...to buy radar key online to use disabled loo?

[Marigo]

I’m not disabled and neither are any of my children, however I’m often out with my 3 under 2.5 and in our local shopping centre loos there’s no toilet in the baby change. The ladies is impossible with double buggy plus buddy board and the disabled requires a radar key. Same for the loos in the two big department stores so I just can’t go out into town unless it’s the weekend and my husband can come in case I need a wee! I’m struggling to leave the house for this stress but my mom is disabled and I know how shit it is when she can’t use the large cubicle she needs. I’m really conflicted about what to do.

*non existent

I'm also wondering why you are even there...people ask you if they can go to the front if desperate and you ask them in a jovial manner to show you their cards and you ask "should you let obvious chancers in front of wheelchair users.... honestly, you portray yourself as the toilet police. Open the toilet and Walk away.

@IndieTara

Possibly not, but disabled people should not be forced to deal with the consequences of the OPs poor planning for outings and having more children than she can handle at once on a trip out.

Ok, I'm sorry about the last post. I shouldn't have said that at all. I am so wound up about the spectacular ignorance. But I do apologise for the last post I made. I will just toddle off the thread now, I should know better then to go near threads about disabilities.

I really am not a fan of disabled toilets being used for convenience etc but how does anyone expect the OP to go to the toilet with 3 children under 2.5 without using it? Genuine question.
Is She is not meant to go out?
What about taking the older child to the toilet should she just leave her 2 babies on their own?

@Getmyfrownupsidedown

Well imagine having that feeling of being vilified on a daily basis and seeing threads like this regularly showing that many members of the general public don't give a shit about the needs of disabled people.
Imagine being constantly asked to prove what is wrong with you to total strangers.
The systems in place for disabled people to fight for get support are degrading enough without random staff guarding keys and asking totally inappropriate/discriminatory questions.

You've taken it upon yourself to police disabled facilities despite being expressly advised to give the key to whoever asks. Sounds like self importance to me. But what do I know? I'm just a person who faces disablism and limited accesible facilities every single day.

I'll refrain from thanking you for the judgements you've placed on people whom you know nothing about.

I really am not a fan of disabled toilets being used for convenience etc but how does anyone expect the OP to go to the toilet with 3 children under 2.5 without using it? Genuine question. Is She is not meant to go out?

Do you not think disabled people have faced such dilemmas? Due to the scarcity of disabled facilities this is something disabled people have to worry about every day. Try having an older disabled child who needs to be changed. This isn't a problem for disabled people to solve really, is it?
This is exactly like the buggies in the wheelchair space on buses debate. The space wouldn't even be there if disabled people hadn't campaigned for it, yet parents increasingly feel entitled to claim it as their own. And respond with outrage when you point out they should mount their own campaign if they feel that seriously about the issue. Parents could do the same thing in regards to toilets you know, if they really wanted to. They could campaign for more family type spaces, and for places to stop having the only baby change facilities in the disabled toilet.
But hey, why do all that work when you can just help yourself to the disabled facilities?

Typed out a big reply in response, but deleted it as no matter what I say I will only be vilified further and I've cried enough over these comments. I am the complete opposite of a self-important jobsworth who is only out for their own satisfaction.

Well plenty of disabled people have gotten upset and cried after they've suffered the indignity of being questioned by people who have appointed themselves the toilet police, so maybe you've learned a little something about that and why people have reacted so strongly on this thread.
As for your last sentence, well that's exactly how you came across, because you essentially made up your own rule for the disabled toilet. Because that's exactly how you were behaving, you wanted people to satisfy your own standard of being disabled.

Would love to know how you’d assess my 23 year old autistic child with EDS and Crohns. Not in a chair,
Yet.

Yes parents could campaign for better accessible toilets for their needs. In sure that some are. But companies are likely to just say well, the disabled toilet would work for that, use that. Hence disabled toilets and changing areas doubling up in a lot of places, they don't want the extra cost.

And if parents did campaign for accessible toilets and they had a pram /baby sign on, and the disabled toilet was in use and another disabled person needed a wee, are they allowed to use the "parent" toilet if it isn't labelled for their use and they didn't actively campaign for its existence? Of course they bloody are, if you need the toilet and there's only one toilet you can possibly use, why on earth can't you use it just because you don't tick a specific box.

A toilet exists that the op could use, she cannot use the other toilets there, why is her choice limited to "stay at home or go somewhere else" when that wouldn't be acceptable to say to a disabled person.

A toilet exists that the op could use, she cannot use the other toilets there, why is her choice limited to "stay at home or go somewhere else" when that wouldn't be acceptable to say to a disabled person.

How many parents are there, do you think, who would use an accessible toilet if everyone took your attitude? How many of these toilets are there do you think?

What you are arguing for will mean that people with disabilities, for whom these toilets exist, will be forced to stay at home. A parent with young children isn't going to be restricted forever. It will be a few years at most where they have to try and figure this problem out but a person with the disability will have it, possibly, for life.

Why can't you leave the buggy outside a regular cubicle whilst you go to the toilet in the ladies? Take the toddler in with you if they can't be strapped in. As for nappy changing, I often do this in the boot of my car or if the weather is fine out in the park. It's also possible to change them in the pram if it lies flat. There are definitely options that don't involve using a disabled toilet.

Perhaps find a cafe/restaurant/family friendly pub with a decent sized loo and changing area where you can plan to have a cup of tea and toilet break if you don't like the alternatives.

Just to be clear, does that also include allowing staff (that have openly said they 'can't be bothered waiting in the regular queue) the RADAR key too

If they are staff, why are there not staff facilities? Presumably they need to get back to work, so need to use a loo asap. I wouldn't let them push in front to use the disabled loo, but I would facilitate them being able to push in at the front of the queue for the normal loos.

ChemicalElephant you are absoultely right even if parents did campaign for more family / buggy friendly toilets the chances are they'd re-label the existing disabled facilities rather than build new facilities for the handful of parents with 3 tiny kids and a double buggy.

Trans - people are campaigning for loos and look how that's going another loo is being re-labelled rather than more being built.

I certainly don't approve of toilet police asking why people need to use the disabled loo. How embarrassing for people to discuss their health issues with anybody. It's 100x worse than the GP receptionist, at least they are expected to keep confidence.

What’s needed are toilets locked by a different radar key for parents with small children only. You get given one by your midwife then hand it in when your youngest reaches 5. It’s not for disabled people as they didn’t campaign for it.

@chemicalelephant

when that wouldn't be acceptable to say to a disabled person.

Maybe because having children is a choice not a disability? It's not up to disabled people to sort out the logistical issues that come with having multiple kids in quick succession...

if you need the toilet and there's only one toilet you can possibly use, why on earth can't you use it just because you don't tick a specific box.

Think you'll find that disability is a protected characteristic whereas parenthood isn't. Segregated spaces exist for a reason and ticking the box that entitles you to utilise them is pretty important actually.

@blackbear19

Trans - people are campaigning for loos and look how that's going another loo is being re-labelled rather than more being built

Most of the campaigning is actually for men to access women's spaces, hence they are being overtaken and re-labelled.

It's not for able bodied people to parachute in and co-opt disabled spaces for themselves.

It's not for able bodied people to parachute in and co-opt disabled spaces for themselves

Absolutely - although it should be acceptable if any able-bodied person for a temporary reason becomes non-abled bodied to use a disabled space. Something which I have been told before on MN is totally unreasonable.

@JacquesHammer

although it should be acceptable if any able-bodied person for a temporary reason becomes non-abled bodied to use a disabled space. Something which I have been told before on MN is totally unreasonable.

Hell, I wish my disability was temporary!
But, yes, a disability is a disability no matter the cause or how long it lasts.

Having said that, there's even priority among the disabled themselves. Mines is purely mobility related (occasional cognitive difficulties). I'm less in need than someone with Chrons or similar, sensory issues as described earlier, or someone who's needs are more complex and they have a carer etc.

If disabled people understand this, why don't many of the able bodied!? Baffling...

Hell, I wish my disability was temporary!

Of course I absolutely get that - and absolutely wasn't what I meant.

In my case I was in a full-leg cast and on occasion simply couldn't access the ladies loo. When I was out and on occasions I could of course I used the ladies, but on a handful of occasions I just couldn't physically do it.

Oh, do it OP. Some of these responses are dramatic. I have used disabled toilets when I have a pram with me many many times, and I have never once walked out of one to find somebody waiting.

It’s strange the amount of people who admit to abusing the facilities designed for disabled people never see anyone waiting yet the majority of disabled people or their carers have reported about needing to wait and the distress that has caused.