To think the carotid artery is not a porn prop.

[SmileEachDay]

This from Twitter today.

link to the Tweet

I am sure the women who have been hurt and killed during choking and other “rough sex” activities trusted their partners too, and didn’t expect that outcome. It should automatically be off the table as a defence or excuse. And a large to the handmaidens on here who think it’s oh so edgy.

This is up there with one of the most disturbing things I’ve seen on Mumsnet.

@PBo83 completely agree on the porn thing.

I’ll said it yet again, kinks are not ‘normal’ and shouldn’t be reflected in Average Joe porn as people might try it without gaining full consent, at which point it becomes ASSAULT and not a kink.
However, the same goes for any sexual practice (even vanilla) that someone decides to try without asking first, the fact that it’s choking is immaterial as the same could be said of feather tickling.

Choking is just in a different league to me. I'm a speech therapist, the throat is my area IYSWIM. You just dont fuck with that shit because you are risking death or some particularly unpleasant and intractable forms of disability. I'll say quite freely that I think anyone, male or female, who requests this for sexual pleasure is doing something particularly dumb. Not sexily dangerous, just a really stupid and unthinking thing to do.

There is also a feminist issue because if you were with a partner who turned out not to be quite as trustworthy as you thought, or not quite as sober as you thought, and if they dont stop soon enough, a woman is less likely to be able to break free from a chokehold because 90% of women are weaker than 90% of men.

"It's not common but I dated a girl who loved being choked during sex (I'd not heard of it before!). I certainly wouldn't do it/suggest it unless she'd told me though."
So how the heck do girls get to find out they enjoy being choked during sex? Someone must have done it to them in the first instance and why would that person even think to do such a thing?

In another note, Is there a scientific reason why it would be enjoyed?

@SmileEachDay

To be honest, I'm only into a very few BDSM things, I mean like 3. Generally I prefer love making to violent fucking!

But yes when those instances pop up, it has to be based on trust and safety.

And I agree that the "wholesale normalisation of potentially dangerous sexual activity" is bad when it becomes the standard. I am 100% with you on that. I mean, I haven't even considered where my partner got his ideas from. What if is ideas have come from porn. In which case in a sense I'm a victim (wrong word to use, I can't think of a better one) of that expected standard.

And no I wouldn't dismiss any women who end up as victims of these sexual practices as being liable for it because they were on drugs or abusive partners. It can happen in seemingly healthy relationships, one day the man wants to try something new, thinks the female will like it because "porn says so" and bam, an injury occurs.

As a mother to an 8 year old son, my concern definitely is what porn's message is going to be in 10 years. If its changed so much over the past 20, what is it going to be "teaching" him is acceptable to do to women. And thats something I've got to work out how to manage. Teach him to respect women.

I left my ex-husband because there was no trust or mutuality, he had kinks that he decided he didn't need consent for. So I've been on both sides of the coin I guess?

@shwingshwing

I agree, I've not personally insulted anyone and have actually agreed with a lot of what's been said. I've never 'boasted' about having experimented just used if for context. I've even said that I am, by and large, 'vanilla' in my tastes.

I don't understand why these things can't be discussed without one party taking the moral high-ground. It's horses for courses surely and, maybe if we were all more open to discussing sex, then we wouldn't have such an issue with young people getting their sex education through porn.

I had this discussion with a (male) friend of mine a few months ago, actually. He said, 'A man who needs to dominate a woman is a WEAK man.'

Damn fucking right.

I think the tweet is basically saying "If you are into this...try not to kill her"...which seems sensible enough.

You minimiser.

Her blood on your hands for that kind of statement.

Its all over twitter and facebook. Her blood is on their hands too.

Men are killing women doing this and cowardly hiding behind it as an 'excuse' likes there's ever any excuse for killing, or even putting another life at risk.

Every time someone stronger grabs someone round the throat they put a life at risk. It can also do permanent damage thats not immediately apparent. Its also dangerous, if not stronger, but normally its male on female violence.

Normally its all the women that are killed. Too many, every week, by men.

It is worrying, some people like it and do it safely, which for them is fine. But it is concerning how this is becoming very common in hetero couples, especially very very young couples.

Now children are in education until 18 is good quality sex and relationship ed actually carrying on until 18?

It isn’t something I would want done to me, and personally I would refuse if someone asked me to do this to them.

On a similar note, there is a good article on street harrassment in the guardian opinion area today.

I enjoy being choked during sex, it really does intensify the pleasure. But you should only engage in choking with a partner that you fully trust and always have a safe word just like with any other bdsm activities.

@beautifulmelody

I think you’re rather projecting your feelings towards men in general here.

I don’t have BDSM sex very often at all, or really is mostly vanilla, so I’m afraid your concern for my sex life is really rather misguided.

@PBo83 are you particularly dense or just being obtuse for the sake of it. We don’t want to talk about BDSM relationships between “consenting” adults. We are talking about the effects the normalisation of violent pornography has on our daughters. We are discussing a tweet that suggests the “correct” way to fucking strangle someone.

@beautifulmelody

I agree, if he needs to dominate a woman then he IS a weak man. What if the woman in question likes to be dominated though (I'm talking in a purely sexual way here)?

Many men like to be dominated (it's a big industry), doesn't make the women weak does it?

@shwingshwing , I really don't care how often you have BDSM sex, I just hope that one day you'll shake off the denial and leave your abuser.

@gingersausage well would you rather people just went at it willy-nilly? As the ‘technique’ described in the tweet is safer than just grabbing.

@beautifulmelody my abuser? Oh do fuck off

@PBo83 - so the woman might want it... why would HE want it though? Why would HE ever wish to dominate a woman? I don't know, maybe I'm abnormal here, but if someone wanted, or even begged me to cause them pain or discomfort, I still wouldn't do it. Because I'm not a sick fuck who gets off on hurting others.

Oulidae
You risk permanent harm and death.

All because its more intense? Can you hear yourself?

What can possibly be worth that???

I couldn't feel more intensely stimulated during sex, I don't need to search for other forms (that are dangerous and risky for me).

This is very extreme behaviour and frankly not worth the risk.

How on earth did you ever discover that being throttled was anything other than terrifying and dangerous? Was it by a man, by any chance?

@shwingshwing denial, denial...

SBD1 thank you for that considered response - as the mother of a 7 year old boy, I share those concerns.

It's like saying 'he only slaps me occasionally, but he's totes not abusive, he is lovely most of the time!'

(PSA: orgasms don't make abuse sacrosanct.)

@beautifulmelody you honestly sound hysterical.

Fetishes are considered abnormal psychiatric conditions.

They should never be minimised, or normalised in the way some speak of them.

How does someone get to a state where sensitive intimacy is not enough, where the man has to half kill you for it to be ok?

Nothing is worth this risk.

If a man asked me to do this to him he'd be out the door and the door slammed firmly behind him, and locked. It shows sexual and personality issues.