To think there's a link between climate change denial and Leave voters?

[KennDodd]

Listening to Nigel Farage 'climate scepticism ' on the radio last night and all his fans agreeing with him. I think Nigel Farage has also said the doctors are wrong about smoking. Baffling why anyone would take his view seriously. Anyway, every climate change denier I've heard of is also a Leaver. AIBU to think they're connected?

One of the most vocal Brexiteers I came across in the weeks leading up to the referendum vote was John Hilary, then Executive Director of War on Want. He stepped down from the charity just a week after the referendum vote and became Labour's head of trade policy.

there are no checks when you join MN. No-one knows who people are, what gender they are, if several are the same person. Someone could add up all the remain vs leave posts and get an idea then, but I doubt anyone is that bored.

The only certain stats we have on remain vs leave is from one poll taken in 2016. That correlates vote against location and NOTHING else. All 'stats' of age, income, education etc etc that are peddled on MN (and elsewhere) as absolute fact are just the result of small opinion polls.

We know Nigel Farage's vote position, age, demographic, location etc. Not that of the other 70 million in the UK, or however many are of voting age.

There is statistical evidence to back up the OP's hunch (I haven't read the whole thread so apologies if already posted by someone else equally nerdy).

According to the British Social Attitudes survey (page 19), "those who voted leave are much less likely to be very or extremely worried about climate change (17%) than those who voted for the UK to remain (32%). This partly reflects a more fundamental divide with respect to belief in the existence of climate change. Some 71% of Remain voters think that climate change is definitely happening, compared with just 53% of Leave voters."

Here is the link:
www.bsa.natcen.ac.uk/media/39251/bsa35_climate_change.pdf

I think the problem with this argument is that it treats both issues as black and white (i.e. If you voted leave then you see ZERO value in the EU or if, for example, you are sceptical about climate change you are a 'denier')

I voted to leave but understand that there are benefits to being part of the EU too. I believed that, on balance, leaving would be better (in the long run) for Britain.

I don't deny climate change, there is no doubt that the climate is changing. I am, however, yet to be convinced that the human impact on climate change is a primary factor. I do consider myself 'environmentally aware' (recycle, minimise single-use plastic etc) but more out of concern for our 'living' environment than anything. I also disagree with the actions of many protesters but that doesn't mean I 100% disagree with their concern. As a side note, I'm, personally, not concerned about climate change, the earth will be fine, if humans aren't then so be it.

So, on paper, I guess I'm a climate-change-denying-brexiteer but it really isn't as simple as that is it?

@PBo83 I am, however, yet to be convinced that the human impact on climate change is a primary factor.

Why? There's a plethora of evidence that shows human actions are the primary factor in our current situation (see pp on pg6 for summary).

If you're genuinely not convinced you're either not reading or ignoring the evidence.

There's definitely a correlation. All the climate change deniers I know are Leavers, although not all Leavers I know are climate change deniers.

I voted leave.
I don't like Donald Trump.
I don't like Boris Johnson.
I believe in climate change, but hold the view, that if the US, India and China don't change their ways it really doesn't matter what the rest of us does.

I'm still really surprised at all the people on the first page who are outraged at the suggestion of any connection between climate change deniers and leavers. I mean, really?

UKIP wanted to repeal climate change legislation and the Brexit party have zero policy on climate change.
And we're supposed to think any link is bollocks, bonkers and bullshit?

As a general trend, the Leave vote was more concentrated among those earning less. Perhaps those who are more worried about climate change are on average better off and have the luxury of focusing on this rather than daily money worries. Might be a more charitable way of interpreting any correlation.

I'd also like to see what correlation there is, if any, between taking long haul plane flights and Remain/Leave voters, regardless of whether they believe in climate change or worry about it. Actions speak louder than words.

I’s quite like to see whether there’s any correlation between Leave voting and saying that if you don’t live a pre industrial revolution life you have no right to an opinion on Climate change......

Who's said that Bertrand?

OP, air travel is a huge environmental concern. If Remainers/Leavers do more of it, I think that would be a better correlation to focus on (if you must) than what button someone clicks on in a climate change poll.

Or you could look at veganism.

Or who spends more on household energy per year.

Carbon footprint basically. Wouldn't this be a better indicator of environmental moral soundness?

Carbon footprint basically. Wouldn't this be a better indicator of environmental moral soundness?

Completely agree.

“UKIP wanted to repeal climate change legislation and the Brexit party have zero policy on climate change. “

And where are UKIP now?

As for the Brexit Party, the clue is in the name, they exist due to a singular issue. They will not get near any real power unless Brexit is not delivered and they know this. They are more a lobby group for brexit than a real party. So I wouldn’t expect them to have a manifesto much wider than brexit at this point. Should that ever change, then it would be right and proper to call them out on any lack of climate approach and voters could therefore vote accordingly.

I think any assumed correlation there is merely incidental at this point.

Carbon footprint basically. Wouldn't this be a better indicator of environmental moral soundness?

Disagree (to some extent) The reason is that if you look at the breakdown of an individual's carbon footprint, a great deal of it is out of one's control. Where you get your energy from, whether you as an individual commute to work, national infrastructure, where your food comes from etc. That's not to say that people can't make a difference, but for example, we don't hail the unemployed as green saviours because they don't travel to work.

Not everyone can live within walking distance of their work, or have access to their work via public transport.

Im just shocked that so many people have never even noticed a correlation.
Farage has long denied man made climate change so has Ann Widdecombe, Nigel Lawson, Arron Banks, JRM doesn't think its worth fighting, UKIP doesn't believe in it either.
All the people I know who deny man-made climate change are leave voters.

Presumably people are only just finding out on this thread that many leading Brexiteers deny man-made climate change? They didn't realise that before?

If we can just get this bloody brexit thing sorted once and for all (either way, leave or remain). Then we can have a proper refocus on climate change. As we so desperately need to do. We are just stuck in this stupid political pergatory currently and cannot properly address these vital issues and I personally find that horribly frustrating.

mustard this is just the start. Whatever the outcome of these negotiations, ‘brexit’ is only just getting going and will plague us for many years to come. It’s a big fat Boris myth that you can somehow ‘get it done’ and move onto other things.

It’s not even the “end of the beginning”.

YANBU OP. The DUP who were the most Brexit party in NI are climate change deniers, as well as having a lot of creationists in their midst.

Brexit is not going to be sorted out once and for all - we will need to make new trade agreements, we will need a border solution, these things will occupy our politicians for years and years. We are losing masses of environmental protections and scientific collaborations ...

Its quite sad seeing people who voted for Brexit say they care deeply about the environment - because of them so much time has been lost and will continue to be lost.

Yes, of course it will somewhat dominate our politics for several years whilst we hammer out new trade deals and new arrangements etc... however it will no longer Involve 95% of parliaments time, tied up in the process of either trying to block it or trying to progress it.

Hopefully, we can return to somewhat of an equilibrium once we move past the current stalemate.

well its not going to be sorted once and for all then so we are unlikely to see a refocus on climate change but other than that...yeah.

And quite a lot of the EU laws people are so anxious to escape from are there for environmental purposes.

I just noticed a person on Twitter complaining about something being in 'metres' when 'we use imperial measures in this country'.

A quick look at his Twitter profile showed he was very pro-Leave and pro Brexit party......

@andyoldlabour
I voted leave
I don't like Donald Trump
I don't like Boris Johnson
I believe in climate change, but hold the view, that if the US, India and China don't change their ways it really doesn't matter what the rest of us does

Again....it's very likely that many people voted Leave but also don't like Trump, Johnson and aren't climate change deniers.

But I would be surprised to find people who like Trump, who like Johnson, who are climate change deniers and who would have voted Remain in the referendum. In fact, I would be astonished to find someone who met all 3 of those statements and voted to Remain.

Many people say that it’s China and India who need to clean up their act, not us.

Fine. But where have most UK retailers outsourced their manufacturing to?