...to buy radar key online to use disabled loo?

[Marigo]

I’m not disabled and neither are any of my children, however I’m often out with my 3 under 2.5 and in our local shopping centre loos there’s no toilet in the baby change. The ladies is impossible with double buggy plus buddy board and the disabled requires a radar key. Same for the loos in the two big department stores so I just can’t go out into town unless it’s the weekend and my husband can come in case I need a wee! I’m struggling to leave the house for this stress but my mom is disabled and I know how shit it is when she can’t use the large cubicle she needs. I’m really conflicted about what to do.

Here's a picture which shows some of the place. You can see that there are 3 levels on the tree. Each level has a door behind the tree that which takes you out of the area and the life is on the other side of the building. Able people can go down the steps inside the tree easily to get to the next level or they can walk across the rope bridges to another place with steps. So they get to descend through the jungle, whereas I got to descend through the staff area. Not such a nice experience.

Yes there are places I avoid. For example a “family friendly” place locally has only one disabled toilet which is also the baby change. As a result there is often a queue of people waiting to take a family trip into the toilets while people like DS or my dad are unable to access the only toilet that meets their needs. I’m not going to risk one of them being left embarrassed because of piss poor planning so we vote with our feet.

Oh and I tried to take my walker across the bridge but it was too narrow and I got stuck.

Kanelbulbulleking I can see what you mean. That looks a tough exhibit to design Disabled Access into. But surely they should have put it nearer the lift or at the very least avoided people having to go outside.

You would be an utter pisstaker if you went ahead with your plan OP.

Sorry I wasn't very clear. It wasn't outside outside. It was outside of the 'public area into the bit that gives the staff access.

You should campaign for shopping centre to provide baby+ toddler+ family toilets
Write to them or use social media

"Disabled toilets aren't for everyone that is disabled."

Do you actually believe people think "I have a disability so I must use the disabled toilet"? That they are using it because they are entitled - a sort of perk of having a disability.

I asked my Dad his recollections of local authority planning in the 70s and 80s (he was a local authority chief architect) when adding accessible facilities for disabled people became a thing..

At the time, they were VERY clear that these facilities were for people with disabilities, they were not for convenience of the able bodied, they were NOT intended to combine baby change facilities at all.

Unfortunately somewhere between the planning authorities and the laws surrounding actually enforcing things happening, all these modern buildings (anything not historic or listed) and newly planned buildings kicked up a RIGHT fuss about having to make extra space.

Acessible toilets for disabled people are a legal requirement for many business places - baby change facilities are not, those are something provided to 'improve your shopping experience'. Even now, if we took away the legal requirement to provide ATFDP... many businesses would immediately stop providing them because in short, the cripple market spends less money than the parent market.

We.. the cripple market, rely heavily on business and organisations being FORCED to accomodate us. We also have no simple or expedient route to get things changed or laws enforced when facilities do not meet regulations.

We also rely heavily on other people not taking the piss, literally in this case.

All the odds are already heavily stacked against us, it'd be nice if folk could be a smidgen more considerate really!

Genuine question
Radar keys sale is no more and you can only get the key because you meet the medical needs.
What would you then do?

Be glad, thay should only be given to people with disabilities or medical needs.
I have one on my key ring, its not mine but dds, we hqd to get it from the council.
I really think in this day and age it should be updated and cheatproof.
Not sure how, as cheats will always find a way to cheat.
Weirdly although i have a key, as i amnot disabled, i would never use it,unless it was for dd.

Where we live it's 20p to use the public toilets or free to use the disabled with a key so people hold the disabled door open for the next non disabled in the queue and go one after the other.
Really can nobody afford 20p?

Weirdly although i have a key, as i amnot disabled, i would never use it,unless it was for dd

Same here. Even when out with my nephew in his pram with no other adults it wouldn’t have crossed my mind too.

Unlike regular public toilets, disabled toilets are often locked and previously they were only available for use on request. The Radar key scheme ensures that people who need to use accessible toilets don't have to ask someone else to open the door for a wee. Carers Trust

@KanelbulleKing I’m sorry that happened to you

i noticed today that the local changing places one, you have to ring a number(where it is sited there are a lot of homeless people) maybe thats the way forward, only people who have registered with the service can use it. that would stop the cheaters(maybe)
and maybe people should stop allowing people with prams in. stop keeping the door open.

Yabvu. I have a 7 years old who is severely autistic but can walk and look normal if not in his disability pushchair.
He's still incontinent so need to be changed so we need more room, he also can't cope with the noise of hand dryers and queuing too long.
We quite often get looks and comments when using the Dissabled toilet even though our key is through the council.
The reason this happens more than it should is because of people who use them when they don't need to especially with there kids.
It doesn't need to be a life long disability as someone else pointed out a short term disability broken leg etc is fine but a double buggy is not.

Some of this is really sad to read, I've never used a disabled toilet but had no idea of the impact it can have if others when able bodied do, my dad is disabled and uses one and I understand the inconvenience as he can't walk unaided and would never get up if he fell so the red cord is invaluable but reading some of this I really don't understand why people would think it's ok to take advantage of something put in place to help those who need it when they don't. I have a 2 and a 3 year old and if we use the toilet I take them in with me and if I have the pushchair I take them out of it first, it's really not a problem and there's no need to use the disabled.

I think that everyone using the disabled/accessible toilets came from ignorance. Just like young children using the disabled/accessible spots on transport.

Some see for example a 5 year old in a buggy and assume the child is lazy. They see this child using the bathroom and think wtf how comes that kid can use it and mine cannot.

Accessible toilets were rebranded btw to help those with hidden disabilities use the facilities. The baby change facilities in there aren’t provided for those without health needs.

All misuse can and should be reported. The 20p places for example staff members alerted and nothing changes local campaign. Either those 20p are needed or not.

One of the easiest ways to find out if the room is doubling up as baby changing for every Tom, Dick and Harry. Is does the room have an emergency call system. All disabled/accessible rooms have to have the system. Regular changing area no need.

If a company are doubling up as standard they are in breech.

Amazing what you find when you google lol.

Again accessible/disabled toilets are the same thing. The name was changed to help those with hidden disabilities feel included. It was supposed to help ensure those with hidden disabilities that they could use them.
You only have to read this thread to see why even a few years later, those with a health need defending their use.

What a world. Those with hidden health needs who these toilets are for, feel guilt anytime they use them. But entitled parents don’t give a shit. How selfish and self involved are some people

The radar system was introduced to allow those who genuinely need the space, easier access.
Imagine everytime you went to the toilet and had to get permission. You know some Arsehole will question why you was in there for the past 20+ minutes. Some will want to see evidence because they don’t look like they need access.

Maybe the way forward would be going digital. Of course there will still be fakes, but would be easier to lock out of the system. The app would work long and short term. Have a broken leg for example and get access say for 2 months standard and after that the access is stopped.
Doesn’t even have to be an app could be a card, bracelet etc.

Some people may be able to wait for you to get yourself out of the toilet you're not supposed to be in in the first place, but many can't wait due to the disability they have.

So what happens if there’s two disabled people who need the toilet at the same time?

They have to wait and risk embarrassment. But surely that is no justification for others abusing the facilities?

If there is a disabled person already in there, then the next disabled person has to wait.. yes..

There are far fewer people with disablities than there are parents with small children.

The odds of having to wait for another disabled person are very low.

I think I have had to do so perhaps 4 times in my LIFE...

It is rarely ever an issue, but even if it was, how does it follow that adding in those using it for convenience rather than disability, is then ok?

In my city they dont have 'disabled' toilets, they have accessable toilets. Those in the city centre are monitored via a camera and intercom,if you don't have a radar key you go to the door, press the buzzer, the person in the control room looks on the camera to make sure you need that toilet, ie have a pram, need changing facilities etc and buzzes you in or directs you to the standard toilets near by.

This really works because there is always at least 2 people monitoring the city centre cameras anyway, a friend of mine did it as a job for a while and very few people try to take the piss with the toilets because of the way its run. Over 3 shopping centres and the high street there are 8 of these toilets within a few minutes of each other.