A womans assurance that she is using contraception.

[perkypink]

I'm not too sure how to title this.

A man and a woman enter into an adult consensual sexual relationship. The woman assures the man that she is using contraception (whether or not this is being used correctly is a different matter) and is happy to have sex without a condom (whether this is explicitly expressed or not). It is assumed when they have consensual sex and a condom is not used. A woman falls pregnant.

I don't understand why when the woman falls pregnant and the man wants to absolve his parental responsibility does the calls of 'was he using a condom' start. No - he wasn't using a condom because there was an assurance that contraception was being used and you were happy without using a condom.

When you are having that initial conversation about contraception and a woman assures a man she is using contraception and is happy without using a condom I feel the shouts blame on the man after when he doesn't want to be a father is sometimes unfair when he has acted on the word of the woman.

I am really interested to hear other peoples thoughts on the matter. Should there be better sex ed and should boys be told never to trust anybodys word on whether they are using contraception?

Today 21:29Hey1256

For those claiming the guy should use condoms they split and fail more frequently than the contraceptive pill.

So what happens then?

Well then dont bloody have sex then if you dont want that risk or get a vasectomy.

Interestingly, the only time I’ve ever had condoms split was when my ex had poked holes in the entire box.

When I had 'the talk' with my 2 sons I told them that they were responsible for their own contraception no matter what the girl/woman said about being on contraception. And that the only 100% effective contraception was abstinence or 'penis nowhere near the vagina' sexual activity.

But I also told them that no method of contraception is 100% failure-proof and that if they chose to engage in intercourse with or without using a condom that they also had to accept the results if there was a contraceptive failure or even if their partner was lying about being on contraception.

It's called personal responsibility.

Don't forget that a lot of men don't much like condoms and would prefer not to use them, yet are indifferent as to whether or not a pregnancy occurs ("she should have been on the pill/she told me she was on the pill/well she can always go and have an abortion"). But the idea that men who do not wish to start a pregancy should, you know, take responsibility for preventing one by either using a condom or avoiding PIV sex horrifies so many people. It's as though ejacuilating into a vulva is the only type of sex that matters to men.

No contraception method is a 100 percent effective. By having sex, there is always a risk that it will result in a pregnancy. The bloke does not get to wash his hands and walk away.
Both partners using contraception makes sense as it lowers the risk to a very low percentage.
Also I'd imagine that unless in a very serious relationship where you have both had sti screenings, the partners would want to use condoms anyway.

Are you a DH of that woman who confessed here not so long ago to popping pills into a sink for a month?

What young people should be taught as the core of effective sex education is that PIV is not compulsory and that other methods of sexual enjoyment exist which do not carry the risk of unplanned pregnancy, or as big a risk of STIs. Hands, mouths, bums, toys, all can be used if you are having sex for fun rather than trying to start a pregnancy.

I believe each individual is responsible for their own fertility...if a man doesn’t want children then wear a condom

No contraceptive is 100% effective

Nobody owes you sex, just dont do it unless you are willing to raise a child and even then take your own precautions. Vasectomy is minimally invasive.

No contraception is 100% I got pregnant on the depo. Men should understand that, we do! why more men who don’t want, or never want any or more children don’t get the snip is beyond me. Nothing is guaranteed

whoever is convinced they don't want a pregnancy should be the one using contraception.

I wouldn't trust a man or a woman to have reliable contraception in place unless I was in a very long and committed relationship

anyone who does otherwise is bonkers

No contraception is absolutely 100% reliable ... Some is of course better than others. Using a condom has one utterly wonderful result... NO HORRIBLE SOGGY SQUIDGEY DAMP SPLOT BANG IN THE MIDDLE OF THE BED!!

There needs to be other contraceptive options for men. They get one option that isn't sterilisation, women have multiple.

Men can campaign for them then. It's not like there's a shortage of male scientists or investors. If men actually cared about contraceptive choices it would happen.

The truth is that men on the whole wouldn't put up with the health risks, side effects, inconvenience or faff that women do in order to prevent conception. Not when they can just stick it in then walk away.

should boys be told never to trust anybodys word on whether they are using contraception?

Absolutely and this is what my adult teen sons have been told. Nothing is 100% safe and they understand that, but if they don't want to be a father, they need to wear a condom.

It only takes a couple of minutes to change your life forever, you want that change to be welcome and not a mistake.

It was ever thus. The greatest power a woman has is where she is responsible for contraception and 'accidently' falls pregnant. A doctor I know has said that when he was training and was doing the maternity part of his training, the consultant was polite in public but privately cynical of the level of pill 'failures'. Of course there are some, but let's face it there are women who are so desperate for a baby that they'll stop contraception and have a pill 'failure with partners who have made it clear they don't want children. Sometimes this ends happily with partners coming around to parenthood, sometimes not. As a pp has said, if a man really doesn't want a child then he needs to take responsibility for contraception himself ...not a popular option.

Having sex leads to babies. If a man wants to avoid that risk 100%, then he should wear a condom or abstain

This.

I always told my sons that to have sex without a condom is allowing someone else to make the decision to have a baby. A child which they would be compelled to support and yet have no guaranteed right to a relationship with.

As a woman I wouldn’t trust a man who said he was infertile/had had the snip, I’d still want to be in control of my own fertility. Why shouldn’t men be responsible? Until there is a greater range of options though women will have to take the most responsibility as they have to literally bear the consequences.

YABU

Until there is a greater range of options though women will have to take the most responsibility

And this is exactly why there's such a lack of funding,research and vociferous demand for more male contraceptives. They do not want the added responsibility that would come with it.

Easier to whinge and to blame the wicked,deceitful women.

I've become pregnant while taking the pill correctly - on the dot every day time wise, no sickness, no contraindicated medication. No contraception is 100 % effective

But I can absolutely also understand how easy it is to forget, be late taking etc people are human and fallible without there necessarily being ulterior motives.

But as a result until I was actively trying to conceive I insisted on sexual partners using condoms too.

It's not just about contraception either I must admit I too get frustrated reading on here of women getting pregnant FAR too early in a relationship because couples haven't taken contraception OR their sexual health properly seriously.

As a member of the generation who reached age of consent during the aids scare it really shocks me!

There's still no cure for hiv or herpes. Other Stis can also be/become very serious and have long term effects. So I really don't understand the lax attitudes we have now to sexual health.

ANYBODY having penetrative sex needs to take personal responsibility for their health and fertility.

"Entrapment" tends to be the cry of selfish, irresponsible arseholes who were more than happy to risk unprotected sex at the time, often without really checking what if any contraception the woman might be using but who when a pregnancy occurs try and escape their responsibilities.

No, men are just as responsible and just as capable of taking action to avoid pregnancy as women are.

Pretty shitty too that the trials of male pill were ended because the participants couldn't "cope" with the mostly mild side effects that women have been tolerating for what? 60 odd years now? Pathetic!

Of course there are some, but let's face it there are women who are so desperate for a baby that they'll stop contraception and have a pill 'failure with partners who have made it clear they don't want children.

It’s not just a woman’s trick though. There are men who are so desperate for a bare willied shag they will say they’re infertile, allergic to condoms, can’t feel anything with them on, can’t come with them on, can’t get it up with them on, will pull out on time, take it off without telling her etc. Like I said upthread- my own ex pierced a hole through each condom in a box. It really isn’t just a case of desperate broody women tricking men.

I don't understand why when the woman falls pregnant and the man wants to absolve his parental responsibility does the calls of 'was he using a condom' start. No - he wasn't using a condom because there was an assurance that contraception was being used and you were happy without using a condom

Because parents don’t get to “absolve parental responsibility” just because they feel like it without wider society expressing reasonable (IMO) opinion that they shouldn’t have become parents if they didn’t feel like it.

Men need to be responsible for their own contraception or abstain from piv sex or accept that sex leads to babies. You can’t just have a baby and whine that someone else should have made sure it didn’t happen so why should you be a parent because when you get down to brass tacks, you are the parent, for better for worse. As you stated in your op, these are adult relationships ergo they demand adult behaviour.
I don’t want anymore children. I still have piv sex. I accept there is a risk that I’ll either have another child or an abortion. Why should the p part of the piv sex get to absolve responsibility? Because I’m a woman so I need to clear up the mess? Because the female orgasm is demonstrably superior to the male? Because “consensual adult relationships” are between an adult woman and a whiny man baby? Put a damn condom on. It’s not hard. I can do it with my teeth with my hands tied behind my back.

Pretty shitty too that the trials of male pill were ended because the participants couldn't "cope" with the mostly mild side effects that women have been tolerating for what? 60 odd years now? Pathetic

Obviously the side effect of fathering a child isn't so bad then.

We are all responsible for our own fertility and reproduction.

You can put your trust in someone else, but you can't be 100% sure. If reproduction happens you're in fault for wrongly putting your trust in the other person.

An unwanted pregnancy is the risk you take when putting your trust in someone else to take care of contraception. If you're not prepared to take the risk, don't engage or take care of your own contraception.

If men took the pill, would you trust the word of a stranger to not use a condom?

He had known her in a work capacity before this point for several years.
She wasn't a stranger to him, if that was the case he'd have been a massive idiot with a huge proportion of blame.

I don't know why he didn't rush out to get latex free condoms, I can only imagine that he'd been in the moment at that point (?)
But I still struggle to blame him.
He trusted her.
A fool, yes and massively naive for his years.

But, it was a relationship built on years of friendship.
Clearly the dynamic changed when they attempted a relationship, but by that point it was too late.