haired girl.

In my friend's case, it's got nothing to do with ISIS or politics.

Agreed that few people would adopt a stray child whatever the colour of her hair, but she's mentioned a couple of times that she keeps a hawk eye on her child because she's a pretty blonde who's taller than average for her age.

You now have to meet an earnings qualification before you can bring a spouse over too

Not necessarily.

Friend had an accident that resulted in her being permanently disabled. Caused by her partner.

For years she just thought it was just an unfortunate accident.

Only after going through her divorce that she is now questioning whether he did it on purpose.

Her income meant that she didn’t earn enough to support his visa application but there is a clause that waves the earnings criteria and that is if the person is disabled and the visa applicant is their carer.

Reading all the criteria, my friend thinks there is a strong possibility that she was injured because her partner needed his visa.

So be warned that not earning enough is not a protection against being taken for a ride.

Obviously I can accept that people in bad situations will do what they can to get out of them but I don't see how that makes it acceptable to lie to someone and take all their money as has been described on the thread by others who've seen the same thing happen.

Reading all the criteria, my friend thinks there is a strong possibility that she was injured because her partner needed his visa.

I didnt say it was acceptable. I said that when you have experienced real poverty, there are things you would normally do that you wouldnt. And that real poverty makes you vulnerable.

Which makes your friend the same as him.

I don't think women who hang around with young men in places like Jamaica and Tunisia in bars are of quite the same order as the middle aged men chatting up young women in Thailand

Seriously why are they not the same. They are looking for and paying for sex and use their relative economic power to get it.

You say your friend is vulnerable ? It’s her two daughters who are the ones tally at risk as this relationship will make her and then the poorer .

I do know a girl that this happened to and they are still together, he came to live here and they had ivf to have children, she was the same age as him though.

Your friend needs to take in to account just how risky it will be over there for her young girls, that would my my concern, if she didn't have children I would let her get on with it!
You hear tales of 60 year old obese women losing all their life savings to these rats, they must talk a good game to make these women believe that a 20 odd year old lad is madly in love with them!

Oliversmumsarmy
That is shocking and very sad.

I would say in defence of North African men that I have been married to an Algerian for 19 years and none of his friends are like this. I can understand why getting to Europe is seen as a panacea compared to the instability and corruption they face at home. I think taking her children to Tunisia is stupid and irresponsible. Has she checked the legal position if she marries him; will he get parental rights? Will he be able to block her from leaving with them?

I doubt she has checked the legal position tbh. What a nightmare.

I do know a girl that this happened to and they are still together, he came to live here and they had ivf to have children, she was the same age as him though

My friends ex was similar age to her, they were married 20 years and to friends and outsiders they looked like they were happy

It was only when things got completely out of hand and police were called that it came out that he had been abusing her for years.

She had actually been recording the abuse for years.

They too had children.

You cannot tell what exactly goes on behind closed doors

Seriously why are they not the same. They are looking for and paying for sex and use their relative economic power to get it.

Because we don't live in a world where women pretend to have feelings for a man so he will have sex with him or a world where people say of men 'he was asking for it'

Have you ever been to Thailand? The women/girls often pretend to love the man. Usually the are very vunrable and forced into it by family. The old men should know better not to abuse this. As should the old women who go to places like Tunisia. They do know better but they don't care.

Because we don't live in a world where women pretend to have feelings for a man so he will have sex with himora world where people say of men 'he was asking for it'

Are you serious? Many men get ripped off like this. I worked with a man whose first wife walked our the same day she got her own legal status to stay here. Not sure the terminology.

And again, yes he walked right into it. No way was his 20 year old wife attracted to my 60 year colleague. Nor was he wealthy. But to her he was.

Unfair title to single out Tunisians.

Tunisian men young and old I found respectful and polite in both the holiday resorts and rural villages. I hitch hiked around the country for 5 weeks in my early 30s.

Tunis particularly is no different to any other large cosmopolitan city; westernised, multi cultural, multi lingual, law abiding.

But yes, your friend may well be daft, and fortunately it’s not UAE so once she realises her mistake she’ll not have any problems returning to the U.K. with her kids.

Don't be so bloody ridiculous, your friend is an adult, a dumb one no doubt, but she is very much a grown up & bloody stupid for thinking a 24 yo would be interested in her for anything else. I'm not sat a 20 something won't have a genuine relationship with a woman of your friends age, it happens & can actually last well, we have friends in this category who've been together long time & very happy. It's bloody rare though & your friend needs to grow the feck up & stop putting her DCs at risk by chasing men young enough to be her son & expecting a relationship out of it.

But FTR, I've travelled the length of Tunis on my own & had not trouble at all, yes flirty at times, but I wasn't dumb enough to bite, so it was only ever respectful banter

There is also a lot of men going to Tunisia for young men

They are exploited terribly

I saw many older European men enjoying the company of those young enough to be their sons or grandsons and also men seeking out young good looking men to pleasure their wives

Given that it’s certainly far more taboo (and against the law) there probably adds to the excitement for many but the tourists are not the ones who will be punished

Are you serious? Many men get ripped off like this. I worked with a man whose first wife walked our the same day she got her own legal status to stay here. Not sure the terminology.

This with bells on. I don't know any women who have been caught out in this way. I do know several men though. 2 of these young"wives" were American