to wonder why so many MILs seem to be absolutely and utterly bonkers?

[MILfatigue]

I've just read the thread about the MIL kicking off about a bank account for DGD, and have also been following the one about baby stuff being donated prematurely.

My own MIL has, for the last 18 years, veered, completely unexpectedly and inexplicably, between being lovely, lovable, generous and great company, to being really moody, trying to pick fights with me or subtly bully DD behind DH's back, and generally being very mean. It's like two different people! I can never predict what will bring out mentalist MIL. Don't get me wrong, she's not a patch on some of the MILzillas one reads about on here, but it is still baffling and upsetting.

Problem MILs seem to be such a frequent thing and on MN particularly. Are there any broad theories on what causes this? In my case, I used to think hormones, but that ship has long sailed. Is it just an age-old conflict, has it got worse recently, or is it worse on MN?

Genuinely curious.

Not saying there weren't controlling selfish mothers and mils before then but compared to my own grandmothers it's definitely got worse.

It seems obvious to me. At a minimum, the only things you may have in common with your MIL are you both love the same person and you are both humans. If you have more things in common with your MIL then you are more likely to be friendly with her. This is not guaranteed because there is zero logic to falling in love with someone.

After all, do you hang out with people based solely on whether an existing friend is already friendly with them? Or, do you make friends based on whether or not you have a common interest in something?

The other thing to bear in mind is that people are more likely to complain about problems than to share news about mundane contentment. Any internet forum will have more stories about awful MILs than stories about ordinary MILs.

Thanks for all the comments. It is interesting to see people's views and experiences. I think I was hoping for moderately generalised explanations as to why it happens that would lead to ways of handling it, but I'm hearing it is, of course, not as simple as that.

There is a difference between quirks of personality (which can indeed be extremely grating) and deliberately challenging behaviour. My MIL truly goes from being as nice as the ones some of you describe (the ones you love and really get on with), to being cold and unpleasant, judgmental, making snide comments, making it clear she doesn't like it agree with a single thing I (and sometimes DD, too) say or do. At those times I could say something as harmless as "it's a nice sunny day, isnt it?" and rather than having to agree with me, she'd go "hmmmm" and make a face as if I'd said something so unspeakable that it is only good manners and the love of her son that prevent her from letting rip and putting me in my place. I really I'm not exaggerating. My DH and DD see it, and feel so sorry for me (that really bugs me, that DD is old enough to notice and feel sorry).

And this could be a couple of weeks after we've spent a lovely afternoon just the two of us shopping and eating and chatting about everything. With no event during those two weeks that would explain the switch.

How do you deal with that?!?!!?

I think it’s just a reflection on the fact people are different- and some get on, some don’t. In-law relationships are sometimes difficult because there may be little in terms of common interests or experiences or approach/attitude and there isn’t the emotional bond/shared common experience to overcome that.

My MIL and I are close now, though still have our moments, but didn’t get on at all to begin with. I think mutual understanding that the other has our shared families (I.e my husband/her son and my DC/herDGC) interests at heart has helped.

Initially, I think it was an identity/expectation issue- she had the role of traditional farmers wife and felt I wasn’t stepping up to the mark- which in some respects was true but I was holding down a full-time, professional job. Something alien to her- she has adored being a farmers wife with a large family to fuss over and running the house, as well as some aspects of the farm. It was a huge part of her identity and found it hard to understand why I did not want the same and I think felt I was looking down on her choices with my “important job”. She was quite frosty and at times openly hostile. To be fair, I think I tried to remain polite but did manage to convey my mutual feelings at times.

In turn, I was frustrated that she wanted me to stop doing a job I loved and had worked hard to qualify for and then train in- like I was just there to facilitate my husband’s livelihood and be a “good wife”. I felt she wanted to limit and stifle me.

Looking back, it was just different expectations, experiences and cultural norms. What changed things for us in a big way is when my income/savings (and taking on extra work) helped negate a financial problem and stopped land having to be sold. She began to see I really was invested in the whole thing, but went about it in a different way. She started to thaw after that (and even asked for a baking recipe... high praise indeed- knew I’d made it then). In turn, I could see that she had been worried that I wasn’t really up for everything this lifestyle involves and would not muck in, but would scarper at first sign of trouble and hurt her son.

Now she is an involved and living mother, mother-in-law and grandmother. She has her moments of putting her oar in where it is not needed, which is annoying, but is (on the whole) meant well- so I try to take it in the spirit it is intended though will sometimes gently remind her that we all have our own way of doing things. In turn, she tries not to interfere too much (I can sometimes tell she is biting her tongue!) and does help quite a lot, including with my parents as my father isn’t in the best shape. She actually gets on really well with my mother. Off how things work out- at the start I could not see a way we could ever get on.

I`m really lucky my in laws are lovely! .....shame about my own folks!

I don’t care what anyone says- if you’re a MIL you can’t behave the same way a maternal grandparent can with the children. Unless you are very close with your sons wife. My Mum would absolutely agree, as would my Grandma. They are very respectful with DIL and will always make sure they don’t overstep. They are of course respectful for me too but I am more accepting of advice/ okay to have them around when I’m feeling vulnerable.

My MIL was constantly criticising. Babies feet are too cold, why is she sleeping on her front (at 8 months old!!), constantly criticising over BLW. My parents don’t interfere. Hence why I see them a lot more and don’t like to see PIL more than every month- although they complain if it’s been more than a week.

DH can barely tolerate his own Mum so he doesn’t expect me to . I think she has good intentions but she’s just quite overbearing with a rather shrill voice that runs straight through you. She buys absolute crap all of the time from charity shops with probably the best of intentions but it’s just shit nobody needs or wants so it ends up back at the charity shop...

She also sends DH rather crass ‘jokes’ on WhatsApp and some vulgar videos too, he doesn’t find it funny and just ignores it. He has sent her photos of baby DS before and she has responded with what is basically porn... Strange woman.

Surely it’s just different people. As someone else posted - if you look at some of the things people write on here then it shows you that there’s some really crazy MIL and DILs in waiting!

I think it’s also situational. I’ve only remembered this morning that when we found out I was pregnant, I was telling DH how exciting it would be to tell his parents (his mum had always subtly lectured about GC and how much she wanted to be involved). I genuinely thought that, despite her difficult personality and our differences, a GC might bring us together or help her warm to me. As it was, a GC has done the opposite and she’s become full on loony. Counting the number of times she’s held the baby and complaining it’s not as much as my DM, harassing DH on the phone to come and visit and not taking ‘we’ll get back to you when we’ve looked at the diary’ for an answer, creating a big scene about the surname we chose (double barrelled with my surname and took her maiden?!), constantly asking if I’ve left the baby yet and has my mum had her, how long will I bf for etc. We’ve just been hounded and every time she’s come to visit since GC’s arrival she’s spent a significant proportion of time in the toilet crying. So I think it must be something unique also to having children that draws out the craziness in some MIL?! Maybe she saw that her son well and truly would have to prioritise his little family now, whereas before she could try and assert her control still? No idea. She doesn’t have many close friends and she has no relationship with her IL’s, so I think that speaks volumes.

@PenelopeFlintstone Your MIL sounds lovely. In my case, I’m the Australian one and my MIL hasn’t ever given me anything with a gift tag. In fact, she’s never bothered to learn my name in the decade I’ve been with her son and refers to me using a totally different name. Welcoming.

In our case it would have done my MIL well to at least pretend not to hate me given I was the one who insisted we actually move closer to her so we could spend time with her and get to know each other better. After a few years of trying and just being shat on I had to give up and moved across the world to get my distance. My now husband chose to follow. No one’s a winner.

As for those who claim us mean old DILs will get what’s coming to us when we’re MILs, surely it’s not difficult to understand people are different? I can’t imagine ever taking off with anyone else’s baby against their will, for example. That’s just ONE of my MIL’s shitty acts. Just one.

I look at it the other way. Why so many women have a problem with their mil. Statistically a certain percentage of us here are going to be/or already are these supposedly crazy mils. There does seem to be something deeper going on.

Mine has moved a long way away. We now get on very well.

Judging from the number of MiL threads, it's obviously not unusual to have a bonkers one. I can't help wondering sometimes who is more bonkers, the MiL or the DiL.

In my case it’s different people with different expectations.

I didn’t really have grandparents (either dead or low contact as toxic). And I’ve been brought up to be fairly independent of my parents (here if you need it, if not crack on). So my expectation was that we would have a polite, loving and kind relationship but that they wouldn’t necessarily know everything or be involved on a daily phone call basis, and we would be expected to be able to do our own ‘adulting’.

My mil didn’t have a mil so never had to negotiate the dynamic. Her mum lived with her, and her boys were brought up to not upset mum (had mental health issues when they were small, undiagnosed as it would of been a scandal, but DH and DBIL both remember always being told not to upset her as she wouldn’t be able to cope with it). Her expectation was that I’d be a good little wifey, make her son breakfast and tea each day (and wipe his arse), and defer to him and to her. Luckily it’s not what my DH wanted Or married! We had many many horrible times (e.g. she snooped in draws, I found her looking at my bank statements, disregarded anything we asked wrt the kids (only basic routines/ food etc), made lots of derogatory comments about my other SIL who is pretty damn amazing, etc etc etc). It took a huge toll on my marriage, and eventually a massive blowout from DH when she was being rude about me and her being kicked out of our house for her to re evaluate.

She has made a huge effort since then to back off, be nothing but positive, and we get on much better. (It helps that the kids are older and can now cope with nothing but sugar for 3 days on the trot 😆). We aren’t close, and never will be with everything that has gone on, but I encourage my DH to arrange contact (it’s now v much his job not mine to maintain his relationship with his parents), and that she sees our kids. She in turn is now polite to me and about me and my SIL as far as I’m aware, and she loves my kids. I’m happy for them to have that bond, as she’s not a bad person, she had just not thought that any other way was acceptable.

Setting aside the really awful abusive or just plain bonkers ones, I think the problems often stem from a misunderstanding of the nature of the relationship. Sometimes either the mil or the dil expect to be closer than it’s reasonable. If you meet a person who comes from a different generation, possibly different background or with different interests or views, the chances of you being more than cordial acquaintances is pretty remote. A mil’s primary relationship is with her child and her grandchildren. They are the ones with the shared history. If mils and dils aim for pleasant cordiality anything else is a bonus. IMHO.

Ps I do remember shouting ‘she’d still breastfeed you if she could’ to DH after one awful visit 🤣 but I also did a lot of reading to try to understand her feelings and realised how much of a bond she had with my babies, and how hard it was to step back and bite your tongue ( if you’ve always had your way it’s not something you’re going to learn overnight!) So it was learning a new dynamic and understanding from both sides, not just hers.

@BertrandRussell I think you just said what I was trying to but in a much better way!

@Confusedrelation

I think about my mil. I don’t like her very much- we’re different people in practically every way (although I had to mentally apologise to her recently when I discovered that she didn’t- as I assumed- vote Leave!). I wouldn’t choose to spend time with her if I could help it. But she’s a brilliant mum and granny, and my dp and my children love her. So it’s nothing to do with me, really.

I think if you're a grudge holding spiteful vindictive manipulative type of human as a young person then you're going to be that as an older person. Hence you get batshit MILs.

I doubt very much they wake up one morning and decide to act out.

If your usual method of dealing with problems is a diplomatic approach then you're more likely to be mindful of how you talk to people and being considerate in general.

In my experience their unpleasant characteristics just get concentrated as they get older and start to feel like they need to control everyone and still be centre stage in the family which is not really tenable over your children's lifetime.

You should read the comments on dadsnet about MILs. Just ruthless about your mums ladies. Just like you are ruthless about their mums. Pathetic

In addition to what other PP have covered I think there are also a lot of undiagnosed MH issues and personality disorders in previous generations.

Things that perhaps (if you're lucky) would be diagnosed now and maybe would have had some therapy. This is really coming from my observation of some of my friend's mothers.

My MIL is awesome. As is FIL.

“ I think if you're a grudge holding spiteful vindictive manipulative type of human as a young person then you're going to be that as an older person. Hence you get batshit MILs.”

Doesn’t it follow from that that there must be an equal number of batshit DILs?

Possibly the same reason as why there are so many batshit crazy and nasty DIL. On mumsnet anyway.

“Possibly the same reason as why there are so many batshit crazy and nasty DIL. On mumsnet anyway.“

But there aren’t!