To get my 3 year old baptised in an attempt to get into a Catholic school

[nestisflown]

AIBU on two levels:

1. to want to baptise my 3 year old and start attending local mass weekly in order to get into one of the best schools in the area (and our closest school, although the next closest secular school is also an excellent one). Is this morally dubious? Or do lots of parents do the same?

1. to think that my transparent plan will work and help my child get a place even though we'll have been attending mass for less than a year by the time applications are made...and the applications want proof of "sustained weekly attendance". It doesnt define sustained though

My reasons for wanting my child to go to Catholic school are: (1.) It is a great school academically; (2) it's our closest school; (3) it's the only good faith school close to us (there's a CofE school but it's doesn't perform well academically), and as a non-Catholic but practising Christian, I'd quite like to see faith incorporated into my child's school day...even in a different denomination.

Has anyone done this? Has anyone succeeded?

If you have the will, you can do it

Nonsense.

People have walked on the moon, it doesn’t mean that it’s achievable by anyone with ‘the will’

Setting up a school would require time and resources far beyond what an average person trying to pay the bills has available.

The ET movement was set up in the 1970s and still only comprises of 2% of the schools in Ireland.

That’s an enormous success, but change of this scale is slow.

@Pointof0return it really was, I am very grateful to my parents for sending me there.

Our son is at a CofE school and so far we’ve been really pleased. Unfortunately they don’t have chapel as often as we’d like but they do have one to two services a term and they’re taught a little about the basics of Christianity in a fairly non prescriptive way. Overall we find it beneficial to have some element of Christianity at school because we aren’t Christians ourselves and would rather not have to go to the trouble of teaching our children the basics at least.

@DioneTheDiabolist How do you suggest working parents on average incomes go about setting up a free school?

If you talk me through the practicalities I could seriously be up for it.

Some people are committed, as Free schools, ET, faith schools home schoolers and private schools show.

Others cant be arsed.🤷‍♀️

Are you going to answer Point's question Dione.

I'd be really interested in the answer too.

Discrimination is thrown in because it doesn't meet your needs or wants. I see it as a criteria. Words can be twisted to suit your opinion. So if that's how you see it- ok. Why should they change their rules because you dont like their requirements? My son couldnt learn the guitar in school because he couldn't read the notes- should they change the note programme because that's not fair on him. No-because that's how it is. I went to someone and paid 1:1 lessons so that he could learn the guitar.

In my opinion its a way to help/protect faith based families! Why do you want to send your child to a Catholic school if you are not a cathol? You are putting yourself in that situation of be discriminated against. Can you not tackle the non-Catholic schools who need to up there game? Rather than trying to tear into catholic schools.

*I don’t believe in or abide by any of the core doctrine - transubstantiation, the virgin birth, no contraception, anti-abortion etc.

I’d be interested to know how many currently practising catholics believe in all this.*

People often (as here) confuse the different levels of dogma and doctrine in the Catholic Church. The four examples listed above are all of differing levels of authority. But yes, I believe all of them, and so do the majority of my parish who are regularly practising. Fewer with contraception, but of the four of them that's the lowest level of authoritative teaching so it's not surprising it would have the most dissent. You'd be hard pressed to find someone here who would coherently argue against Transubstantiation or the Virgin Birth.

What will you do when you and your kids are expected to take part in religious ceremonies and teaching for the next 7 years of their education - you just gonna fake it?
If you're a non-believer I think you'd find it very uncomfortable.

Can you not tackle the non-Catholic schools who need to up there game?

And how does one parent with no particular connections within education and a full time job do this rainydays?

I've not set up a Free School Point, so I would be unable to talk you through the practicalities, but you don't need me to because information is available on the internet.

I've not set up a Free School Point, so I would be unable to talk you through the practicalities, but you don't need me to because information is available on the internet.

So no

What will you do when you and your kids are expected to take part in religious ceremonies and teaching for the next 7 years of their education - you just gonna fake it?
If you're a non-believer I think you'd find it very uncomfortable.

Many independent schools now offer supported places. I'm a school governor for an independent school and 30% of kids are on full fees support and about 50% have some fees support 20-75% paid.

With all due respect, if you cant be arsed to even google How to set up a Free School, I'm pretty sure you're not going to.

Mine went for a while as no place in the community school.
So much religion.
People were envious as it was very hard to get into the school and over subscribed.
Everything taught was related to the Catholic religion, you couldn't get away with it.
We refused church on Sunday as we are protestant, but the catholics were expected to attend with their parents.
No way would I recommend a Catholic school unless you are devout worshippers and want a Catholic education.
Ask yourself why it's such a good school is it managed by fear?

Gennz I'm not sure most Catholics our ago do, no-one I know has any problems with contraception/abortion/equal marriage. We might be a bit 'iffy' about doing some things for ourselves, e.g. I'm not sure I could have an abortion myself but I think its a good thing that there is the option.
I think when DS is old enough to ask questions about the more mystical stuff I'll say that nobody really knows and explain about allegory etc.

*age

@Gennz18, @Camomila,

I'm also in my 30s. Our parish regularly sends 40 or so people, many of them young adults, to join the March for Life, which indicates a pro-life stance is not uncommon. We have couples to help teach and promote NFP.

Faithfulness to Church teaching amongst practising Catholics is not unusual. There are, it's true, many Catholics who disagree with some aspects of the social teaching. I repeat my point above that very few practising Catholics express serious, reasoned, argument against the core dogmas of the faith.

It varies a lot by race, age, and region. You will get a different picture of what an average practising Catholic is in London than in the north-east (I've worked for the Church in both). However, in every region you will find the majority believe the core dogmas, at least implicitly (not all are well-formed enough to articulate them well).

I meant to add, about the competitive environment - we have known children to move school because they have had additional needs that weren’t being met, they felt, adequately or in other examples, behavioural difficulties that were being punished rather than looked into the causes of, simply because of the nature of the school.

It could just be our school but I suspect that Catholic schools are a good deal more “old fashioned” and while that suits some children, it doesn’t suit all.

Loads of people do it. Your kid has 1 chance at education. Do what you need to do.

It is an outrageous and hypocritical thing to do. You are prepared to lie and swear in a church that you will bring your child up in the catholic faith. I an an atheist but I hope I would respect someone elses religion and bit better than this

Thats fair enough Fink I grew up and live in a very liberal part of the country, and my parents are old hippies so my perception of the 'average' Catholic is probably a bit skewed.

Oh come on, why would you lie in a church and to the school? And if you don’t think the school are wise to all this nonsense you are wrong. We lived near a religious school and applied, our particular school had to accept 20% that didn’t claim to be religious. We happened to get in on the 11th hour but would happily have gone to the other school we got allocated but this school was much closer so we accepted. I made it very clear when applying that we weren’t religious, weren’t married, children weren’t christened but I wanted to be honest about all that. No way, ever, would I lie about being religious. This school also expected you to be attending church for 2 years so less than one year I doubt you’d get in anyway.
So, do it the honest way. You could be taking the place of someone who is genuinely religious and this means something to them. But maybe you’d get over that as it’s all about your child? I personally would have felt awful lying like you are planning.

Sorry I think I went off on one there as I also saw parents doing this at our school and it was annoying!
But anyway, just double check they don’t have to take a certain percentage that aren’t religious but then it goes on distance, you may just be able to get in on distance? We were one road away!

The best state schools should be open to everyone regardless of religious or economic background.

If they were open to everyone, they would not get such good results. They get good results because they manage out anyone who will make their results look bad.

This differs from a private school, where, as a paying customer your child will be nurtured even if they aren't the brightest.