My DD's first boyfriend is transgender and I feel weird about it.

[Milicentbystander72]

I've always been a very liberal minded person. Supported gay rights all my life. My best friend and DN are gay. I support the rights of Trans people to live their life etc.

My dd15 has a nice group of friends (boys and girls). In that group is a Trans teen (Female to Male). He changed his name in Y8, He's totally accepted as Male at school. There are no issues. He looks completely Male and people who don't know him would never think that he'd been born female. He's a nice boy who is well liked. All good.

Except last night my DD told me she's going out with him. I've surprised myself that this has unnerved me.

My dd hasn't had a BF before. She's only ever snogged one boy before at a party. She says she's 100% straight. She says she fancies the cool older boys in Sixth Form. Has teenage celebrity crushes on boys like Tom Holland etc. So how does this work for her?

Last night I told her all was fine and just to be careful they didn't damage a friendship if they broke up etc, but I didn't make a big deal of it.

Would you find this weird if your dc said they were straight? Please be honest. I'm kind of hoping it fizzles out without any drama.

peachgreen

OK, I'll elaborate for the hard of understanding.

I am not anti any individual.

What I am anti is a sexist, homophobic regressive anti-woman ideology which seeks to reinforce outdated damaging sexist stereotypes and relies on deceit and gaslighting to succeed.

Obviously, you appear to be very pro this ideology, peachy. I can't imagine why - are to explain?

They are two biological girls in a relationship, no big deal.
One presents in a way more inkeeping with masculine stereotypes, also no big deal.
Teenage sexualities are often fluid and they do a lot of exploration in that time.

Honestly, I'd call your child's boyfriend by their chosen names/pronouns because that's the polite and reasonable thing to do, but also be aware when you're talking to her about relationships that if she's attracted to the female form then she isn't 100% heterosexual and that's also ok.

It's possible to be polite and supportive in this situation without needing to get into all sorts of cognitive dissonance about male vaginas etc.

Oh! I know this won't be a gay couple but I hope I got understood. They would need to seek help of a 3rd party to have kids is what I meant.
But I am sure this is not one of OP's worries?
They are 15, just treat him like you would any other boy.

Is she happy? That's honestly all I'd worry about.

One presents in a way more inkeeping with masculine stereotypes, also no big deal.

I've seen reference to binders and more in the thread. If that was OP(?) talking about the child in question, then that is starting down a path that could potentially be harmful and a much bigger issue; and one which needs a careful observation, mainly to spot signs of the proven phenomenon of social contagion for her daughter.

I've given up engaging civilly with transphobes on Mumsnet, you all just repeat the same tired bullshit ("define woman! adult human female! my trans friend agrees with me! darvo, darvo!") and dress your bigotry up as concern for girls. There are some gender critical feminists on MN who are genuine and worth havung a discussion with about how trans people and natal women can co-exist with mutual respect and support, but they're significantly outnumbered by the rest of you who hate trans people so much your main priority is repeatedly denying their identy.

"Who wants their DD to date someone who is a proven liar over something so fundamentally important?"

That is such a horrid thing to say. He is not a liar and her daughter knows that he is trans. How is he lying?

Also I'm cackling at the hypocrisy of you saying you're not "anti any individual" and then in your next post calling OP's DD's boyfriend a liar and untrustworthy because of his gender identity.

Well why dont you help us out and tell us what a woman is

No stereotypes.

Put everyone straight and we can see where we went wrong

It's a shame the same isn't being applied to the other girl in the relationship. Everyone in their life seems so sure she's a boy, it will be very difficult for them to change their mind if they decide otherwise in the future. sad

It won't really though. Statistically, the overwhelming majority of "trans" teens move on from it within a year or two, and while it might be slightly embarrassing, people do forget, especially if it is relatively common in schools now and he or she can just come out again as "gender fluid". They will go off to university in a couple of years and go with the identity that feels most natural to them then, whether it is trans or (what is probably STATISTICALLY more likely) as a gay woman.

There's no harm in respecting their wishes to be treated broadly as a boy at this stage, and there is no harm in respecting their wishes to be treated as young man or as a young woman next month, next year or at uni.

What I would be most concerned about for this teen (not the OP's daughter) is the undercurrent of homophobia against gay women that has been frequently observed around teenagers in recent years, meaning that for some, it is easier to "come out" as trans (and kiss girls) than to tell people they're gay (and kiss girls).

I've given up engaging civilly with transphobes on Mumsnet, you all just repeat the same tired bullshit ("define woman! adult human female! my trans friend agrees with me! darvo, darvo!") and dress your bigotry up as concern for girls.

Yes, it is very tiring and any sensible debate is always impossible. They give mumsnet a bad name.

Well why dont you help us out and tell us what a woman is

I call bingo!

peachgreen you are so right. I don't think I had even came into such a conversation on Mumsnet and it is shocking...

This thread is getting derailed.

CassianAndor
I take the view that 15 year olds are still kids who are still vulnerable.
They're saying they're a boy. Maybe they do have dysphoria and will go full transition as an adult having made an informed choice, maybe they won't. There's a lot of videos where people have de-transitioned and if that's the case then this teen will need people around them to support them.
So the purpose of documenting the relationship it's two girls and one presents in a masculine way.

I'm not entirely sure that I can group a 15 year old who is gender non conforming into the same category as the TRA adults who manipulate and that affects my approach. I'm sure others will disagree and that's the beauty of MN, but I think it's by far more likely that this child has no ill-intent than is some gaslighter TRA of the future, so my gut instinct is to treat it as you would any other teen lesbian relationship and be there to talk to DD and answer questions factually when questions inevitably come up.

"Who wants their DD to date someone who is a proven liar over something so fundamentally important?"

That's just mean. Teens are constantly experimenting with things - sex, drugs, boundaries, sexualities, gender identities, subcultures. It's just unpleasant to call them "proven liars" about it.

I used to dress more or less as a vampire, kiss girls and take illegal drugs as a teen. That was part of my identity. I am a non-vampire, straight, normal-dressing, non-drug taking adult woman now. I wasn't lying when I was 18 though! I was just being 18!

@Kione Don't worry. They may be a majority on MN where their bigotry can go unchallenged most of the time (on the echo-chamber of the FWR boards) but they're a minority in real life, especially in the younger generation.

crosspelican not sure what your point is? None of that involved you lying about your sex, did it?

People don't like having harsh realities pointed out. That's no reason not to speak up.

How do you know there are “transphobic” comments if you skipped them?
I read enough. The thread concerns a person. However confused he/she /they might be - a person.

Yeah ok peach, whatever you say.

Now run along, I'm sure some woman somewhere is sitting on a chair in an offensive manner or something. She might even be eating pizza or something equally offensive.

He is a transboy. I would consider that honest and truthful to the OP’s daughter.

What I would be most concerned about for this teen (not the OP's daughter) is the undercurrent of homophobia against gay women that has been frequently observed around teenagers in recent years, meaning that for some, it is easier to "come out" as trans (and kiss girls) than to tell people they're gay (and kiss girls).

Spare us the faux concern. You only have to read threads such as this to realise that if anything transphobia is more common than homophobia so unlikely that it is easier to come out as trans rather than gay.

@BuzzShitbagBobbly well that was incoherent... am I missing something? Are you trying to insinuate that I must hate women (sitting on chairs and eating pizza?) because I'm not a transphobe? That's... a bizarre leap.