If your friend has a skill that could help you, would you expect to pay full price?

[thisusernameismine]

Not sure if this has been talked about before - but in short, a friend of mine (known for many many years but see each other only annually as on opposite sides of the world) has become a life coach in the last couple of years. The friend does talk about it often when we meet and I'm very proud of how she's made a success of a new career.

I'm at the end of mat leave and feeling in a bit of a rut in terms of my career - I feel it's a dead end job and I'd love to completely change what I do for a living but have a big inner critic (this is my main issue and the kind of problem my friend specialises in). I shared this with my friend and asked her if she thought coaching me could work given we know each other so well. I fully expect to pay as it's her business, but my DH is outraged that I'm being charged full price for the exploratory session. The coaching packages are a little extortionate so I'm not sure if I could afford them anyway (mat leave pay!) but possibly could just about pay for the smallest programme.

Just interested in others' opinions as my Dh's is so different from mine. He said if a good friend of his had a skill, they would never charge him as it's only 1-3 hours I'm being offered so in his opinion, hardly damaging for her business. I'm not sure whether to go ahead now

Who charges their friends full prices?

People who are doing the skill to keep a roof over their heads and food on the table?

Exactly what @Kazzyhoward said - my DH has a very niche job/talent and gets asked to do stuff for mates a lot. (He doesn’t do a crap job or act unprofessionally though when he does stuff for friends, that’s the only bit I would disagree with!).

For good friends/family he’ll do it in his spare time (he works long hours full time) and charge them less.

But he wouldn’t be able to do that if he was self employed and didn’t have the steady income from his full time job.

Sometimes he has to say no to friends/family as he simply doesn’t have time and people do get shirty

I think if you’re happy to pay for this service, you should find someone impartial and closer to home.

I think what Kazzyhoward is saying is right- I do stuff relating to work for free for my friends in my spare time, it's not my main income. I have edited work, looked over CVs, given opinions on publications, job applications, I do this for friends' children if they are nice and if they would help me out in other ways (e.g. I have a friend always brings over home-cooked food, I help her son with university applications).

It's different if it were my main job and people were trying to get out of paying. I also have friends who offer mates rates for plumbing/electrical work, but they would do it as and when they could, and prioritize other work most of the time.

I would only expect life coaches to work with friends when starting off and having to do so many hours for accreditation and in that case it should be free. Anything else is unprofessional. I am a mediator so can't work with friends in any case as it would be a conflict of interest, I have given many free hours of advice about process/procedure/range of normal to people I know and like for a couple of glasses of wine 😊 When working I expect to be paid.

Mates rates in Ireland anyway. Not sure about internationally.

I would expect to pay full price, and would say so when asking friend for help.
My cousin is a driving instructor, if he's still teaching when DD gets to 17, I will ask him to teach her (if he was willing) and inform him I'd be paying full price for lessons

I think the point about the difference between barter and gift is a good one. A tradesman who helps someone out in a practical way, in the expectation that the person will return the favour at some future date, is one thing. There is an exchange that is roughly equivalent in there. That is totally different from a one-way traffic, where the favours run in one direction only. If there is something you can do that would be of equivalent time/value to her, then you could propose the exchange - otherwise paying is really only fair. However, I do think that she could possibly offer you a bit of a discount on her usual rates!

I know one occasion where I was working for a solicitor and he recommended a junior barrister who needed experience and who charged me £50(!!!!!?????) to represent me in court at a hearing that wouldn't have required a barrister at all. A solicitor would have cost 4 times that at least! I felt pretty cool with my barrister though. Even though the defendent (my now ex) didn't show up. So I could have done it on me own lol.

I run a small craft business and sell on line. I do a 10% friends and family discount but that's all. At the end of it all I have to buy my materials up front so if I've used those materials making things for friends at cost price I have no money in the pot to buy the next round ready for full paying customers. And that's without adding a little for my time and skills. I'm not in business to break even - I need a profit to grow my business and pay my bills. So 10% is doable - cost price only is unrealistic.

But I do agree not to do what is, in effect, a counselling session with friends. There may be things that are holding you back that you don't want a friend (however discreet) to know about or judge you on. When you use an independent coach or counsellor or psychiatrist for that sort of 'help me look at my life and sort out any issues', you can walk away knowing they're not on the edge of your life watching to see if you're using the things they taught you. I'd pay full price and find someone who you can walk away from without looking back if you become uncomfortable.

Personally I wouldn't charge a friend for a coaching session but I would expect them to return the favour by promoting my business (as long as they were honest in their reviews). But given your friend is not local that would be of limited value to her.

If you do this; or if anyone does this, you have to declare in the review that it was provided for free or you'll do more harm than good if it's discovered.

I think if she had offered you coaching for free/discount, that would be great, but if you are asking her to do it for you, you should definitely expect to pay the standard rate.

It is difficult. I can see your husband's objection and to be honest where I've helped out friends with their financial reporting / company filings etc I've not charged them for it as it doesn't feel right but it has only been little jobs rather than complex work and it is usually reciprocal. E.g. one of the friends I help out is an architect and I am expecting to need to pick his brain on the redesign of a property next year so I'm obviously not to going kick up a fuss about the work I'm helping him with now. I guess if there isn't anything you can help her with in future I can see why she would charge full price but at the same time I might have expected "mates rates" given that she would be making the same profit from you as she would from anyone else and you are only considering using her over one of her competitors due to your long standing friendship. Hard one. If you want to use her though and think it is a better price than her competitors then go for it.

A good friend would be happy to pay the going rate.

Haven’t RTWT but as a freelancer this is a common point of contention amongst the self-employed - ‘friends’ blithely expecting your time and skills for free or at a ridiculous rate. If she offers then lovely, but that would be an act of generosity on her part, not something you should feel entitled to expect.

I've been in this position (as the service provider) and I would say you should offer to pay full price, and it's up to your friend whether or not she gives you a discount.
If she's just starting up her business and is using valuable time to help you, then I wouldn't blame her for charging full price.
If she had a good working concern going for her already, then she might be in a better position to offer you a discount.

But it's up to HER, not you (or your DH).

If anyone decides that they're not going to pay full price AFTER they receive the correct service then they'd be gone as a friend, as they're clearly just fucking chancers. If they had poor service - different story. But full service as advertised but you "just don't think you should pay full price" then fuck off.

Your friend will have laid out a lot of money to get her training. She is now trying to start up a business and your DP wants to do her out of money? nah.

BUT I also agree that life coaching a friend could be difficult because you already have a relationship at one level. I have trained in similar, but only used friends for case studies, and that was hard enough - they don't take it seriously, they presume on too much and don't enter into the process properly and it's not ideal. Plus your own background knowledge of the friend affects how you relate to their issues because you add your own feelings and opinions into the situation, however hard you try not to.

So I agree with the PPs who suggested not using her at all, for that reason.

I'd expect full price or mates rates if there was a skill exchange. It's how she eats!
DH and I both have had piss taking friends before

I also think you should pay the full amount. If she then decides to give you a small discount that's up to her.
It is totally unrealistic to expect someone to provide coaching services for free (or even at a significantly reduced rate) to friends. Imagine if every friend wanted to use the service. It would take up a whole load of time where you could be earning money.
I am self-employed. There are only a certain number of hours in the week where I can earn money to put a roof over my head and food on the table. I need to "sell" those hours to get money. I cannot afford to fill up this time with a lot of people at a reduced rate or free of charge.
Part of my self-employment is as a professional musician. It is unbelievable how many "friends" phone up wanting me to perform at their event for free. These range from people I have met once to good friends but I simply can't afford to perform for these people for free as it means I can't book in paying customers at the same time.
I would and have performed for free for family members and that's it.

I wouldn't charge you if I was your close friend. If I wanted this type of service I wouldn't go to a friend who did it, I'd pay an alternative professional.

I work as a freelance translator. I wouldn't have a problem with working for friends or family and would even do so on a "mate's rates" basis, but it's surprising just how many people expect to get this kind of service for free!

Your DH is a CF.

I would pay for the skill BUT there's no way that I'd use the friend for this. Ask her to recommend somebody sure, but she's your friend, keep the dynamic as friendship. Life coaching is just a bit too personal for a 'paid friend'.

What coffeeforone has said actually, reading back through the thread now.

I have a skill that is always in demand with 'friends'. If I did it for free for everyone who smilingly asks me if I 'could just...' I'd be on the streets. I do a small mates' rates discount, but it is small, because it's my livelihood. If you want life coaching, you might be better off with someone who you don't know personally. But you could ask her to recommend someone.

Sure, it does depend on the friend obviously but if it's a very good friend then I'll always do it free or charge less.
I've often done my friends feet, removed corns, done nails after an operation etc.
People do sometimes take the piss though, a very casual aquaintance was always turning up at the house at random times of the day or night wanting help with her diabetic feet - I'm talking 11 o clock at night when I'm in PJs - and I had to tell her that I don't give freebies and I don't want to be disturbed outside of working hours.