Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Shamima Begum....where do you stand?

999 replies

LeahSMS · 26/09/2019 10:50

What are your thoughts?

AIBU to think she was only a child but unfortunately she’s now considered as a threat so therefore she will never return it’s not only about her safety but the people around her?

Tell me your thoughts

OP posts:
MoonbeamsandPolkaDots · 26/09/2019 23:02

She thought the Manchester Bombings were justified-maybe she could go and live on the same street as some of the victims.

She should stay where she is, if for no other reason than to act as an Awful Warning to others. I would be sad to see her come back.

doubtingmorag · 26/09/2019 23:06

Doubt she’s a threat and even if she is why can’t they bring her back and just keep her in prison? I find the whole thing shocking and disgusting that people are being so racist.

Eh !?

just keep her in prison^

Her whole life !? I repeat....Eh !?

She should be punished in the jurisdiction she committed the crime.

MoonbeamsandPolkaDots · 26/09/2019 23:10

She is the racist one and has taken pretty extreme measures to prove it.

She hates western races and wanted to be part of the force bent on wiping them out and you must have a little want if you think anything else!

couldntcareless · 26/09/2019 23:11

Leave her where she is 👋

Katex888 · 26/09/2019 23:16

How can she be racist when she married a white man?

She wasn’t involved in the Manchester bombings or any other terrorist attack in the UK. Is there proof she was involved in ISIS killings or just a little sex slave for the men?

She was surrounded by ISIS women so she’s not going to admit they are evil, they would kill her. She doesn’t know who to trust... bring her home to find out who was radicalising her and to prevent it happening again.

doubtingmorag · 26/09/2019 23:21

Katex888

perhaps you could put the poor wee flower up for a bit ?

How can she be racist when she married a white man?
Are you drunk ? You're just after telling us that everything that happened was due to her being brainwashed or compelled....apart from the marrying bit which definitely goes to show that she wasn't racist.

MoonbeamsandPolkaDots · 26/09/2019 23:22

She said the Manchester bombing was justified and who knows what she was involved with.

Do you have rock solid proof that she wasn't involved in any atrocity? If not, then I prefer to assume that there was a good chance she was. At the very least she was a cheerleader.

Married to a white man is proof she isn't racist...get a grip! Sex slave my arse, she ran off willingly to marry warriors,

As Islam is defined as a race, so is Christianity and Judaism and this woman hates these races.

Your contorted reasoning to excuse this dangerous woman would be frightening if it wasn't so laughable!

TheSandman · 26/09/2019 23:25

She should return and be dealt with by the British courts if there's a case to answer.

I have some (limited) sympathy for her - she is 19 years old and has lost everything. However, my overriding feeling in the matter is that she is a British citizen and our responsibility to deal with. Why the hell we should get to foist her off onto some other country that has enough of its own problems is beyond me.

Totally agree - I do wonder how she would have been treated by the great British press if she had been blonde, blue-eyed, and they had some pictures of her in swimwear. I'd bet you the story would have had a very different slant.

everythingisginandroses · 26/09/2019 23:25

I was under the impression that it is against international law to leave people stateless. This govt is happy to break all manner of laws, of course.

PickAChew · 26/09/2019 23:26

She was a child by by fuck she'll need some therapy because the results of that grooming will be far more deeply ingrained than even she will be aware of. Assuming her current state of regret is genuine (and I don't doubt that it's possible that it is) she will still be extremely vulnerable to people with the wrong ideas, particularly so because she knows people who can help their own cause.

doubtingmorag · 26/09/2019 23:29

Why the hell we should get to foist her off onto some other country

Is this a general principle, or are you making an exception ?

i.e. if I go to another country, commit atrocities in said country, should I be flown back home to face british justice ?

Theworldisfullofgs · 26/09/2019 23:30

It's pretty clear that lots of people don't understand grooming and manipulation.

And regardless of that, it's still unclear about whether she herself has committed a crime. You might not like what she has done or was part of, and what's the legal viewpoint?

Secondly, this sets a dangerous precent, in that the government can render you stateless because they don't agree with what you do. Imagine if there is a change (or even a continuation of the tilt of this current government) and things become more draconian. Imagine it became commonplace to make people stateless even though they hadn't done anything actionable by law?

I don't like Tommy Robinson. He has certainly committed crimes and it could be argued that he promotes acts that at least vere to violent. Some of things he has said could be argued to incite violence and potentially acts of homegrown terrorism. Why hasn't he been made stateless?

She is pur citizen and whilst we might not like what she had done, she is our responsibility.

doubtingmorag · 26/09/2019 23:30

I was under the impression that it is against international law to leave people stateless. This govt is happy to break all manner of laws, of course.

Do the people of Syria not have the right to see her brought to justice before them ?

SilverChime · 26/09/2019 23:31

She may have been a child when she left, but she’s grown up with a very dangerous ideology and still believes in it as an adult. The key issue is not what happened to her as a child, but who she is now. She’s a danger and a security risk so should not be permitted to return.

doubtingmorag · 26/09/2019 23:32

And regardless of that, it's still unclear about whether she herself has committed a crime. You might not like what she has done or was part of, and what's the legal viewpoint?

It's up to the Syrian authorities.

It's pretty clear that lots of people don't understand grooming and manipulation.

It's pretty clear that most people understand the concepts of responsibility and culpability. You don't. I'm pretty sure Ian Brady had a tough child hood, poor wee soul.

PickAChew · 26/09/2019 23:34

TBH, I'd rub my hands with glee to see Tommy Robinson made stateless. Odious twerp.

InsertFunnyUsername · 26/09/2019 23:36

I really dont think that the actions of ISIS and those associated would be ignored because they are blonde haired blue eyed. Ffs. And there a hundreds of posts wrongly defending it. So is it just the people who dont sympathise that are doing it because shes brown? It might be a shock but most people dont like terrorists of any colour.

MoonbeamsandPolkaDots · 26/09/2019 23:37

She's a member of Islamic State and would be still if it hadn't gone tits up! That's her state, she chose it and anyone who thinks she'd be bleating to return if they were riding high, shouldn't really be let out by themselves.

Calling her a child is just part of the propaganda campaign to make people think she didn't know what she was doing. She's a pretty hairy child!

Let her wander the earth if she has to-that's my ruling!

Cantstopgrazing · 26/09/2019 23:40

I think she deserves everything she gets and should not be allowed back here.

She could never be trusted and as the saying goes: 'She made her bed, so now she needs to lay in it'.

TheSandman · 26/09/2019 23:50

I really dont think that the actions of ISIS and those associated would be ignored because they are blonde haired blue eyed. Ffs. And there a hundreds of posts wrongly defending it. So is it just the people who dont sympathise that are doing it because shes brown? It might be a shock but most people dont like terrorists of any colour.

I don't think they would be ignored. Not for one instant. I deplore terrorism. No sane person thinks that it's a good thing. My point is that, if she had been photogenic, 'white' (whatever that actually means) girl, called 'Tracy Williams', the story the press would have run would have portrayed her as an innocent victim of grooming and brainwashing by ruthless, nasty people - rather than as a willing participant.

Theworldisfullofgs · 26/09/2019 23:53

I have no problem with being punished. I would be happy for her to be punished here if that was decided as the right course of action.

Braying mobs are how we are where we are as a country. Thinking as a government you can manipulate the law is where we are going.

This is about the precedent it sets and I for one am worried about that.

MoonageDaydreamz · 26/09/2019 23:57

It is the right decision to not allow her back in.

The message has to be clear, you join an organisation that commits treasonous acts against this country, you lose your right to be here.

15 is old enough to know what you're doing, James Bulger's killers were convicted of murder at the age of 10.

There is also ample witness evidence that she was actively involved in the persecution of yazidis,she wasn't just cooking and cleaning.

The only thing I believe the government should have done have allowed her baby back into the UK for the grandparents to look after or to be adopted so an innocent baby didn't have to suffer.

For those who say 400 other make jihadists were let back in, well they shouldn't have been, and I don't think they would be now, begum's case was obviously meant to mark a step change in how jihadists are viewed by this country, which will hopefully make others think twice.

TheSandman · 27/09/2019 00:00

@MoonageDaydreamz

15 is old enough to know what you're doing,

Are you in favour of lowering of the age of consent and allowing 15 year old's the vote then?

InsertFunnyUsername · 27/09/2019 00:05

the press would have run would have portrayed her as an innocent victim of grooming and brainwashing by ruthless, nasty people - rather than as a willing participant.

Yes and the same people would have the same response of "Bollox is it grooming when Tracey sought out the videos herself and willingly travelled to join ISIS" The Irish ISIS bride had the same response.

MoonbeamsandPolkaDots · 27/09/2019 00:08

She is over the age of criminal responsibility-so yes, well old enough to know what she is doing.

That's the only age appropriate argument here-anything else is just bollix and muddying the waters for those who don't know their arse from their elbow.