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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To be jealous of men :S

246 replies

HelpImEnvious · 25/09/2019 23:04

I’m so jealous of men.. including DH..

They don’t have as much society pressure to be nice and not be themselves

They don’t have so much biological changes just to become a parent

They don’t have to go through labour or pregnancy or the full time job of breastfeeding.. so their bodies don’t take a physical toll and don’t age

Their Careers and lives don’t take s hit when they deliver a baby

They don’t suffer mum guilt if they decide to pursue their lives.. because to them that’s normal.

To them age is grace and there is no biological clock... very carefree

I resent DH sleeping through the night while I have to get up breastfeed..

I love being a mum, always wanted to be, and want more kids, but It comes at such a huge cost that doesn’t seem to affect him as much.

I find myself snapping a lot because I feel annoyed at the changes I had to my social life and my career and my sleep and my overall life. Even though it was my choice.. because I feel it’s what best for my child. But I can’t help feel resentment :S

OP posts:

Thread gallery

DancingWithDogs · 26/09/2019 18:02

@HelpImEnvious I agree. Breasting. Pregnancy. The sleepless night. When my DH mentions that he's tired I really want to strangle him.

GreytExpectations · 26/09/2019 18:06

Because in this instance, they would be a SAHD.

Nice try but no I'm not a father nor a man. Why do you assume that?

Original poster

HelpImEnvious · 26/09/2019 18:07

When my DH mentions that he's tired I really want to strangle him.

Phew! Voice of reason . Ditto. Trying to figure out why I feel this way.

OP posts:

JasBBGG · 26/09/2019 18:36

@HelpImEnvious my husband told me he was tired when I was in labour... 😡

Original poster

HelpImEnvious · 26/09/2019 19:22

JasBBGG

But it was “team effort” as in laws said while dismissing my existence and making a huge fuss of their son for his hard work on the day of the delivery . Him grinning proudly and telling them how desperate he needs to relax his hands after massaging my back.

And him hailed as the dad of the year by my parents for changing mconium nappy, while my credibility as a parent is put on the line everytime my child has tooth ache and doesn’t sleep the night.

Yup I’m envious. Recognition easily handed to men while women have to work hard to not be scrutinised. And their compromises dismissed. .

OP posts:

DecomposingComposers · 26/09/2019 19:31

So before you had children did you never get tired after work?

Why is there this competitive tiredness? Yes, being a SAHM is tiring. Equally, working full time is tiring. Why are you so adamant that you staying at home is worse than going out to work?

I've worked full time, part time and been a SAHM if 1 child and then 2 children. Working full time was by far the hardest.

GreytExpectations · 26/09/2019 19:47

I'd give up if I were you @DecomposingComposers The OP is only interested in discussions with posters who agree with her and she has found her people. I certainly can't be bothered going around in circles with someone who doesn't understand the meaning of choice and free will.

DecomposingComposers · 26/09/2019 19:59

@GreytExpectations

Yes, I agree. It just really annoys me when people play the victim and blame everyone else for their own choices. What happened to personal responsibility?

GreytExpectations · 26/09/2019 20:08

What happened to personal responsibility?

Why have personal responsibility when you can blame your supportive husband and biology?

MoodyBitch · 26/09/2019 20:13

I'm envious that men can have a quick piss standing up without showing the world their bare arse.

Original poster

HelpImEnvious · 26/09/2019 20:19

MoodyBitch

That too but it’s not high on my list

OP posts:

coatlessinspokane · 26/09/2019 20:33

so who forced you to get pregnant, keep that pregnancy, give birth and breast feed? Certainly not biology.

That's so silly because it's exactly biology which leads to unequal choices in this instance.

IF a woman wants a baby she has to decide whether or not she wants to put her body through a lot of negative changes: give birth, breast feed, potentially put up with incontinence and prolapse.

IF a man wants to have a baby he doesn't have face that decision.

Yes of course, the IF part represents personal choice (although this too is informed by biological urges) however what the OP is saying is that the choices do not come with equal consequences.

It's an intersection of personal choice, biology and society. And the last two are not the same for men and women and in the case of biology never can be.

It's quite easy to understand.

magento · 26/09/2019 22:06

Everyone can stay at home. It costs the same for everyone. We are not well off!! We make sacrifices!

Original poster

HelpImEnvious · 26/09/2019 22:07

coatlessinspokane

Thanks coat! You summed it up well!

OP posts:

FrauHaribo · 26/09/2019 22:18

That's so silly because it's exactly biology which leads to unequal choices in this instance.

but equally there are 2 ways to look at it.
Either you think women are cursed that they have to go through it - and frankly, not all pregnancies are a nightmare, many women really enjoy being pregnant.

I can't say that giving birth was the highlight of my year, but some women are quite happy to go without any pain relief, so it's not that bad for everybody either.

Or, you think that you are lucky to be the one who CAN have children, who will decide when, and with whom they will have them. Your body, your choice. You can even get pregnant with a donor nowadays.

the choices do not come with equal consequences.
no, but for most couples the consequences for the women only are very short term and then the responsibility of the baby becomes absolutely equal between both parents.

Presenting women as permanent victim is unhelpful and untrue.

coatlessinspokane · 26/09/2019 22:40

Either you think women are cursed that they have to go through it
I'm not naive enough to think that evolution has not given us the overwhelming urge to have and look after children. It is the biological imperative of most female mammals on earth. Why else would we all be here if natural selection didn't favour the maternal instinct?

no, but for most couples the consequences for the women only are very short term

Try telling that to my aunt who has suffered immense pain from a vaginal mesh that has eaten into her internal organs, which doctors recommended she have as a consequence of prolapse, which affects women way more than it affects men and is often a result of childbirth.

Presenting women as permanent victim is unhelpful and untrue

Telling the truth is not presenting oneself as a victim. The "victimhood" accusation is a smackdown and has no intellectual value whatsoever.

On the other hand presenting yourself as an all powerful individual in complete charge of your own destiny when you're not is a pathetic coping mechanism offered to us by a Thatcherite neo-liberalism and makes you look like a sheep.

Thanks coat! You summed it up well!

Thank you for starting the thread. It's nice to know that other people think the same.

lovelygreenjumper · 27/09/2019 09:46

@FrauHaribo It sounds like your friends' experiences of being attending parent and child groups as a man is very different from my DHs experience. Clearly he did not attempt to go to breastfeeding groups but he was warmly welcomed at things like baby massage, baby gym, parent and toddler groups, school PTA etc as were a couple of other Dads who went occasionally.

I think the point about 'choice' is that as a pp said, the consequences of choices about family are not the same for women and men. Eg. as a couple we decided we wanted to have children- this meant I had to go through pregnancy and childbirth which for me included illness in pregnancy and the associated time off work. We decided we wanted our DC to be breastfed- the only option for this was for me to do it (yes, DH could get up in the night to feed expressed milk but I needed to spend the time expressing etc and then deal with engorgement etc if I was not feeding in the night). We decided that we wanted our DC to be looked after by one of us (rather than childcare) for the first few years and decided DH would stay at home- yet when I went back to work after 6 months maternity leave I was passed over for a promotion (that it was agreed I was really ready for before I went on leave but I didn't meet the criteria which involved leading a certain number of projects in the 12 months before the application. Promotions were only considered once a year so I had to wait another 12 months before I could (successfully) apply. So by the time I was promoted I was 2 years behind male colleagues, one of whom also had a child a similar age and was constantly asking for my help as he did not have the breadth of industry experience that I had. Even though my DH was at home with the DC the (male) bosses on several occasions that I know about (who knows how many more) agreed not to offer me career enhancing secondments as they felt it I wouldn't want to travel etc with such a young family (although the men they sent actually had younger children than I did). And they told me this proudly, as evidence of how family friendly and thoughtful they were being.

FrauHaribo · 27/09/2019 09:50

elling that to my aunt who has suffered immense pain from a vaginal mesh

I am really sorry for your aunt, truly. Someone with horrendous luck does not define every mother though.

Telling the truth is not presenting oneself as a victim.
no one is denying the truth, but as an all powerful individual in complete charge of your own destiny when you're not you are exagerating everything so much you are not making any sense.
You enjoy showing women as victims. You are wrong.

coatlessinspokane · 27/09/2019 10:40

You enjoy showing women as victims.

Lol. Is that really the best you can do? You know your argument’s crap when you have to resort to such tired old cliched insults.

Someone with horrendous luck does not define every mother though.

I never said it did. I said it happens to more women than men as a result of biology. That’s a fact. Look it up.

Original poster

HelpImEnvious · 28/09/2019 00:09

coatlessinspokane reading your thoughts is so therapeutic.

lovelygreenjumper I think the point about 'choice' is that as a pp said, the consequences of choices about family are not the same for women and men.

Precisely!!

OP posts:

FrauHaribo · 28/09/2019 14:01

coatlessinspokane
it's not a cliche, it's a simple fact. That's what you are writing when you describe women.

It's very sad if you see things that way. You might feel that you are not in charge of your life, of your decisions, of the consequences of being a woman. I feel sorry for you, I am really glad I am a woman.

You call me a sheep because I didn't suffer from my decision to have 4 children with my husband? Again, I feel sorry for you. The obvious difference between you and me is clearly that I am happy. I might be happier if I didn't have to work, true, but I am still very happy with my life.

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